Anonymous wrote:I still don't know what to do about this. Our DC's ACT composite is just two points less than the school's 25% (he has a 28 - school's 25% is a 30). It seems if he doesn't submit, they'll assume his score is MUCH lower than it is, when in reality, it's not far from their 25%. I really wish we could just choose which sections to submit and not submit the others.

Two points on ACT is not that small. I would not submit 28 to a school where 25th percentile is 30. Consider what data source you are using for the percentile range, though. I would look at class of 2024 and earlier.

My child goes to a relatively low income school in MCPS but our family income is UMC and high for the zip code/school. I think this will be obvious based on the app (our jobs, where we went to college/professional school, her extracurriculars, not applying for financial aid).

Anonymous wrote:Parent of senior here, 1st kid.

where is this "conventional wisdom" found ???? CONVENTIONAL is mentioned by both OP and the next poster.

Please be specific. Like, this website or that book or none of the above -- our $$$$ private counselor told us this. Or the counselor in our giant public school system who's been doing this 20 years.

Our kid attends a private DC school and we have very responsive, engaged counselors for that tuition. BUT ... but but but. They definitely don't offer these kind of concrete, universally understood nuggets like "submit yes if > 75%. No submit if <50% and gonzo GPA."

The conventional wisdom comes from two places, admission officers and consultants. Personally, I think it depends on the rest of the app, particularly how strong the grades are. At the very least, it seems clear that <25th percentile should not submit.

Also consider what data one is using to make that decision. One issue going forward will be score creep, where the reported range continues to increase as the lower data points are not submitted. Reported ranges for class of 2025 are not reliable indicators. I would look at class of 2024 score data or earlier, to make the decision. See Common Data Set 2020-2021 or the IPEDS website.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are from a UMC background and aren't submitting scores, that will not work in your favor.

How will admissions know if the student is from
an UMC background?

FAFSA
Common App responses
Democgraphics of the high school
and if the school is small enough, google

What do you mean by the last point?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are from a UMC background and aren't submitting scores, that will not work in your favor.

How will admissions know if the student is from
an UMC background?

Parent employment, zip code, high school. I suspect there may be algorithms (remember College Board's "landscape" score lol? I don't know if that's still around.)

Anonymous wrote:So are the admissions officers who say things like "if you aren't happy with your scores, don't submit them!" lying? Not a sarcastic question, I'm honestly trying to reconcile everything I've heard about this.

As DC is just at the 25% for their ED school, we are considering not submitting and the above quote is word-for-word what we heard during an info session for that school. But I don't know what to do and I'd hate to give DC the wrong advice and have it hurt their chances.

It really sucks that colleges have added so much ridiculous gamesmanship to the process. It is doing a really bad number on the mental health of our kids.

ED? If so, to the school you really want to go to but might not get in because it has a <10% admit rate and one of your areas is weaker than typical? If the second or third choice when ED is nearly a shoe-in and but RD is a gamble? What if I still don't know in October which is my first choice - and I throwing it all away by not pulling a name from a hat?
EA? but what if ED would have been better? Or is ED really just for legacies and athletes, not one will tell you for sure?
RD? what if the class is full already and they only take the hard need cases? Will I get merit aid if I wait?
Will I spend the next 6 months of my senior year living with self doubt and regret while my ED classmates relax and party?
Should I submit scores or not? To some not others? Which ones? What if I choose wrong?

It is so wrong on so many levels.

Anonymous wrote:Parent of senior here, 1st kid.

where is this "conventional wisdom" found ???? CONVENTIONAL is mentioned by both OP and the next poster.

Please be specific. Like, this website or that book or none of the above -- our $$$$ private counselor told us this. Or the counselor in our giant public school system who's been doing this 20 years.

Our kid attends a private DC school and we have very responsive, engaged counselors for that tuition. BUT ... but but but. They definitely don't offer these kind of concrete, universally understood nuggets like "submit yes if > 75%. No submit if <50% and gonzo GPA."

There is not real conventional wisdom because this is only the second class of kids to face this dilemma.

OP here, our schools are not highly competitive for top students. I have an average student who wants to get into the safeties of top students. Still, their scores are at the low end but still within the middle 50%. No one seems to know what to tell us. In reality it probably doesn’t matter if she submits or not because I will second guess myself if she doesn’t get in either way.

Anonymous wrote:So are the admissions officers who say things like "if you aren't happy with your scores, don't submit them!" lying? Not a sarcastic question, I'm honestly trying to reconcile everything I've heard about this.

As DC is just at the 25% for their ED school, we are considering not submitting and the above quote is word-for-word what we heard during an info session for that school. But I don't know what to do and I'd hate to give DC the wrong advice and have it hurt their chances.

They are being sincere. But they don’t have a vested interest in your child getting into their college.

I think the admissions staff below Ivy tier honestly don’t want your scores if they’ll bring down the school average for rankings. Ivys+ I think will hold it against you. Just my guess.

Anonymous wrote:They are being cagey because they don’t really know the answer or it isn’t politically acceptable to answer honestly. If you are white or Asian from an affluent zip code with no hook, not submitting test scores is likely to hurt you.

This is the truth. If your student is from a well off family where both parents are college educated, they are expected to have good test scores. If they do not submit test scores the assumption will be the scores were lousy.

Test scores optional is meant to reduce road blocks to college for students who didn’t have a lot of college prep guidance.

So are the admissions officers who say things like "if you aren't happy with your scores, don't submit them!" lying? Not a sarcastic question, I'm honestly trying to reconcile everything I've heard about this.

As DC is just at the 25% for their ED school, we are considering not submitting and the above quote is word-for-word what we heard during an info session for that school. But I don't know what to do and I'd hate to give DC the wrong advice and have it hurt their chances.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are from a UMC background and aren't submitting scores, that will not work in your favor.

How will admissions know if the student is from
an UMC background?

FAFSA
Common App responses
Democgraphics of the high school
and if the school is small enough, google

Anonymous wrote:I still don't know what to do about this. Our DC's ACT composite is just two points less than the school's 25% (he has a 28 - school's 25% is a 30). It seems if he doesn't submit, they'll assume his score is MUCH lower than it is, when in reality, it's not far from their 25%. I really wish we could just choose which sections to submit and not submit the others.

Don't take this the wrong way, but you need to understand that those 25th% numbers are generally people with hooks. Unless your kid also has a hook, that number won't apply to them. Also, are you sure you want your kid "competing" academically with kids who generally did a lot better on these tests?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are from a UMC background and aren't submitting scores, that will not work in your favor.

How will admissions know if the student is from
an UMC background?

The common app asks questions about parent backgrounds. Also if you are doing a FAFSA, the schools with know everything.