Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 12:04     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:You are never going to get your brother to change.

You are never going to get your parents to pick a side.

The only thing you can do is change yourself, and how you react to situations.

You don't need to create drama by saying that you shouldn't speak, or by dragging your parents into it.

You can just quietly reduce contact with him. And when you speak to him and he says mean things, then calmly withdraw from the conversation. If he is pleasant then you can engage a little more. You need to understand that his nastyness comes from a place of inferiority, and his views on the role of a woman from a place of ignorance. He can only undermine your sense of self-worth if you let him. Frankly, he sounds sad, so I don't know why you would care about his approval. Just relax, and take a deep breath, and deescalate the whole relationship.


+1

I don't ask my parents to choose between me and my sister, who is my only sibling and who is also incredibly dysfunctional. My parents know the latter, and go to great lengths to support her. While they have more insight than you describe your parents as having, it's also not fair to put them in the middle of your adult relationship with your adult sibling. I recently had to set a hard boundary with my sister, and she overreacted, as she usually does. I didn't talk about it with my parents, because it's irrelevant. I have my relationship with them, and she has hers. When we must see each other, I set the needed boundaries and we go from there.

It's painful and it sucks, but this approach is also FAR better and calmer than what you describe. My sister occupies almost none of my headspace. I can parent and function and be there for my own family and friends. I'm not responsible for her, and you're not responsible for your brother. Focus on what you can control, i.e., you.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 11:55     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
I would move most convos to text rather than take his calls. If you are on a call and he says something annoying/insulting, tell him you have to go (don't be dramatic about it just say, oops, I need to get the door, will call you soon). Your brother sounds like a massive a**hole. Just go as low contact as you can and keep it light. Your parents have asked you not to complain about your brother to them. I would respect that. You can complain about your brother to friends, husband, therapist etc. I would also do some therapy. I think it will make you feel better!
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 11:35     Subject: Re:Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Stop talking to your brother entirely. You don’t need him in your life.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 11:27     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:You are never going to get your brother to change.

You are never going to get your parents to pick a side.

The only thing you can do is change yourself, and how you react to situations.

You don't need to create drama by saying that you shouldn't speak, or by dragging your parents into it.

You can just quietly reduce contact with him. And when you speak to him and he says mean things, then calmly withdraw from the conversation. If he is pleasant then you can engage a little more. You need to understand that his nastyness comes from a place of inferiority, and his views on the role of a woman from a place of ignorance. He can only undermine your sense of self-worth if you let him. Frankly, he sounds sad, so I don't know why you would care about his approval. Just relax, and take a deep breath, and deescalate the whole relationship.


+1 I gently suggest you go back to counseling to work on how you should be responding to what you perceive as provocations. You need to practice deflecting, changing the subject and ignoring.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:34     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
You are never going to get your brother to change.

You are never going to get your parents to pick a side.

The only thing you can do is change yourself, and how you react to situations.

You don't need to create drama by saying that you shouldn't speak, or by dragging your parents into it.

You can just quietly reduce contact with him. And when you speak to him and he says mean things, then calmly withdraw from the conversation. If he is pleasant then you can engage a little more. You need to understand that his nastyness comes from a place of inferiority, and his views on the role of a woman from a place of ignorance. He can only undermine your sense of self-worth if you let him. Frankly, he sounds sad, so I don't know why you would care about his approval. Just relax, and take a deep breath, and deescalate the whole relationship.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:24     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Just don't engage. You don't have to take his call. You don't have to tell your parents about any of this. You can have the relationship with him that you want, which seems to be limited, and live a happy life.

This is why people are telling you to grow up. Take control. Act like an adult. Don't keep playing the victim because you are allowing him to treat you poorly.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:21     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:You want your parents to pick a side. Your side. And they won't because you are both equally at fault. They aren't even on his side. You sound very immature. Grow up.


I am honestly trying to take in the constructive criticism and learn, but I don't understand what you mean by "Grow up".

I am trying to be mature. My brother chooses to make hurtful comments, accuse me of being wrong in a million different ways, and no amount of conversation with him will change this. I can't keep putting up with being treated so badly. I thought the emotionally mature thing to do would be to disengage.

I told my parents that I am willing to come to family events and be polite, but I just cannot keep trying to have a close relationship with him. They are insisting that we make up, and are faulting me for the whole situation.

He is completely fine continuing the relationship as it is (he insults me, I have to just deal with it), and also blames me for not wanting to play ball.

What exactly are my right next steps here?


Just ignore as much as possible and refuse to engage. Don't answer texts and calls or just say "Ok" and not take the bait. Keep it surface level like a casual acquaintance. Walk away when he insults, change the topic, say it's time to go, there are a lot of options.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:18     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
As a parent, this breaks my heart. Is it possible for you to get an understanding of your brother's mental state to be able to have a relationship? I am not saying to just give in to him, but recognize that is a mental issue with him.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:15     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
OP, he sounds very annoying, but for the sake of rbe bigger picture and family oeace, try your best to ignore, walk away.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:11     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?

You really sound like a troll, OP.

If he's the one to reach out to hector you, don't pick up the phone. Delete his messages. You have control and power in this relationship. Use it. And the next time you see him in person at a family function, and he complains you avoid him, smile and say: "when you can talk to me respectfully, I'll converse with you". And walk away. Do not explain. Do not defend yourself. When your family takes his side, avoid taking the bait and do not explain or defend yourself.

You are putting yourself in a position of weakness here. Stop it.


Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:09     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:You want your parents to pick a side. Your side. And they won't because you are both equally at fault. They aren't even on his side. You sound very immature. Grow up.


I am honestly trying to take in the constructive criticism and learn, but I don't understand what you mean by "Grow up".

I am trying to be mature. My brother chooses to make hurtful comments, accuse me of being wrong in a million different ways, and no amount of conversation with him will change this. I can't keep putting up with being treated so badly. I thought the emotionally mature thing to do would be to disengage.

I told my parents that I am willing to come to family events and be polite, but I just cannot keep trying to have a close relationship with him. They are insisting that we make up, and are faulting me for the whole situation.

He is completely fine continuing the relationship as it is (he insults me, I have to just deal with it), and also blames me for not wanting to play ball.

What exactly are my right next steps here?
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 10:07     Subject: Re:Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
OP: You're defensiveness in the face of the preponderance of posts on here would point to your role in this situation. I see so many people come out of therapy playing the victim and unable to own up to their own responsibility in relationships. You and your brother are different. You want him to say that your way, opinions, lifestyle, are the right way and his is wrong. Why should he do that? Why would you involve your parents? You are the bigger problem in this dymamic. But you found a therapist who wants you to keep paying them, so they tell you what you want to hear. This is why therapy is so dangerous.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 09:59     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
You are perseverating. Look it up. It's bad.

It's normal to have disagreements, and often, the people you disagree with won't be mature about it. You can't make them communicate better, or resolve conflicts your way. Everyone has their say, and that's that. You distance yourself for a while and think about something else.

And please don't drag the rest of your family into this.

I assume you're not in a long-term relationship - please don't do this with your significant other either. It's extremely annoying.


OP. I looked up perseverating but I don't really get it. When I interact with my brother, he treats me badly, so I was trying to set a boundary and walk away, not to continue this vicious cycle.

My DH and I don't have this issue because he's a normal person. When we disagree, we talk it out and meet halfway, like any other functional relationship.


I would love your DH's take on this. I am betting he lets you "talk it out" AT him, doesn't say what he wants to say, then moves on. He has to live with you so he is going to keep the peace. Your brother doesn't have to live with you so he really doesn't care if he irritates you.

You need to really take a hard look at yourself. Just from how you are approaching this your sound very rigid and need to get your way. Nobody likes that person.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 09:58     Subject: Re:Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:Guess what -a lot of guys don’t want to talk about the state of a relationship. Your brother is clearly one of these men. Can you really not de-escalate this by just talking about the weather or something next time you see him? Learn to be civil and move on with your life. And stop trying to drag other people into this -you are an adult, stop acting like a petulant teen not getting her way.


OP. He loves talking about the relationship. So many phone calls and texts and hours of my life wasted on him explaining to me all the ways I'm wrong and how I need to change.

He is the one reaching out to me to talk about how I'm a bad sister because I don't call him regularly. Or that I did/said something wrong at the last family get-together. Or that I got too small of a gift for his kids. Or that I made some other stupid mistake (that he hears about from my family).

So, no, it's not as simple as talking about the weather. He wants to have a more substantive relationship, but on his terms, where I'm always wrong and he's always benevolently correcting me and giving me the chance to improve my behavior.
Anonymous
Post 01/21/2022 09:57     Subject: Should I Talk to My Family About Conflict With My Brother?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I was kinda with you until this paragraph:

It really bothers me that my family thinks that this is a me problem. I really want them to understand that I've done everything I could. That my only choice is to accept his false narrative that I'm a condescending, bumbling, exhausting, overly sensitive person who always plays the victim, is always wrong, and has ruined the relationship, or to go no contact. I know I'm not perfect and I'm 100% willing to accept my faults and try to improve based on feedback - I've often taken the first step, but he never reciprocates.

Why are your only choices to play a victim or go no contact? THat's ludicrous. Why not just be who you are? you don't have to talk everything to death, or "make someone else understand" anything. Just be.

Why do you have disagreements? What are you disagreeing about?

Him: Please pass the potato salad?
You: you know you need to accept my right not to pass the potato salad

As a healthy functioning adult, you have your life. Live it. Interact with your brother when you are together with family, keep it light and cordial, and that's it. Anything else is you bringing drama to the situation.


OP here. He will say things like:

"So, how's work? Your business still afloat? (surprised tone). Good for you, I guess"
"Oh, you're dragging your kids across the country for vacation again? Poor kids."

Recent disagreements were
- I am a bad sister because I don't call him (I am really busy and our conversations leave me feeling sad because he's putting me down so much, so I don't call a lot). I tried to explain to him why I don't call and how I would like him not to put down my life choices. He says it's his right to have opinions and I'm too sensitive.

- I am unreasonable for asking to see my nephews more. They live 1.5 hours away, so in-person visits are only possible 2-3 times/year, and I'm an idiot for suggesting otherwise.

- A mother's place is in the home and I shouldn't be working.

- I was too cheap in holiday gifts. Historically, we always give bigger gifts than they do. I tried to tone it down this year to match what they give, and they happened to buy a big gift for my kid. I asked him not to call me cheap and go off on me for this one-time situation when I have been giving him and his kids bigger gifts for years!

He is always speaking with this tone of total superiority, like of course he's 100% right and I'm an idiot.

Ultimately, almost every time I interacted with him, I would leave feeling like total shit. It would seep into my work and relationships with my DH and kids. I was trying to set a boundary and protect my mental health.


So he's a d-ck. But instead of ignoring or grey rocking or killing him with kindness -- (Yes, we're going on vacation! So glad we're able to do it this year!) -- you're engaged with his assholery and then complaining to your family about it.

This isn't turning the blame on you. But you're expending a lot of energy trying to get him to see your point of view and he won't. It sounds like you need to be the one to ignore his comments, because he isn't going to stop making them.