Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 21:09     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
This is very tangent but game design is very related to motivation and something like ADHD. It's not the same wow factor of designing Contra or Mike Tyson's punch out, but the idea of rewarding the brain for doing something is a key thing that motivates a lot of us. I'd say that you could also take a step back and say that games are also a very useful tool in teaching.

I wanted to do game design and still kinda do, but never could get the connections. But I think I was broad enough with my major that I didn't make it an all or nothing choice. Now my job isn't game design but I do like to make games at work, if that makes sense
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 20:37     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
Fwiw, GMU has an "Applied Computer Science" degree in Video Game Design. It's part of the options for a BS in comsci.

I asked a professor at an open house about it once. She said, "no one gets that degree. They all get a BS in comsci and then minor in game design (via the fine arts program)."

That made sense to me. Get the full, true ComSci degree and add on some electives in the design side. Gives you options.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 20:25     Subject: Re:Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Lots of kids want to game design. It’s a miserable job — the hours are looooong. It’s a huge industry, though, and the programming skills are useful in lots of area. I’d be fine with my kid studying this sub field of computer science



DC works for Bethesda Software/ Microsoft snd normal 9-6 hours with occasional overtime .


Does he have benefits? And he's been able to keep this job for five years? I'm just asking because I read the book "Press Reset" and I'm just starting to read "Blood, Sweat and Pixels." This industry, according to those books, and to a couple of people I've talked to is B-R-U-T-A-L. Mostly contractor positions, jobs/businesses that close shop overnight or over a few days, may not get paid for the last few weeks before they close shop. Nearly impossible to buy a home because you end up moving when the business/game goes belly up. No one lasts past 35 yrs old in the industry.

I would love to hear more from the PP. I'm not saying these things I posted are in fact the complete situation everywhere -- it's just what was depicted in "Press Reset." My kid is also hell bent on this as a career. I am trying to learn more about it. My kid NEEDS to be in a job that has medical AND dental benefits. He has some health issues and will be getting dental implants at age 19-ish. So, he will need to have insurance coverage for life.

I feel like every 15 yr old thinks they want to be a video game designer (like in the past kids wanted to be "professional basketball or football players" -- but not everyone is going to be that). I am coming to terms with my son working in the industry (even though I don't feel like it is a "solid job").... so long as he gets a COMSCI degree first --- NOT a BFA in Video Game Design. I'm not down for paying $120k for a BFA in game design. I'll pay that for a comsci degree -- that he can use in any field that supports him. But, a BFA seems too limiting.

OK... that's my rant.

Please tell me more about the reality on the ground these days.



YES, full benefits and four years in so has vested in the 401k. Started at Bethesda Softworks which was bought out by Microsoft more than a year ago.


That's great for your kid but definitely not normal in the game industry. Most people are worked to (or beyond) their breaking point


There are good and horrible companies in every industry. This one is growing very fast so a lot of indies became big before they knew how to run a big business. Bad founders always hire HR too late. It is evolving.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 20:13     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
This is my 14 year old's dream job.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 20:09     Subject: Re:Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:It may work out as a career--it's a huge and growing industry. What most people actually do in game design is not what most kids fantasize about though. But still dreams are what get people through the work to move towards them.

CS degrees can be rough and tedious if he's not committed to that though.

College--especially at a really good school--is a place where you discover your interests. You're exposed to ideas/areas of study you've never encountered before. So I would just let him be and figure out what he wants to do. Congrats on the admission!


That's what a game design major does -- explore all the areas: music, art, creative writing, computer science, business, psychology, neuroscience, etc. All of the things that make a game work.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 20:01     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:Check out the degrees of the professors who teach in those majors. I bet their degrees are in CS.

If you think about it, a video game design major is the application of other majors in a specific field. Keep the options open!


It is a relatively new degree, so of course the professors don't have it.

Anyway, now there are BA, BS, MA, MS, MFA, and PhDs in game design and development. Some are called Interactive Media. Lots of options. However, look very closely at each program and make sure they have legit CS and math courses in there too. Some are more geared to the artists who may go the MFA route, so if your kid is not an artist, they need a program solidly grounded in CS that can be transferred to other areas if he doesn't get the coveted game jobs. Keep in mind that many industries hire game developers, like defense and education, entertainment from games to movies and everything in between. Often the better choice is to major in CS with a minor in Interactive media/game design and development. Other good minors are creative writing, graphic arts, music, entrepreneurship, finance, etc, all of which are needed for the development of a game. Considering all of this, sometimes in hiring the game design degree falls short (not always) because they are actually looking for the entry level person whit jut one of those skills, not an entry level person with a bit of everything. This may be a short lived bias as the industry gets used to the existence of the new major. Just food for thought.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 19:46     Subject: Re:Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Lots of kids want to game design. It’s a miserable job — the hours are looooong. It’s a huge industry, though, and the programming skills are useful in lots of area. I’d be fine with my kid studying this sub field of computer science



DC works for Bethesda Software/ Microsoft snd normal 9-6 hours with occasional overtime .


Does he have benefits? And he's been able to keep this job for five years? I'm just asking because I read the book "Press Reset" and I'm just starting to read "Blood, Sweat and Pixels." This industry, according to those books, and to a couple of people I've talked to is B-R-U-T-A-L. Mostly contractor positions, jobs/businesses that close shop overnight or over a few days, may not get paid for the last few weeks before they close shop. Nearly impossible to buy a home because you end up moving when the business/game goes belly up. No one lasts past 35 yrs old in the industry.

I would love to hear more from the PP. I'm not saying these things I posted are in fact the complete situation everywhere -- it's just what was depicted in "Press Reset." My kid is also hell bent on this as a career. I am trying to learn more about it. My kid NEEDS to be in a job that has medical AND dental benefits. He has some health issues and will be getting dental implants at age 19-ish. So, he will need to have insurance coverage for life.

I feel like every 15 yr old thinks they want to be a video game designer (like in the past kids wanted to be "professional basketball or football players" -- but not everyone is going to be that). I am coming to terms with my son working in the industry (even though I don't feel like it is a "solid job").... so long as he gets a COMSCI degree first --- NOT a BFA in Video Game Design. I'm not down for paying $120k for a BFA in game design. I'll pay that for a comsci degree -- that he can use in any field that supports him. But, a BFA seems too limiting.

OK... that's my rant.

Please tell me more about the reality on the ground these days.



YES, full benefits and four years in so has vested in the 401k. Started at Bethesda Softworks which was bought out by Microsoft more than a year ago.


That's great for your kid but definitely not normal in the game industry. Most people are worked to (or beyond) their breaking point
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 19:38     Subject: Re:Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Lots of kids want to game design. It’s a miserable job — the hours are looooong. It’s a huge industry, though, and the programming skills are useful in lots of area. I’d be fine with my kid studying this sub field of computer science



DC works for Bethesda Software/ Microsoft snd normal 9-6 hours with occasional overtime .


Does he have benefits? And he's been able to keep this job for five years? I'm just asking because I read the book "Press Reset" and I'm just starting to read "Blood, Sweat and Pixels." This industry, according to those books, and to a couple of people I've talked to is B-R-U-T-A-L. Mostly contractor positions, jobs/businesses that close shop overnight or over a few days, may not get paid for the last few weeks before they close shop. Nearly impossible to buy a home because you end up moving when the business/game goes belly up. No one lasts past 35 yrs old in the industry.

I would love to hear more from the PP. I'm not saying these things I posted are in fact the complete situation everywhere -- it's just what was depicted in "Press Reset." My kid is also hell bent on this as a career. I am trying to learn more about it. My kid NEEDS to be in a job that has medical AND dental benefits. He has some health issues and will be getting dental implants at age 19-ish. So, he will need to have insurance coverage for life.

I feel like every 15 yr old thinks they want to be a video game designer (like in the past kids wanted to be "professional basketball or football players" -- but not everyone is going to be that). I am coming to terms with my son working in the industry (even though I don't feel like it is a "solid job").... so long as he gets a COMSCI degree first --- NOT a BFA in Video Game Design. I'm not down for paying $120k for a BFA in game design. I'll pay that for a comsci degree -- that he can use in any field that supports him. But, a BFA seems too limiting.

OK... that's my rant.

Please tell me more about the reality on the ground these days.



YES, full benefits and four years in so has vested in the 401k. Started at Bethesda Softworks which was bought out by Microsoft more than a year ago.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 15:16     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
Land an internship at Electronic Arts
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 15:14     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks for these responses! He is, let’s say generously, “undecided” as a major. I could see him in computer science. Or English. Or physics. Who knows? I think he’ll major in whatever strikes his fancy on the day they make him choose. I will remind him that comp science can have a lot of required courses, great tip.


You might want to pull up the requirements for some of those degree programs and print them out for your kid to see. That way he can look at the group of classes that one would take to get an English degree vs. a Com Sci degree vs. Physics degree vs. Fine Arts Degree in Game Design.

Maybe if he looks at the list of classes for each one it'll be more specific and he'll be able to say: "that looks interesting" or "that looks painful."

I have a kid who is planning to study conservation biology. Some of the "elective" classes include "Vertebrate Biology," "Plant Biology," "Invertebrate Biology," "Entomology." I asked her which, if any of these were courses she would want to take. (they all sound terrible to me). Right off the bat she said "Invertebrate Biology" and "Entomology." ... well, if she's not scared off by those, then conservation biology it is!

Same with your kid --- there is going to be a very big difference in the types of classes you take for a com sci degree vs. an English degree. The details of those degrees will be your kid's everyday life in college.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 15:07     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:Check out the degrees of the professors who teach in those majors. I bet their degrees are in CS.

If you think about it, a video game design major is the application of other majors in a specific field. Keep the options open!


Actually, this isn't true.

Video Game DESIGN involves the story of the game (which may involve history, as well as psychology -- gotta keep players interested and hanging on with just enough rewards, and even technical genres like warfare or combat techniques), then there's the music composition and production, the graphic design, understanding of human forms, lighting, etc.

Video Game PROGRAMMERS need to know how to write code and make the platform work with the game elements. They need the computer science background to handle algorithyms.

The BFA in video game design is a very CREATIVE degree.

There is a difference between a game designer and a programmer.

Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 15:00     Subject: Re:Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Lots of kids want to game design. It’s a miserable job — the hours are looooong. It’s a huge industry, though, and the programming skills are useful in lots of area. I’d be fine with my kid studying this sub field of computer science



DC works for Bethesda Software/ Microsoft snd normal 9-6 hours with occasional overtime .


Does he have benefits? And he's been able to keep this job for five years? I'm just asking because I read the book "Press Reset" and I'm just starting to read "Blood, Sweat and Pixels." This industry, according to those books, and to a couple of people I've talked to is B-R-U-T-A-L. Mostly contractor positions, jobs/businesses that close shop overnight or over a few days, may not get paid for the last few weeks before they close shop. Nearly impossible to buy a home because you end up moving when the business/game goes belly up. No one lasts past 35 yrs old in the industry.

I would love to hear more from the PP. I'm not saying these things I posted are in fact the complete situation everywhere -- it's just what was depicted in "Press Reset." My kid is also hell bent on this as a career. I am trying to learn more about it. My kid NEEDS to be in a job that has medical AND dental benefits. He has some health issues and will be getting dental implants at age 19-ish. So, he will need to have insurance coverage for life.

I feel like every 15 yr old thinks they want to be a video game designer (like in the past kids wanted to be "professional basketball or football players" -- but not everyone is going to be that). I am coming to terms with my son working in the industry (even though I don't feel like it is a "solid job").... so long as he gets a COMSCI degree first --- NOT a BFA in Video Game Design. I'm not down for paying $120k for a BFA in game design. I'll pay that for a comsci degree -- that he can use in any field that supports him. But, a BFA seems too limiting.

OK... that's my rant.

Please tell me more about the reality on the ground these days.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 11:59     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
Anonymous wrote:I work in public health, and I sometimes design games. I think I have the fun end of it - I think about things like peoples motivations and desires, and how they interact with games, and how the game should work as a game (not a piece of software), what people should learn from a game.

Just to say that “game design” doesn’t have to be CS. In fact, I’d hate doing the CS side of game design because that’s not how my brain works. Instead I envision the thing, and then we contract out the actual software design and coding. It’s like being the architect rather than the builder.

I was an English major, FYI.


+1
Games/simulations are now used in a lot of spheres where people need to learn something or be motivated to change their behaviors. So if there's a content area he's interested in/becomes interested in there will likely be arenas to express his interest in game design.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 10:37     Subject: Kid wants to design video games
I work in public health, and I sometimes design games. I think I have the fun end of it - I think about things like peoples motivations and desires, and how they interact with games, and how the game should work as a game (not a piece of software), what people should learn from a game.

Just to say that “game design” doesn’t have to be CS. In fact, I’d hate doing the CS side of game design because that’s not how my brain works. Instead I envision the thing, and then we contract out the actual software design and coding. It’s like being the architect rather than the builder.

I was an English major, FYI.
Anonymous
Post 05/13/2022 09:59     Subject: Re:Kid wants to design video games
I have a kid working in game design in Los Angeles. It's actually a lot of hard work, but the pay is decent, employees get promotions, and the work place has all the types of amenities that appeal to current graduates.

People tend to lump all the jobs at these companies as "game design," but there are different roles. Some employees are writing code, others are handling the creative/development side, and some are essentially trying to find the bugs. And then of course there are other employees dealing with corporate, HR, and legal issues.

The employees attended plenty of different schools. You no more need to have attended a T10 school and majored in CS to make a lot of money at these companies than every actor needs to have attended Julliard or the Yale School of Drama.