Yes.

I've been eating vegetarian since I was a teenager (when my mom gave up fighting about food) because I don't like the taste/texture of meat. I'm fine with owning animal products and am fine with other people eating/owning animal products.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

Luckily for them, you are not the vegan police.

Lol, I’m transitioning to vegetarianism, so no, I’m not the vegan police. Just trying to figure it all out. This was from one of the books l’m reading. I was trying to open the tent a bit, and I have to say I find smug folks like you a little off-putting.

PP isn't trying to be off-putting. But it really is irritating when people who haven't been living with this diet or way of life try to tell us what we have to do or who we are or how annoying we are or whatever. I think that's what PP is responding to. People who are new to this and trying to figure it out - welcome. We're really happy to have you here. But please try not to lecture us about how we "have" to do this or "can't" do that if we want to be "real" vegans or vegetarians.

Figure it out for yourself. Decide what works for you. Eliminate leather for a while and see if that works for you - and if not, decide what you can live with (recycled leather, leather only for shoes, whatever). You don't owe anyone else an explanation for the choices you're making.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

Luckily for them, you are not the vegan police.

Lol, I’m transitioning to vegetarianism, so no, I’m not the vegan police. Just trying to figure it all out. This was from one of the books l’m reading. I was trying to open the tent a bit, and I have to say I find smug folks like you a little off-putting.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

I don't have issues with vegetarians or vegans - but I do have a problem with hypocrites. So - you are fine with consuming animal products in one way or another, or you are not. I don't care if anyone wears leather shoes, but I don't want to hear any preaching about meat or anything else.

I have been mostly a vegan for 20 years (maybe eat animal products two or three times a year) and have a car with leather seats. I am primarily vegan because I find most animal foods to be gross and prefer eating a healthy diet rich in plant foods.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

Luckily for them, you are not the vegan police.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

It doesn't have to be all or nothing even in that case. I know many people who call themselves vegan but aren't absolutists - and I support them. The more people we have practicing harm reduction, and limiting the animal products they use and consume, the better. I think a wide tent is our best way to get people thinking about how their behavior affects animals and the environment - and kicking people out of the club if they eat a piece of cheese or a slice of bacon one time, or if they still wear leather shoes or their grandmother's fur coat, is how you end up losing the battle altogether.

Yes. "Don't let the perfect get in the way of the good" is something that is good to always remember.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have been a vegetarian for a while, and before anyone asks, I am not one of 'those' vegetarians who shames/judges people for eating meat. Of course, I wish people who do eat meat would go the free-range route/humane, but not my place to decide that, and I realize those options are typically more expensive and less accessible. For me, it truly is a personal decision.

Anyways - the other day, I picked a friend up who asked me how I justified having a car with leather seats when I don't eat meat. I honestly had never really thought about it - my car is on the older side, and I didn't 'choose' the car for its leather seats. It got me thinking, though, that I have several leather bags, shoes, etc...and now I feel guilty. Hoping to get other opinions...

First off, I'd suggest you drop the defensiveness in the beginning. I have been vegetarian for 20+ years and have literally never encountered a pushy vegetarian. Don't give more life to this absurd stereotype.

And to answer your question: we avoid leather as much as possible but sometimes it is very hard or near impossible to avoid leather. So we do what we can - no leather car seats, no leather purses/shoes/bags, no leather furniture etc.

100% this. all of it. I get way more from non-vegetarians in the terms of lectures (i.e., pointing out perceived hypocrisy, criticizing my choice, or dramatic declarations how they could NEEEEVVVVVEEEEERRRR live without meat) than I have ever seen given from a vegetarian.

The latter is also true. I will not seek out leather seats, furniture, clothes, etc. But sometimes it is unavoidable (mostly in shoes).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

It doesn't have to be all or nothing even in that case. I know many people who call themselves vegan but aren't absolutists - and I support them. The more people we have practicing harm reduction, and limiting the animal products they use and consume, the better. I think a wide tent is our best way to get people thinking about how their behavior affects animals and the environment - and kicking people out of the club if they eat a piece of cheese or a slice of bacon one time, or if they still wear leather shoes or their grandmother's fur coat, is how you end up losing the battle altogether.

When I was vegetarian for 10+ years, I tried to avoid leather as much as possible- the only leather shoes I had were hiking boots and running shoes (I tried leather free minimalist running shoes and totally messed my foot up). I still don't eat a lot of meat or buy a lot of leather, but boy was it freeing to just look for a a nice pair of quality shoes without worrying or restricting myself. I'll never forget stressing out over buying a pair of shoes for my own wedding.

I’m not a vegetarian, but I don’t purchase leather products b/c its production is absolutely horrible for the environment. I’d consider buying second hand since I like re-used/thrifted/buy nothing group things.

Re: the pushy/judgmental vegetarians, I haven’t really met any of those, but I’ve known a few vegans who truly think they are morally above everyone else.

The thing I find odd though is that they proudly defend animal rights, but then eat things like quinoa, açaí, bananas, etc., which have a huge human and environmental toll (often involving child labor, shipping from far away, pesticide use, etc.) not to mention they wear Nike and have iPhones. So I just sort of internally laugh when they go on their little tirades.

To clarify, I also care about animal welfare and human rights. But I realize that I’m not going to fix this as an individual. I try to do small things where I can (for me that is not buying leather, buying food from local farmers at the farmers market when possible, driving an EV/walking as much as possible, buying made in America goods, etc.) But really that is a drop in the bucket. We need global regulations or at least vote for people who believe in climate change and human rights.

Anonymous wrote:I have been a vegetarian for a while, and before anyone asks, I am not one of 'those' vegetarians who shames/judges people for eating meat. Of course, I wish people who do eat meat would go the free-range route/humane, but not my place to decide that, and I realize those options are typically more expensive and less accessible. For me, it truly is a personal decision.

Anyways - the other day, I picked a friend up who asked me how I justified having a car with leather seats when I don't eat meat. I honestly had never really thought about it - my car is on the older side, and I didn't 'choose' the car for its leather seats. It got me thinking, though, that I have several leather bags, shoes, etc...and now I feel guilty. Hoping to get other opinions...

You can say: “Well, my car is also made of steel and plastic and I don’t eat those things either… so, there’s that.”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. I have lots of things that are made from leather (boots, shoes, bags, etc). I’m a vegetarian because I think it’s a healthier way to live and not necessarily because of animal rights. I mean I don’t want to see animals suffer unnecessarily but it wasn’t my motivation. Plus I never really liked meat. Bacon is the only thing I miss.

This. It depends why you’re a vegetarian. If it is for animal rights then of course you shouldn’t buy leather or any animal product. If it’s for any other reason (like health or preference) then it doesn’t matter.

Here’s the rub tho: if you’re a vegetarian for ecology and saving the planet, used leather goods create less waste than new cloth or manmade fabrics do so your better off with vintage leather.

That's true even from an animal welfare perspective. Used leather causes no additional harm to animals.

I've been vegetarian since I was a little kids - so going on 40 years now. I wear and use some leather but try to be conscientious about it. I do wear leather shoes because I haven't found great alternatives, though I expect as cruelty-free leather improves I will stop even wearing leather shoes. I don't wear leather jackets. I used to wear some (used) leather skirts - but, again, I didn't buy them new; I don't have a problem with secondhand leather. Same with our leather couch - it holds up to pets better than cloth, and we got it used, so I am fine with that.

I do not wear fur. I try to avoid wool, too, though I do wear wool socks because I haven't found a good alternative yet. Essentially I am doing my best to meet my own needs and limit my harm. I do the same with animal products in food - I am not vegan but try to be conscientious and limit the animal products I consume. Where I buy animal products, I try to get the version that causes the least harm (the $$$$$ eggs from pasture-raised chickens - I know that even there, the industry is horribly cruel, but this is better and I feel ok putting my $ into showing farmers there is a market for more humanely raised animals).

Anonymous wrote:I had this conversation years ago. In high school, a girl who was a vegetarian (a pushy one) wanted to know how I justified wearing the suede shorts that were popular at the time. While she was wearing leather shoes. I asked her if she thought my shorts and her shoes came from a different cow. She tried to justify the shoes saying it was hard finding quality non-leather shoes. It was bullshit then and it’s bullshit now.

Same with the car seats. I’m not saying you shouldn’t have accepted the car, but…either you believe in not using/consuming animal products or you don’t. If that means you need to replace your shoes more often, then that is what it means. Not “I wear leather shoes because it works better for me but we shouldn’t eat meat”.

People go vegetarian for different reasons—health, the much lower environmental impact, or ethical reasons such as they don’t want to kill animals. Only in the last case, and with veganism, is it really all or nothing.

So I did research into leather seats when I bought my last car and they’re not actually leather. They’re fake leather which most are nowadays. So check into yours, you might be feeling guilty for nothing. The only leather I wear are sneakers. That’s because it’s hard to find non leather hiking shoes. I don’t do leather bags, purses , or clothing.