Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 21:37     Subject: Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
It's completely awful because as an addict, and therefore suffering from a MENTAL ILLNESS, she has limited control over her impulses and has limited responsibility.

Such a person should not be charged with murder. She should be treated with compassion as a VICTIM and treated.

I am flabbergasted at the judgement directed towards this person. It's like we're in back in the middle ages and science has not advanced at all.



Applying your logic, drunk drivers are blameless as well. They have limited control over their actions.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 21:32     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:Im a hospice chaplain. I held a baby as she died having seizure after seizure due to her drug addicted mother. There were other issues as well, likely from drug and alcohol use. Even after holding that precious infant, I wouldn’t want her mother jailed. That’s barbaric. It does nothing to deter future drug use. It doesn’t help the baby. And it’s a dangerous path. Would you like to go to jail for drinking before you knew you were pregnant? Should smokers go to prison if their babies are low birth weight? What if you slip up and eat too much sugar with gestational diabetes? What if I ride a roller coaster and miscarry? Morning after pill?

Think people. It is a tragic story. She miscarried. That should NEVER come with prison.

She's irresponsible and jail is a punishment for that. Jail is not really meant to be a deterrent. She should of either sought out an abortion or entered a rehab program as soon as she found out she was pregnant.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:55     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:Im a hospice chaplain. I held a baby as she died having seizure after seizure due to her drug addicted mother. There were other issues as well, likely from drug and alcohol use. Even after holding that precious infant, I wouldn’t want her mother jailed. That’s barbaric. It does nothing to deter future drug use. It doesn’t help the baby. And it’s a dangerous path. Would you like to go to jail for drinking before you knew you were pregnant? Should smokers go to prison if their babies are low birth weight? What if you slip up and eat too much sugar with gestational diabetes? What if I ride a roller coaster and miscarry? Morning after pill?

Think people. It is a tragic story. She miscarried. That should NEVER come with prison.



All of this.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:53     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Im a hospice chaplain. I held a baby as she died having seizure after seizure due to her drug addicted mother. There were other issues as well, likely from drug and alcohol use. Even after holding that precious infant, I wouldn’t want her mother jailed. That’s barbaric. It does nothing to deter future drug use. It doesn’t help the baby. And it’s a dangerous path. Would you like to go to jail for drinking before you knew you were pregnant? Should smokers go to prison if their babies are low birth weight? What if you slip up and eat too much sugar with gestational diabetes? What if I ride a roller coaster and miscarry? Morning after pill?

Think people. It is a tragic story. She miscarried. That should NEVER come with prison.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:33     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:The people who created and profited from these drugs donate loads of money to museums. They are honored and lauded while making addicts of newborns.

The Sackler family.

https://www.npr.org/2021/09/28/1040447650/payouts-purdue-pharma-settlement-sackler


The Sackler family is persona non grata now.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:32     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
The people who created and profited from these drugs donate loads of money to museums. They are honored and lauded while making addicts of newborns.

The Sackler family.

https://www.npr.org/2021/09/28/1040447650/payouts-purdue-pharma-settlement-sackler
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:26     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
If you're going to say that life begins at conception, and that abortion is murder, then it naturally follows that a miscarriage can be manslaughter.

This logic is one reason why I'm pro-choice. A slippery slope, indeed.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:20     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I understand that drug addiction is an illness but I really don't feel bad for this woman. Maybe she can get clean in jail. My aunt was a NICU nurse and worked with too many inconsolable babies who were suffering, screaming and shaking from the symptoms of drug withdrawal. Her stories about these babies whom almost never had visitors and would often end up in foster care was heartbreaking.


A baby on my floor when I gave birth was going through opiate withdrawals. I knew because of the newborn’s piercing high pitched screams of agony. It was gutting.


You know what’s cheaper than four years in jail? Nine months of drug treatment. There are better ways to treat pregnant drug addicts than jailing them after they have a miscarriage.


Oh? What’s the success rate of court-ordered (not self initiated) drug treatment?


Not good, but maybe their newborns wouldn't have to suffer through withdrawal.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:13     Subject: Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
It's completely awful because as an addict, and therefore suffering from a MENTAL ILLNESS, she has limited control over her impulses and has limited responsibility.

Such a person should not be charged with murder. She should be treated with compassion as a VICTIM and treated.

I am flabbergasted at the judgement directed towards this person. It's like we're in back in the middle ages and science has not advanced at all.



She has limited control and limited responsibility? You sound like you are advocating for incarceration during pregnancy for her own good and the good of the child. Is that what you mean? She should have been committed, institutionalized?
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:12     Subject: Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
It's completely awful because as an addict, and therefore suffering from a MENTAL ILLNESS, she has limited control over her impulses and has limited responsibility.

Such a person should not be charged with murder. She should be treated with compassion as a VICTIM and treated.

I am flabbergasted at the judgement directed towards this person. It's like we're in back in the middle ages and science has not advanced at all.



Live in conservative states, deal with backwards legal systems. There is nothing new or surprising here.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:11     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I understand that drug addiction is an illness but I really don't feel bad for this woman. Maybe she can get clean in jail. My aunt was a NICU nurse and worked with too many inconsolable babies who were suffering, screaming and shaking from the symptoms of drug withdrawal. Her stories about these babies whom almost never had visitors and would often end up in foster care was heartbreaking.


A baby on my floor when I gave birth was going through opiate withdrawals. I knew because of the newborn’s piercing high pitched screams of agony. It was gutting.


You know what’s cheaper than four years in jail? Nine months of drug treatment. There are better ways to treat pregnant drug addicts than jailing them after they have a miscarriage.


Oh? What’s the success rate of court-ordered (not self initiated) drug treatment?


What’s the success rate of treatment during incarceration?
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:09     Subject: Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
It's completely awful because as an addict, and therefore suffering from a MENTAL ILLNESS, she has limited control over her impulses and has limited responsibility.

Such a person should not be charged with murder. She should be treated with compassion as a VICTIM and treated.

I am flabbergasted at the judgement directed towards this person. It's like we're in back in the middle ages and science has not advanced at all.



If you're trying to rally the sisterhood to her defense, then start by calling her a woman, instead of just a person. She was a mother, for a time, a pregnant woman, not an incubator or a pregnant person.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:09     Subject: Re:Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I understand that drug addiction is an illness but I really don't feel bad for this woman. Maybe she can get clean in jail. My aunt was a NICU nurse and worked with too many inconsolable babies who were suffering, screaming and shaking from the symptoms of drug withdrawal. Her stories about these babies whom almost never had visitors and would often end up in foster care was heartbreaking.


A baby on my floor when I gave birth was going through opiate withdrawals. I knew because of the newborn’s piercing high pitched screams of agony. It was gutting.


You know what’s cheaper than four years in jail? Nine months of drug treatment. There are better ways to treat pregnant drug addicts than jailing them after they have a miscarriage.


Oh? What’s the success rate of court-ordered (not self initiated) drug treatment?
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:07     Subject: Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
It's completely awful because as an addict, and therefore suffering from a MENTAL ILLNESS, she has limited control over her impulses and has limited responsibility.

Such a person should not be charged with murder. She should be treated with compassion as a VICTIM and treated.

I am flabbergasted at the judgement directed towards this person. It's like we're in back in the middle ages and science has not advanced at all.


It certainly feels like the walls of misogyny are closing in from all directions these days.
Anonymous
Post 10/24/2021 20:06     Subject: Why isn’t the four-year sentence for a miscarriage a bigger story?
Anonymous wrote:
It's completely awful because as an addict, and therefore suffering from a MENTAL ILLNESS, she has limited control over her impulses and has limited responsibility.

Such a person should not be charged with murder. She should be treated with compassion as a VICTIM and treated.

I am flabbergasted at the judgement directed towards this person. It's like we're in back in the middle ages and science has not advanced at all.


Let's face it most people in prison for violent crimes are mentally ill but do not meet the requirements for a mental illness plea. Should we call them all victims?