Anonymous
10/13/2021 13:23
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
I don’t know, op, I’ve noticed that many men regard women as “lashing out” when they express any form of anger.
Just recently we had a bad experience with a Lowes subcontractor. I wanted to sort it out that day and my husband wanted to “give them time”. He wasn’t at the house to talk to the vendor and see just how bad the subcontractor was (it was a consult so no physical damage for him to see), and I wanted to let Lowes know how terrible their sub was, and that if Lowes would like to keep our business, I needed another contractor.
He and I argued some, and I do remember me saying “If you don’t want to get this done, let’s sell the f**cking house”.
That woke him up and we went to Lowes.
I became concerned when the guy at Lowes tried to tell me I couldn’t write a bad review because if I did, it would trickle down to him. The guy was great, switched us to another sub, but I wanted Lowes management to know what was going on. Its not 1980, writing gets more attention, and well, it was my right to write about an experience I had with one of their subs.
On the way home, my husband said I was being b**chy for threatening to write a bad review.
I thought about that some, and the next day I told him that I’ve discovered writing publicly about an experence gets a lot of positive attention, note, I wasn’t asking for free anything. I also didn’t think it was appropriate for a business to try and silence me. I told him that if the guy got fired because of a bad review (a review where I also praised him for assigning us to another sub), that was a screwed up culture, but that it wasn’t my problem. I told my husband thad that this was all in the context of business, it wasn’t like I was mad at my kid’s boyfriend who just happened to work at Lowes, or that a friend in his off time had suggested a contractor and the friend just happned to work at Lowes, this was all in the context of business I was trying to do with Lowes. I explained to my husband that I wouldnt be silenced nor would I do business with a company that thought silencing me (I was the only woman around) was appropriate.
All this got him to see my point.
I strongly believe that had my husband and his brother gone to Lowes, he’d not have said a word if his brother had said “you know, I need to publicly review this place”. Men don’t usually do that to each other.
All this to say, Im not convinced your wife can’t control her emotions, you simply don’t like it when she speaks loudly or says anything you don’t want to hear or that may make your life difficult.
I see that she’s an ex, or almost one, and either way, you’ve ended the relationship. So long as she isn’t destroying your property or witholding the kids, you don’t get to tell her to only use nice words. This isn’t third grade.
If you need to, get a very rigid custody plan and maybe even a paretning cordinator involved. You’re allowed to do that.
Just recently we had a bad experience with a Lowes subcontractor. I wanted to sort it out that day and my husband wanted to “give them time”. He wasn’t at the house to talk to the vendor and see just how bad the subcontractor was (it was a consult so no physical damage for him to see), and I wanted to let Lowes know how terrible their sub was, and that if Lowes would like to keep our business, I needed another contractor.
He and I argued some, and I do remember me saying “If you don’t want to get this done, let’s sell the f**cking house”.
That woke him up and we went to Lowes.
I became concerned when the guy at Lowes tried to tell me I couldn’t write a bad review because if I did, it would trickle down to him. The guy was great, switched us to another sub, but I wanted Lowes management to know what was going on. Its not 1980, writing gets more attention, and well, it was my right to write about an experience I had with one of their subs.
On the way home, my husband said I was being b**chy for threatening to write a bad review.
I thought about that some, and the next day I told him that I’ve discovered writing publicly about an experence gets a lot of positive attention, note, I wasn’t asking for free anything. I also didn’t think it was appropriate for a business to try and silence me. I told him that if the guy got fired because of a bad review (a review where I also praised him for assigning us to another sub), that was a screwed up culture, but that it wasn’t my problem. I told my husband thad that this was all in the context of business, it wasn’t like I was mad at my kid’s boyfriend who just happened to work at Lowes, or that a friend in his off time had suggested a contractor and the friend just happned to work at Lowes, this was all in the context of business I was trying to do with Lowes. I explained to my husband that I wouldnt be silenced nor would I do business with a company that thought silencing me (I was the only woman around) was appropriate.
All this got him to see my point.
I strongly believe that had my husband and his brother gone to Lowes, he’d not have said a word if his brother had said “you know, I need to publicly review this place”. Men don’t usually do that to each other.
All this to say, Im not convinced your wife can’t control her emotions, you simply don’t like it when she speaks loudly or says anything you don’t want to hear or that may make your life difficult.
I see that she’s an ex, or almost one, and either way, you’ve ended the relationship. So long as she isn’t destroying your property or witholding the kids, you don’t get to tell her to only use nice words. This isn’t third grade.
If you need to, get a very rigid custody plan and maybe even a paretning cordinator involved. You’re allowed to do that.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 12:51
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There are specific ways of communicating so as not to escalate.
My ex and I switched to email only for a while when things were contentious. Or you could use one of the communications apps for divorced parents.
Send brief informative messages related to the kids/logistics.
Edit your emails to remove unnecessary phrases that can be read as snarky. the "surely you can understand," "as we have discussed multiple times." Just say what needs to be said.
Let go of having the last word or calling out bad behavior. If she escalates, don't respond or only respond with essential info. "I will pick up at 5:00" or "yes, I can take Larla to the dentist appoinment."
IF she accuses you of doing the things that she is actually doing, just ignore.[/quote]
This is what she does. I will ignore it. Other people here who are saying I am the problem don't understand the context of the relationship. STBX is diagnosed NPD.
Some of us understand that your STBX has mental health issues and has bad behavior. However, it seems that you don't understand your role in your relationship, and your lack of empathy for your mentally ill wife says volumes. You desperately want us to believe that you're this perfectly rational person who's always on the side of right, but there's a reason you married someone with mental health issues who behaves badly. You want to cast her as the villain with you as the hero and you don't see how crazy YOU are to keep forcing this narrative even when you're divorcing. This is clearly more important to you than trying to create the best possible foundation for your children.
Get therapy to see your role in this, drop your end of the rope, show some compassion for the mother of your children, and try to build an amicable co-parenting relationship. Or just stay crazy. Your choice.
Assuming he has no mental disorders if his own and isn’t projecting here…
Good for him for filing for divorce. That is a big step, and likely means he has already grieved his lack of a life partner and marriage and this is the best of the bad options. He likely already tried talking, “compassion,” supports, interventions, paid help, etc. Mental disorders can bring down a whole family.
I hope he is in some support groups for spouses of such afflicted individuals.
There is light in the other side.
Don’t expect normal conversations with people with spectrum disorders (bps, bipolar, and /or ASD).
Know your truth. Be short and sweet. Keep a journal. Get your kids therapy so they know good and bad behaviors.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 12:44
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There are specific ways of communicating so as not to escalate.
My ex and I switched to email only for a while when things were contentious. Or you could use one of the communications apps for divorced parents.
Send brief informative messages related to the kids/logistics.
Edit your emails to remove unnecessary phrases that can be read as snarky. the "surely you can understand," "as we have discussed multiple times." Just say what needs to be said.
Let go of having the last word or calling out bad behavior. If she escalates, don't respond or only respond with essential info. "I will pick up at 5:00" or "yes, I can take Larla to the dentist appoinment."
IF she accuses you of doing the things that she is actually doing, just ignore.[/quote]
This is what she does. I will ignore it. Other people here who are saying I am the problem don't understand the context of the relationship. STBX is diagnosed NPD.
Some of us understand that your STBX has mental health issues and has bad behavior. However, it seems that you don't understand your role in your relationship, and your lack of empathy for your mentally ill wife says volumes. You desperately want us to believe that you're this perfectly rational person who's always on the side of right, but there's a reason you married someone with mental health issues who behaves badly. You want to cast her as the villain with you as the hero and you don't see how crazy YOU are to keep forcing this narrative even when you're divorcing. This is clearly more important to you than trying to create the best possible foundation for your children.
Get therapy to see your role in this, drop your end of the rope, show some compassion for the mother of your children, and try to build an amicable co-parenting relationship. Or just stay crazy. Your choice.
This is complete and utter bull. Had this poster said he was the wife, you lot would be falling over yourselves to tell 'her' to stand up for herself and that now 'she' didn't have to give in to 'her' spouse's crap any more and so on. He posted that he has stopped putting up with her crap and that she is being ridiculous about it. He hasn't been desperate or crazy or anything you said. The posters who are rational said the correct things - continue to hold your boundary, do not engage any more than necessary.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 12:35
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:There are specific ways of communicating so as not to escalate.
My ex and I switched to email only for a while when things were contentious. Or you could use one of the communications apps for divorced parents.
Send brief informative messages related to the kids/logistics.
Edit your emails to remove unnecessary phrases that can be read as snarky. the "surely you can understand," "as we have discussed multiple times." Just say what needs to be said.
Let go of having the last word or calling out bad behavior. If she escalates, don't respond or only respond with essential info. "I will pick up at 5:00" or "yes, I can take Larla to the dentist appoinment."
IF she accuses you of doing the things that she is actually doing, just ignore.[/quote]
This is what she does. I will ignore it. Other people here who are saying I am the problem don't understand the context of the relationship. STBX is diagnosed NPD.
Some of us understand that your STBX has mental health issues and has bad behavior. However, it seems that you don't understand your role in your relationship, and your lack of empathy for your mentally ill wife says volumes. You desperately want us to believe that you're this perfectly rational person who's always on the side of right, but there's a reason you married someone with mental health issues who behaves badly. You want to cast her as the villain with you as the hero and you don't see how crazy YOU are to keep forcing this narrative even when you're divorcing. This is clearly more important to you than trying to create the best possible foundation for your children.
Get therapy to see your role in this, drop your end of the rope, show some compassion for the mother of your children, and try to build an amicable co-parenting relationship. Or just stay crazy. Your choice.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 12:13
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:If you are smart, you'll be running a recorder every time she is in the same room as you. Years later, if you ever doubt why you got a divorce, you can listen to those recordings.
Yeah, walk around with a GoPro strapped to your chest. People tend to shut up and behave when they know they're being recorded.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 12:10
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Ok so then drop the expectations of a normal response from here is she’s Dx borderline.
Good luck with the custody battles. Hopefully she only wants a fun weekend here and there, when she can be her best self.
Good luck with the custody battles. Hopefully she only wants a fun weekend here and there, when she can be her best self.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 11:55
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:There are specific ways of communicating so as not to escalate.
My ex and I switched to email only for a while when things were contentious. Or you could use one of the communications apps for divorced parents.
Send brief informative messages related to the kids/logistics.
Edit your emails to remove unnecessary phrases that can be read as snarky. the "surely you can understand," "as we have discussed multiple times." Just say what needs to be said.
Let go of having the last word or calling out bad behavior. If she escalates, don't respond or only respond with essential info. "I will pick up at 5:00" or "yes, I can take Larla to the dentist appoinment."
IF she accuses you of doing the things that she is actually doing, just ignore.[/quote]
This is what she does. I will ignore it. Other people here who are saying I am the problem don't understand the context of the relationship. STBX is diagnosed NPD.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 11:16
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
There are specific ways of communicating so as not to escalate.
My ex and I switched to email only for a while when things were contentious. Or you could use one of the communications apps for divorced parents.
Send brief informative messages related to the kids/logistics.
Edit your emails to remove unnecessary phrases that can be read as snarky. the "surely you can understand," "as we have discussed multiple times." Just say what needs to be said.
Let go of having the last word or calling out bad behavior. If she escalates, don't respond or only respond with essential info. "I will pick up at 5:00" or "yes, I can take Larla to the dentist appoinment."
IF she accuses you of doing the things that she is actually doing, just ignore.
My ex and I switched to email only for a while when things were contentious. Or you could use one of the communications apps for divorced parents.
Send brief informative messages related to the kids/logistics.
Edit your emails to remove unnecessary phrases that can be read as snarky. the "surely you can understand," "as we have discussed multiple times." Just say what needs to be said.
Let go of having the last word or calling out bad behavior. If she escalates, don't respond or only respond with essential info. "I will pick up at 5:00" or "yes, I can take Larla to the dentist appoinment."
IF she accuses you of doing the things that she is actually doing, just ignore.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 11:11
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Op, pls get therapy so you don’t repeat this dynamic in any potential future relationships or with your children.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 10:09
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Just say "yes, I agree"
And then do your best to be kind while holding your boundaries. No name calling or accusing.
And then do your best to be kind while holding your boundaries. No name calling or accusing.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 10:06
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The problem comes in with me asserting myself and setting boundaries that STBX doesn’t honor. So, for example, is she is being condescending or mean in either words or tone and I call her on it, I’m not bring nice.
Ignore when she is being condescending. Just don’t react.
—advice from the XW of a narcissist
This.
Can’t tell if now you’re overly defensive at any comments or she’s nonstop baiting you, but just keep things civil and frankly your lawyer should have already advised you to mainly communicate via short emails and texts or via only lawyers.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 10:03
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The problem comes in with me asserting myself and setting boundaries that STBX doesn’t honor. So, for example, is she is being condescending or mean in either words or tone and I call her on it, I’m not bring nice.
Don’t call ter on it. It just escalates it.
+1. OP, you're still trying to punish her and prove to her how right you are in thinking she's an awful person. Just stop. You're getting a divorce so stop creating needless drama with her. You're STBX is right and you need to stop acting like a jerk for the sake of your kids.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 09:56
Subject: Re:I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
My spouse does this - says it first so as to exempt himself from the behavior he is pointing out. If you point out the hypocrisy, you are being defensive or just copying him. So, just say “yes, we should both try to be nice for the kids. I am happy with putting in the effort and I hope you do as well.”
Anonymous
10/13/2021 09:33
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
You can only control yourself OP. Your kids, who are watching, will, over the course of their whole lives not just this moment in time, come to their own understanding about their parents' relationship and why it didn't succeed and if that effects their relationship with you or their relationships with others.
And they will be a more unbiased judge than you think, because they love you both.
I know quite a few people who think their kids have been 'turned against' them but who in reality just acted like their divorce was a war and everyone had to take a side and the kids just couldn't handle it.
So be nice if you want or be mean if you want, but your kids will see who chose to be nice and who chose to be mean and it will shape who they choose to be close to. And it really doesn't matter if the meanness or the niceness is earned by your spouse, the question is if your kids deserve to see the meanness. And of course, they do not.
And they will be a more unbiased judge than you think, because they love you both.
I know quite a few people who think their kids have been 'turned against' them but who in reality just acted like their divorce was a war and everyone had to take a side and the kids just couldn't handle it.
So be nice if you want or be mean if you want, but your kids will see who chose to be nice and who chose to be mean and it will shape who they choose to be close to. And it really doesn't matter if the meanness or the niceness is earned by your spouse, the question is if your kids deserve to see the meanness. And of course, they do not.
Anonymous
10/13/2021 09:19
Subject: I Don’t Even Know How to Answer This
Anonymous wrote:The problem comes in with me asserting myself and setting boundaries that STBX doesn’t honor. So, for example, is she is being condescending or mean in either words or tone and I call her on it, I’m not bring nice.
Don’t call ter on it. It just escalates it.