Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 09:13     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).

I was told that, too, starting in MS, and bought the line. It was a joke on us. My kids are now in HS. Not BCC cluster.

Agree with a PP, the "honors" distinction is purely a way to inflate the GPA and not make some kids feel bad for not being in "honors". When MCPS really did have that distinction, some people didn't like the class makeup of "regular" classes. So, they did away with regular classes and slapped the label "honors" to make the demographics of the class look better, as if somehow that would magically close the achievement gap.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 09:08     Subject: Re:Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has done away with any meaningful distinctions between honors and on-level courses. If your school offers only honors-level Bio, it's pretty much a regular bio class with honors being in name only.

I assume schools that offer both on-level and honors versions of the same class have some differences, but I've never been able to get a clear articulation of what those differences are from educators or counselors.


I get that you have gripes but this is simply untrue.


It is, in fact, true. Starting with next year's 9th graders, there will be only Honors or AP. So your choices are Honors ESOL, Honors Special Ed, or regular Honors. Regular Honors sweeps up every kid who is not in ESOL or receiving special education services.

Yes, it's a farce. I'm not someone who has complained much about MCPS, but pretending that kids (and teachers) wouldn't benefit from differentiation at that age is just Orwellian. I absolutely understand the concerns about equity, but if that's the issue then keep true Honors classes but remove the gatekeeping measures. Let every kid sign up and sink or swim. But just getting rid of on-level and forcing everyone into an undifferentiated mass is bad for absolutely everyone.


Does it really matter? It's not like colleges even use the MCPS GPA. They'll assign the faux honors classes to a scale of 4 anyway. You might find another hobby and focus on something that matters.


Shockingly, some of us want our kids to learn something in high school. It's not about the GPA. It's about the content.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 09:07     Subject: Re:Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has done away with any meaningful distinctions between honors and on-level courses. If your school offers only honors-level Bio, it's pretty much a regular bio class with honors being in name only.

I assume schools that offer both on-level and honors versions of the same class have some differences, but I've never been able to get a clear articulation of what those differences are from educators or counselors.


I get that you have gripes but this is simply untrue.


It is, in fact, true. Starting with next year's 9th graders, there will be only Honors or AP. So your choices are Honors ESOL, Honors Special Ed, or regular Honors. Regular Honors sweeps up every kid who is not in ESOL or receiving special education services.

Yes, it's a farce. I'm not someone who has complained much about MCPS, but pretending that kids (and teachers) wouldn't benefit from differentiation at that age is just Orwellian. I absolutely understand the concerns about equity, but if that's the issue then keep true Honors classes but remove the gatekeeping measures. Let every kid sign up and sink or swim. But just getting rid of on-level and forcing everyone into an undifferentiated mass is bad for absolutely everyone.


+10000. The way they are doing it is not equity. Removing gate keeping to classes, that’s equity. Providing needed supports and feedback, that’s equity. Encouraging all students to work hard, and binging those students showing the potential to succeed in more rigorous coursework, regardless of background, that’s equity. Throwing in occasionally some harder work in the on level class to see if kids step up or do well and then determining if you can elevate the level of class in certain areas or should suggest some kids move up during the next semester, that’s equity. This is just craziness run amock.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 09:02     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).


LOL! That doesn’t work at ALL when the teacher has over a hundred students (over the various classes).

It’s horrible. And it doesn’t help Black and Brown students. Also doesn’t help close the Achievement Gap.

Misguided and useless policy that will just chase more middle class families away from MCPS.


It makes zero sense and is unfair to the honors kids who get harder exams/quizzes or less time but yet don’t get the full experience of an honors class.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 08:53     Subject: Re:Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has done away with any meaningful distinctions between honors and on-level courses. If your school offers only honors-level Bio, it's pretty much a regular bio class with honors being in name only.

I assume schools that offer both on-level and honors versions of the same class have some differences, but I've never been able to get a clear articulation of what those differences are from educators or counselors.


I get that you have gripes but this is simply untrue.


It is, in fact, true. Starting with next year's 9th graders, there will be only Honors or AP. So your choices are Honors ESOL, Honors Special Ed, or regular Honors. Regular Honors sweeps up every kid who is not in ESOL or receiving special education services.

Yes, it's a farce. I'm not someone who has complained much about MCPS, but pretending that kids (and teachers) wouldn't benefit from differentiation at that age is just Orwellian. I absolutely understand the concerns about equity, but if that's the issue then keep true Honors classes but remove the gatekeeping measures. Let every kid sign up and sink or swim. But just getting rid of on-level and forcing everyone into an undifferentiated mass is bad for absolutely everyone.


Does it really matter? It's not like colleges even use the MCPS GPA. They'll assign the faux honors classes to a scale of 4 anyway. You might find another hobby and focus on something that matters.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 08:52     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
They need to add a 4th level of rigor like regular, Pre-Honors, Honors and AP so kids have even more choices!
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 08:46     Subject: Re:Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has done away with any meaningful distinctions between honors and on-level courses. If your school offers only honors-level Bio, it's pretty much a regular bio class with honors being in name only.

I assume schools that offer both on-level and honors versions of the same class have some differences, but I've never been able to get a clear articulation of what those differences are from educators or counselors.


I get that you have gripes but this is simply untrue.


It is, in fact, true. Starting with next year's 9th graders, there will be only Honors or AP. So your choices are Honors ESOL, Honors Special Ed, or regular Honors. Regular Honors sweeps up every kid who is not in ESOL or receiving special education services.

Yes, it's a farce. I'm not someone who has complained much about MCPS, but pretending that kids (and teachers) wouldn't benefit from differentiation at that age is just Orwellian. I absolutely understand the concerns about equity, but if that's the issue then keep true Honors classes but remove the gatekeeping measures. Let every kid sign up and sink or swim. But just getting rid of on-level and forcing everyone into an undifferentiated mass is bad for absolutely everyone.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 07:58     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).


LOL! That doesn’t work at ALL when the teacher has over a hundred students (over the various classes).

It’s horrible. And it doesn’t help Black and Brown students. Also doesn’t help close the Achievement Gap.

Misguided and useless policy that will just chase more middle class families away from MCPS.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 07:17     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Np, what about AP biology? Does a student need to take honors/regular biology first or can they take it instead of honors/regular?


Technically yes but they'll wave the requirement in many cases.


I would strongly recommend taking a HS bio course before AP. It’s a lot of content and your student will really benefit from some grounding in it first.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2023 00:35     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).


This occurs not just at BCC. It was poorly explained to us before it happened. We thought it was only for the first 1-2 wks and then the students decided whether they wanted to be in honors or non honors and moved to the appropriate class. Nope it was a mixed class. Honors students frustrated all year.
Anonymous
Post 01/23/2023 22:27     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).


Oh, that is SO frustrating. It didn’t work in MS Advanced English and it won’t work for Bio. Sorry to hear that.
Anonymous
Post 01/23/2023 20:01     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).


What a joke. Honors kids should be getting more advanced content as well as harder tests.

I'll bet you this is just a transition - within two years, they'll be at honors for all in sciences at BCC.


Honors classes were always just a way to make the less intelligent kids feel better. Regular and AP is sufficient.
Anonymous
Post 01/23/2023 18:49     Subject: Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:We were told at a meeting for incoming B-CC parents last week that honors and non-honors students are in class together and the difference is that honors students have harder tests (not just for biology, but for other subjects, too).


What a joke. Honors kids should be getting more advanced content as well as harder tests.

I'll bet you this is just a transition - within two years, they'll be at honors for all in sciences at BCC.
Anonymous
Post 01/23/2023 17:50     Subject: Re:Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has done away with any meaningful distinctions between honors and on-level courses. If your school offers only honors-level Bio, it's pretty much a regular bio class with honors being in name only.

I assume schools that offer both on-level and honors versions of the same class have some differences, but I've never been able to get a clear articulation of what those differences are from educators or counselors.


I get that you have gripes but this is simply untrue.


What is untrue?
Anonymous
Post 01/23/2023 15:18     Subject: Re:Bio & Honors Bio and schools with only Honors Bio
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has done away with any meaningful distinctions between honors and on-level courses. If your school offers only honors-level Bio, it's pretty much a regular bio class with honors being in name only.

I assume schools that offer both on-level and honors versions of the same class have some differences, but I've never been able to get a clear articulation of what those differences are from educators or counselors.


+1. Soon all subjects (unless it is remedial) will be honors for all. Take the BCC example (this happens in other highschools too). You have these mixed classrooms where honors kids are not doing meaningfully harder work, but, they are getting the GPA boost. Teachers recognize that it isn't really fair to the "non-honors" kids (who also are more likely to be brown). What I don't understand is why MCPS parents continue to accept these mixed level classrooms. These mixed level classrooms and the extreme grade inflation are the main reason we moved to private for HS.


Why don't we just do away with honors as a concept all together if this is how it's going to be?

Then you just have regular classes and AP classes? I really don't understand how we got to this place but since we're here, it's insane to do things the way that we are.


How could they inflate the GPAs by offering a 5 for a grade level class? People might start to realize that a 4.0 is about a B.


Does the MCPS GPA mean anything anyway since colleges ignore it and calculate their own values?


No the MCPS GPA where they give honors classes a 5 only matters to MCPS. Colleges will weight this differently than APs or regular classes.