Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Obviously touched a never with Dinklage. I doubt any of us can truly understand his feelings which are based on his experiences.

He's entitled to his opinion and his expression of it. I don't have to agree. Disney doesn't have to agree.

I think it's brave to speak out when he must realize cancel culture will be coming for him.

Huh? This is nonsensical. Whatever are you prattling on about a culture "coming for" someone? Do you mean to suggest that Dinklage said something deeply offensive for which he should suffer natural consequences of popular censure? What did he say, exactly?

People who say "but it's just a fairytale! Don't be an over sensative snowflake!" will be mad and criticize him for his comments.

Here's a random google result.
https://www.tmz.com/2022/01/27/dylan-postl-condemns-peter-dinklage-criticism-snow-white-7-dwarfs/

Or enjoy the comments at the bottom of any foxnews article on this story.

So now cancel culture doesn't mean "cancel something because it offends you," it means the people saying "don't cancel something because it offends you"? Stop using phrases that don't mean anything.

I don’t want to be insensitive or push a narrative that’s harmful to a marginalized population, but I don’t understand some of the comments here. I can understand why people would get upset about the movie as described, but that’s not the movie I remember.

Where are people getting that they were outcasts rejected by society forced to live together? I always thought they were brothers living together happily (except for Grumpy) in the family home near the diamond mine they owned. I do remember the house was a mess, but they were busy working and had let things slide. I remembered their relationship with Snow White as being more of a mutual arrangement. Basically, she was a live-in housekeeper who was working for room and board (mainly because they took pity on her), but they were all friends and had a lot of fun together. If anything, she was dependent on them. They had all the power and could kick her out at any time (not that they would) and she was completely unable to fend for herself.

Were these part of the original fairy tale that Disney cut out of the animated version? Did I misunderstand and these are proposed changed to the remake? Did I forget that much of the movie? It’s been a while since I’ve watched it, but everybody seems to be talking about a different movie than the one I remember.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Obviously touched a never with Dinklage. I doubt any of us can truly understand his feelings which are based on his experiences.

He's entitled to his opinion and his expression of it. I don't have to agree. Disney doesn't have to agree.

I think it's brave to speak out when he must realize cancel culture will be coming for him.

Huh? This is nonsensical. Whatever are you prattling on about a culture "coming for" someone? Do you mean to suggest that Dinklage said something deeply offensive for which he should suffer natural consequences of popular censure? What did he say, exactly?

People who say "but it's just a fairytale! Don't be an over sensative snowflake!" will be mad and criticize him for his comments.

Here's a random google result.
https://www.tmz.com/2022/01/27/dylan-postl-condemns-peter-dinklage-criticism-snow-white-7-dwarfs/

Or enjoy the comments at the bottom of any foxnews article on this story.

Give these people a break. They have very underdeveloped empathy muscles; they only get used for people who are just like them. It's really unfair to expect them to be able to do the heavy lifting of understanding how other people see the world with such atrophied limbs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with him. There are so many less problematic animated movies that they could remake. Especially if they are pushing the diversity angle.

I do find it interesting that Peter Dinklage is offended by this but agreed to be in Elf, which definitely stereotyped little people as well.

I mean, his character in Elf was a developed personality (super famous children's book author, successful and demanding and also a liar) who got to beat the living crap out of someone for calling him an elf, so he was not upholding stereotypes. And the movie didn't stereotype little people - it made it clear that elves were not people at all. They were elves, where Buddy was a "human."

Agree with second poster and aghast at the takeaway from the bolded poster. Dinklage has never taken a role that plays into stereotypes and his author in Elf is no different. In fact, his existence there seemed in part to make clear the delineation between elves and little people.

OP, not sure why you are calling out "woke culture" (but oh my god can we dispense with this term). Disney is not woke, no matter how hard they try to be. They are getting better, but still...

Didn't we go through this already with The Huntsman? They used actors like Ian McShane and made them appear small. That was also offensive--god forbid you hire actual little people. I am sure this was on Dinklage's mind when he spoke out.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Obviously touched a never with Dinklage. I doubt any of us can truly understand his feelings which are based on his experiences.

He's entitled to his opinion and his expression of it. I don't have to agree. Disney doesn't have to agree.

I think it's brave to speak out when he must realize cancel culture will be coming for him.

Huh? This is nonsensical. Whatever are you prattling on about a culture "coming for" someone? Do you mean to suggest that Dinklage said something deeply offensive for which he should suffer natural consequences of popular censure? What did he say, exactly?

People who say "but it's just a fairytale! Don't be an over sensative snowflake!" will be mad and criticize him for his comments.

Here's a random google result.
https://www.tmz.com/2022/01/27/dylan-postl-condemns-peter-dinklage-criticism-snow-white-7-dwarfs/

Or enjoy the comments at the bottom of any foxnews article on this story.

Anonymous wrote:
It would actually be a wonderful opportunity to remake this fairy tale and have strong portrayals of dwarves, both male and female, living together in a compound, and doing their jobs. They own a mine! They like their work! They've decided to live together! No harm in that. They take in Snow White because she's a lost young female in the forest. No harm in that either. She repays them by cleaning the house. You'd do the same if you had no other skills, no?

I've read lots of Japanese, Russian, some West African, Celtic and European fairy tales. THEY ARE ALL PRODUCTS OF THEIR TIME. No harm in taking the good parts and eliminating most of the prejudices for modern audiences.

I like this. It reminds me of the Malcolm Gladwell redo of “The Little Mermaid” where Ariel has actual voice and agency and Ursula has an actual character and backstory.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UAlZ_H_4D4A

Anonymous wrote:
It would actually be a wonderful opportunity to remake this fairy tale and have strong portrayals of dwarves, both male and female, living together in a compound, and doing their jobs. They own a mine! They like their work! They've decided to live together! No harm in that. They take in Snow White because she's a lost young female in the forest. No harm in that either. She repays them by cleaning the house. You'd do the same if you had no other skills, no?

I've read lots of Japanese, Russian, some West African, Celtic and European fairy tales. THEY ARE ALL PRODUCTS OF THEIR TIME. No harm in taking the good parts and eliminating most of the prejudices for modern audiences.

I would love to see Disney creations of these, rather than remakes.

We do not have to remake everything that was once made. Some things can just be left alone in the past, where they belong. I am with him, this story is one of those things.

All the princess stories have some seriously troubling themes. Newer movies that are coming out do a much better job avoiding some of this stuff. So just make new movies. Let Snow White live in the 30s where she belongs.

Anonymous wrote:I agree with him. There are so many less problematic animated movies that they could remake. Especially if they are pushing the diversity angle.

I do find it interesting that Peter Dinklage is offended by this but agreed to be in Elf, which definitely stereotyped little people as well.

I mean, his character in Elf was a developed personality (super famous children's book author, successful and demanding and also a liar) who got to beat the living crap out of someone for calling him an elf, so he was not upholding stereotypes. And the movie didn't stereotype little people - it made it clear that elves were not people at all. They were elves, where Buddy was a "human."

I think his comments may help them recreate it so it is less problematic and I appreciate him calling it out. I think Disney will make attempts to reimagine the dwarves in a new way now whereas they might not have before.

I agree with him. There are so many less problematic animated movies that they could remake. Especially if they are pushing the diversity angle.

I do find it interesting that Peter Dinklage is offended by this but agreed to be in Elf, which definitely stereotyped little people as well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are there issues with other dwarves in lit/entertainment like Lord of the Rings?

Would it offend anyone to make a change from dwarves to 7 assorted outcasts?

hobbirt

Nah. The hobbits in LOTR universe had agency, character development, etc. They were a race of humans who were uniformly small statured, but also renowned for their bravery and intelligence.

The seven dwarves in Snow White are essentially a group of clowns. The audience laughed AT the dwarves, because they were small and bumbling.

One of these things is not like the other...

PP is talking about the dwarves in LOTR. Separate race entirely.

It would actually be a wonderful opportunity to remake this fairy tale and have strong portrayals of dwarves, both male and female, living together in a compound, and doing their jobs. They own a mine! They like their work! They've decided to live together! No harm in that. They take in Snow White because she's a lost young female in the forest. No harm in that either. She repays them by cleaning the house. You'd do the same if you had no other skills, no?

I've read lots of Japanese, Russian, some West African, Celtic and European fairy tales. THEY ARE ALL PRODUCTS OF THEIR TIME. No harm in taking the good parts and eliminating most of the prejudices for modern audiences.

Anonymous wrote:To be sure, all fairy tales have something like this wrong with them. Many are sexist and downright misogynistic or romanticize sexual violence.

Of course, same is true of the Bible. So.

Dinklage does have a point. And I think it caught Disney out.

I agree with all of this. Anything based on a fairy take has a high likelihood of being problematic. That’s why remakes often change key details. I’m curious to see what choices they make with this, but I also don’t think it needed to be made and I don’t plan on seeing it.

Anonymous wrote:Are there issues with other dwarves in lit/entertainment like Lord of the Rings?

Would it offend anyone to make a change from dwarves to 7 assorted outcasts?

hobbirt

Nah. The hobbits in LOTR universe had agency, character development, etc. They were a race of humans who were uniformly small statured, but also renowned for their bravery and intelligence.

The seven dwarves in Snow White are essentially a group of clowns. The audience laughed AT the dwarves, because they were small and bumbling.

One of these things is not like the other...