Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 15:17     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We recently found out our child was not attending classes and stopped taking their medication. They spent last year doing remote and the school did nothing to help all those now sophomores on campus get to know each other etc like they do for freshman orientation. Basically another disappointment for the class of 2020.

We connected with their advisor who assured them that professors are there to help and they want to . Fast forward a little and the meetings with professors went well and things appear to be back on track. Without their professors reaching out to the advisor we would have never known until things couldn't be turned around.

Many schools put on the we take mental health seriously but they don't. They don't take substance abuse seriously or other conditions. I am hopeful this school will put more into the substance abuse and mental illness. time will tell but I am glad there are professors out there like you that recognize this.

Nobody chooses to be depressed yet there is that stigma that comes with it and this week apparently is mental health awareness week or something so all the schools are jumping on the bandwagon to check the box and then move on.


So you...contacted your child's college advisor?


No the advisor reached out to us after they received an email about attendance from the professor.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 15:17     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Even before Covid, I noticed an increase in serious mental health challenges among both undergrad and grad students in my classes and in the department as a whole. Based on conversations with colleagues, it seems to be occurring across the university. The university has some pretty good resources in place and the messaging from higher admin emphasizes supporting the students. But what I struggle with is maintaining standards. I have students who basically stop showing up to class, citing anxiety. They do not complete the work and do not do well on tests. In classes with papers instead of tests, they fail to turn the papers in. I have fairly generous makeup policies and let students drop their lowest test in the exam based courses. I try to use a variety of assessments so students' final grades do not depend on one or two very large assignments.

I reach out to the students who are not showing up and not turning in work and try to offer ways to help them get back on track. I also try to connect them to university mental health resources. But in many cases they either don't respond or want to try to make up work when it is way too late to turn things around. Even if I give them the opportunity to make up most of the work, it's just too much for them after getting so behind. Even giving a grade of Incomplete usually just delays the inevitable, as the challenges that were preventing the students from doing the work in the first place are often still in place a few months later. It just seems like a good proportion of these students would be better off withdrawing from courses rather than getting behind, feeling stressed about that, and still not ending up with a good grade in the end.

I personally think the biggest problem is that there is no good mechanism for students to recognize that college isn't working out at this time and to get their money back. The university doesn't allow a tuition refund unless the student drops quite early in the semester, before the student fully realizes they aren't keeping up. So the student feels like they have to stick with it because they have already paid for it, which I understand. It just feels like a problem with no real solution. I can't just pretend that my classes don't require any work for students experiencing mental health difficulties and give them a passing grade they haven't earned. I worry that the "it's ok not to be ok" messaging is leading some of them to believe it's ok to just stop communicating for weeks/months and that somehow it will all work out later. That is not reality in college nor is it the reality in the workplace.

Do you kids' universities have any effective solutions to this problem? I can't see my university changing their policy around tuition refunds but maybe some of us faculty need to start pushing for it somehow.


High school teacher here. I've noticed the same trends among students, but their parents also are different.

These kids have been shielded from failure for years. There is no sense or urgency and not much personal responsibility because there is no failing in high school: if they don't turn something in or don't study sufficiently, the teachers give second chances or retakes. If the student doesn't like the grade he/she earns and parents complain, admin will ensure that the teacher raises the grade. And the parents see the teacher as the one responsible for the child's grades, not the child herself. Everyone is intelligent and everyone should go to college, and if there are any struggles, accommodations and exceptions must be put into place.

Even ten years ago it was starting to change, but prior to that, things were much different.

This is the environment where your students were cooked and formed. They are your customers and they assume you will provide the product (grades).


I think this poster is free T. And it DOES not serve our children well.

My friend (who used to teach at a middle school that served wealthy families) told me that it was very common for parents to complain about their kids grades (to the administration), and the teacher being pressured to raise the grade. Even though the original was entirely justified.

I was appalled to learn this. Lots of blame here: bad parenting, spineless administrators and unethical teachers.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 15:13     Subject: Re:Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Kids with even mental health or learning disabilities can really struggle at college. They have barriers that they have to overcome to access the education the way it is delivered. Going back to in person classes after over a year of isolation is rough on all students. Freshman year is a big adjustment for most kids. The ones with LDs and mental health deal with those issues plus the barriers created by their affliction.

Once kids fall behind or start sinking, they often feel overwhelmed and just try to hide. They can’t see a track to get back on path. They can’t navigate the disparate and often uncoordinated offices that are there to help. For every 3 professors who are eager to help their students recover, there is one that will meet the student with terse annoyance and rigidity. The student in a mental health crisis will just shut down further and hide until the semester is over.

Colleges at the administrative level -Deans, advisor, student services , student health and student housing need a consistent and comprehensive approach to intervention. Professors need to take and report attendance. Professors need to not load the entire grade right before the mid term and final. There needs to be some type of assessment early enough to flag kids that are struggling. Professors need to have their syllabus, lectures, and assignments on the pms so a kid trying to get back on track can see what they need to do. The advisors need to be able to sit down with the student, look at the missing assignments with the student and help them come up with a priority plan.

Resident hall staff need to be part of the intervention. They will know the student and can check in. Students with mental health problems will often develop sleep disorders staying up all night and sleeping all day.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 15:02     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:We recently found out our child was not attending classes and stopped taking their medication. They spent last year doing remote and the school did nothing to help all those now sophomores on campus get to know each other etc like they do for freshman orientation. Basically another disappointment for the class of 2020.

We connected with their advisor who assured them that professors are there to help and they want to . Fast forward a little and the meetings with professors went well and things appear to be back on track. Without their professors reaching out to the advisor we would have never known until things couldn't be turned around.

Many schools put on the we take mental health seriously but they don't. They don't take substance abuse seriously or other conditions. I am hopeful this school will put more into the substance abuse and mental illness. time will tell but I am glad there are professors out there like you that recognize this.

Nobody chooses to be depressed yet there is that stigma that comes with it and this week apparently is mental health awareness week or something so all the schools are jumping on the bandwagon to check the box and then move on.


So you...contacted your child's college advisor?
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 15:00     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:Even before Covid, I noticed an increase in serious mental health challenges among both undergrad and grad students in my classes and in the department as a whole. Based on conversations with colleagues, it seems to be occurring across the university. The university has some pretty good resources in place and the messaging from higher admin emphasizes supporting the students. But what I struggle with is maintaining standards. I have students who basically stop showing up to class, citing anxiety. They do not complete the work and do not do well on tests. In classes with papers instead of tests, they fail to turn the papers in. I have fairly generous makeup policies and let students drop their lowest test in the exam based courses. I try to use a variety of assessments so students' final grades do not depend on one or two very large assignments.

I reach out to the students who are not showing up and not turning in work and try to offer ways to help them get back on track. I also try to connect them to university mental health resources. But in many cases they either don't respond or want to try to make up work when it is way too late to turn things around. Even if I give them the opportunity to make up most of the work, it's just too much for them after getting so behind. Even giving a grade of Incomplete usually just delays the inevitable, as the challenges that were preventing the students from doing the work in the first place are often still in place a few months later. It just seems like a good proportion of these students would be better off withdrawing from courses rather than getting behind, feeling stressed about that, and still not ending up with a good grade in the end.

I personally think the biggest problem is that there is no good mechanism for students to recognize that college isn't working out at this time and to get their money back. The university doesn't allow a tuition refund unless the student drops quite early in the semester, before the student fully realizes they aren't keeping up. So the student feels like they have to stick with it because they have already paid for it, which I understand. It just feels like a problem with no real solution. I can't just pretend that my classes don't require any work for students experiencing mental health difficulties and give them a passing grade they haven't earned. I worry that the "it's ok not to be ok" messaging is leading some of them to believe it's ok to just stop communicating for weeks/months and that somehow it will all work out later. That is not reality in college nor is it the reality in the workplace.

Do you kids' universities have any effective solutions to this problem? I can't see my university changing their policy around tuition refunds but maybe some of us faculty need to start pushing for it somehow.


High school teacher here. I've noticed the same trends among students, but their parents also are different.

These kids have been shielded from failure for years. There is no sense or urgency and not much personal responsibility because there is no failing in high school: if they don't turn something in or don't study sufficiently, the teachers give second chances or retakes. If the student doesn't like the grade he/she earns and parents complain, admin will ensure that the teacher raises the grade. And the parents see the teacher as the one responsible for the child's grades, not the child herself. Everyone is intelligent and everyone should go to college, and if there are any struggles, accommodations and exceptions must be put into place.

Even ten years ago it was starting to change, but prior to that, things were much different.

This is the environment where your students were cooked and formed. They are your customers and they assume you will provide the product (grades).
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:41     Subject: Re:Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
I have no solutions to offer, but I have finally accepted that my anxiety-riddled child with ADHD will not be attending college, at least not immediately after high school. It has taken me a while to come to grips with it, but your post only reinforces my conclusion.

I am very sad, although not surprised, to hear that it is a trend at colleges.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:37     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:During our campus visits, some schools discussed how they intervene if they feel someone is falling between the cracks. One said that the Dean of Students has been known to knock on a kid's dorm room door if teachers are reporting a patterns of not showing up for class. I found that reassuring (though my daughther did not seem like the type who would do that...still college was new for all of us).

I think people have to realize that health comes first. And people disabled by mental illness are sick. If your kid had cancer, you would not be worrying about their transcript. (I hope). Depression and eating disorders can have fatal consequences. If a child is too stricken to do their job (i.e. go to class, complete assignments), then they need intensive treatment and perhaps to take a break from college. Parents have to come to grips with that.
This sh#! is real.



I doubt THE Dean of Students is doing this. It's probably an RA or lower staff member. Still, people here complain about administrative bloat and they expect this amount of personal attention?


Well, she said, from a panel that she has been known to do it. Not sure it is important who does it. The point is that the school is not passive is inquiring about students' welfare.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:35     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:I don’t have any answers, but as the parent of a college student who is battling panic attacks and depression—some weeks better, some weeks worse—I want to thank the professors here who recognize these issues and are trying their best to help. My child certainly doesn’t expect to be given a break on grades, etc., but a little understanding and mutual respect does go a long way. She is truly trying her best to function in a system that is generally unforgiving. It is difficult for young adults who are eager to be independent to instead be struggling in a way that often requires help from counselors, psychiatrists, school staff/faculty, and parents.

Please know that your efforts to understand are greatly appreciated.


Maybe a child like this needs to attend college from home? OR at least when their existing support network is very close by.

At some point are you all just denying the severity of your child's disability? Instead of communicating that she can achieve her goals, but it may take a different path than some of her friends.

(PS-My sister is a physical therapist. She said that sometimes she feels so bad for preschoolers whose parents are forcing them to try to do things that they are not physically capable of. They think if the kid just tries harder or tries the latest thing they read online or they switch therapists. But it is almost abusive that they won't accept their child's limitations.) I am not saying that is analogous...but sometimes you have to stop pushing the boulder uphill and find an easier path.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:30     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:I don't think I they should get their tuition back, because then you'll see more slacking off.

I think part of the problem is that many kids are loaded with tutors in high school. Then they get into a top school and they're on their own. I think parents shouldn't start the tutoring in the first place so that kids end up in colleges they can handle and they learn to count on themselves.


AGREE.

I come from a MC family and was shocked when I learned (at a W school in Montgomery County) that when rich kids encounter any difficulty, their parents hire a one one one tutor.
With intensive one-on-one remediation, the kid usually pulls up their grade. But that is in no way a level playing field.

They have to either do the work, or ask the teacher for extra help (at lunch, like my kid did) OR accept that they are not going to a T 20school.
Those outcomes are ALL okay.

People on this site even discuss how to find tutors for kids away at college. People, this is not a sustainable plan longterm. Accept the child you have.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:28     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:I don't think I they should get their tuition back, because then you'll see more slacking off.

I think part of the problem is that many kids are loaded with tutors in high school. Then they get into a top school and they're on their own. I think parents shouldn't start the tutoring in the first place so that kids end up in colleges they can handle and they learn to count on themselves.


I think this is so on point. When we were in FCPS, it seemed like my kids with zero tutors (other than us advanced degreed parents) were an anomaly. It was almost like the K-12 teachers started to teach to the tutor. Meaning, it was assumed you would get your kids a tutor for each subject if they needed any help, and the classroom was merely a place to reinforce the concepts they should already know. That we never hired a tutor seemed to strike some teachers as odd, like who does that? Then we moved away and school became a lot more normal. Better.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:18     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Tuition gets complicated with kids on financial aid. Plus, it's not just about tuition, but the transcript as well - as I understand it, after drop/add period ends, any course withdrawal would be a W.

Also keep in mind the length of time it can take to even get an appointment with a provider, let alone find a treating solution and make headway on that path. And ruling out underlying medical stuff, which often people don't do. It all takes quite a lot of time.

Sorry OP, I have no solutions to offer. I do have a kid at a selective university struggling with various issues including anxiety and attention, major mystery physical issues underlying the situation, trying to get to the bottom. Insomnia and fatigue have been devastating. I know she isn't alone - just the other day she met someone who was struggling through last semester, ended up finding the solution (happened to be medical) over the summer, and is now doing great. Gives us hope, though there is a sense that something is off with health in this generation.

What might be nice: an easier process for a semester or year off from the university without having to fully withdraw/reapply.


PP if you read this, please check out tick infections for your DK if many other things are ruled out. They can be hard to pinpoint due to extremely faulty testing, but are often the cause of mystery illnesses (along with reactiviation of viruses and mold). Good luck!

PP here. Thank you- been immersed in a similar world (pans) with other family members, so this is a good reminder. The possible complexity is daunting, but we are slowly ruling things out, a little bit at a time.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:15     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
I don’t have any answers, but as the parent of a college student who is battling panic attacks and depression—some weeks better, some weeks worse—I want to thank the professors here who recognize these issues and are trying their best to help. My child certainly doesn’t expect to be given a break on grades, etc., but a little understanding and mutual respect does go a long way. She is truly trying her best to function in a system that is generally unforgiving. It is difficult for young adults who are eager to be independent to instead be struggling in a way that often requires help from counselors, psychiatrists, school staff/faculty, and parents.

Please know that your efforts to understand are greatly appreciated.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 14:02     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
Anonymous wrote:Tuition gets complicated with kids on financial aid. Plus, it's not just about tuition, but the transcript as well - as I understand it, after drop/add period ends, any course withdrawal would be a W.

Also keep in mind the length of time it can take to even get an appointment with a provider, let alone find a treating solution and make headway on that path. And ruling out underlying medical stuff, which often people don't do. It all takes quite a lot of time.

Sorry OP, I have no solutions to offer. I do have a kid at a selective university struggling with various issues including anxiety and attention, major mystery physical issues underlying the situation, trying to get to the bottom. Insomnia and fatigue have been devastating. I know she isn't alone - just the other day she met someone who was struggling through last semester, ended up finding the solution (happened to be medical) over the summer, and is now doing great. Gives us hope, though there is a sense that something is off with health in this generation.

What might be nice: an easier process for a semester or year off from the university without having to fully withdraw/reapply.


PP if you read this, please check out tick infections for your DK if many other things are ruled out. They can be hard to pinpoint due to extremely faulty testing, but are often the cause of mystery illnesses (along with reactiviation of viruses and mold). Good luck!
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 13:58     Subject: Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
We recently found out our child was not attending classes and stopped taking their medication. They spent last year doing remote and the school did nothing to help all those now sophomores on campus get to know each other etc like they do for freshman orientation. Basically another disappointment for the class of 2020.

We connected with their advisor who assured them that professors are there to help and they want to . Fast forward a little and the meetings with professors went well and things appear to be back on track. Without their professors reaching out to the advisor we would have never known until things couldn't be turned around.

Many schools put on the we take mental health seriously but they don't. They don't take substance abuse seriously or other conditions. I am hopeful this school will put more into the substance abuse and mental illness. time will tell but I am glad there are professors out there like you that recognize this.

Nobody chooses to be depressed yet there is that stigma that comes with it and this week apparently is mental health awareness week or something so all the schools are jumping on the bandwagon to check the box and then move on.
Anonymous
Post 10/12/2021 13:53     Subject: Re:Professor here -- curious to hear parents' perspective on this
This is a great post, and I hope people continue being kind.

I think so many kids are pushed and cultivated to be "perfect." They're cracking. COVID has made it a million times worse.

I have one child in college now, and of course I don't want it to go wrong. But -- if he needed to take a pause, or transfer -- I hope I would have the sense to let it happen.