Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 17:36     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
My mother is a manipulative narcissist. I set boundaries many years ago in order to maintain my emotional health and raise a family. I have a sibling who continues to live as an adult with her because my sibling couldn’t make it on her own.

Family dynamics are more complex than they might appear on the surface.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 17:32     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
I have never come across a family where the children “abandoned” the parents for no reason— only situations where the “abandoned” parents didn’t agree with the reason.

What the OP describes takes time and resources, not every adult child has either in abundance. I also think there is value in showing deep and genuine appreciation when your children do go out of their way for you— if they travel to you for holidays, they had other options, if they do something for your birthday and you sigh or are passive aggressive about it, it diminishes people’s willingness to keep putting themselves out there.

My mother had cancer a few years ago and we (siblings, niece and I) moved heaven and earth so we could have a family wedding at her bedside. Her friends went on about how lucky she was that her granddaughter did this for her...she is still complaining that more people from her extended family weren’t invited.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 17:14     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Often there is one person in the family who is thoughful and organized and takes the reins in planning a lovely event in honor of the parents). The others, assuming they also feel like the parent(s) deserve it, go along with the plans and participate/contribute.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 17:13     Subject: Re:How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:My next door neighbor is seriously mentally ill. Not sure of her diagnosis but growing up next to them for 18+ years, we saw what a completely dysfunctional family the were. Constant yelling, fights, people storming out, 8 year old grandchild coming to our house for help, the son driving out of the driveway with his fiancée hanging on to the hood of the car…you get the picture. Major problems. Yet, for every holiday, birthday, major event, Facebook is full of “spending Mother’s Day with the best mother ever!” pics, “family is everything and mine is the best!”, and variations on the theme. I just don’t get it. We know you. We know you’re nuts. You’re not fooling anyone.

Bottom line - as a PP said, no matter how great the kids seemed giving the eulogy or organizing the funeral, you have no idea what goes on behind closed doors.


True, although posting some silly Mother's Day fakery is a lot easier than pulling off an authentic and genuine memorial service.


I absolutely guarantee my neighbors kids would pull off a spectacular memorial service. Complete with the appropriate amount of grief and tears.


I guess my point is, not everything is fake just because it's emotional. Sometimes it really is genuine.


Sometimes people genuinely do love and care about each other despite dysfunction. They are not mutually exclusive. Given that the kids keep coming around a d bring the next generation makes it sound like there are solid relationships there.


In my case (I’m the original PP) they keep coming around because they rely on the mother for $$. She’s on 2 of the 3 kids mortgages. The third kid, who is quite well off, comes around once a year, if that. He had enough of her antics. If the other two pulled that, they’d have no one to help them out.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 16:47     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Hurt people create hurt kids. They in turn lash out and hurt those around them. Some families are in such a perpetual cycle of bullies and bullied. What this amounts to is people hurting each other as a way to feel good about themselves as they never learned to feel good and worthy on their own merit. If a parent was a bully, kids became the same as they are only thought that they are worthy by hurting others. Almost always, it comes to this. Kids abandon such parents bcs parents used them to feel good about themselves. Now, power structures have changed and adult kids are only doing what they grew up with. Hurting parents by abandoning them, so they can feel good. Their kids will do the same to them.
Breaking out of this bullying cycle might be hard.


I was with you until the bolded. I think instead what happens is that adult children recognize the cycle of abuse and attempt to set healthy boundaries, and this is viewed as "abandonment" by parents who are still stuck in the cycle of their own childhood trauma.

You are right that breaking out of this cycle is difficult. But it is sometimes made more difficult because people will indict you for wanting some distance from people who abused or neglected you as a child, and needing independence so that you can heal from your own trauma and ensure it is not passed on to your own kids. Viewing this process as abandonment of obligations to your parents makes it much harder to do. Which is why assuming that adult children are terrible and mean because they don't visit their parents more often can be a mistake. Everyone in this scenario is an adult and responsible for their own emotions. You cannot expect people to submit themselves to further abuse simply because it will prevent an older person from feeling lonely. I cannot fix what my grandparents did to my parents. But I can do something about what my parents did to me. It might mean I don't see them as much and that might hurt them. I have to take care of myself and my children. I am not lashing out at my parents -- the opposite really.


Yes, you are right. I thought of what I wrote and should have said some adult kids of such parents. I was about to post that not all kids of bullies end up being bullies, some do.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 16:45     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Even within the same family, you can see such major differences between siblings which makes me think it can’t be solely how one is raised. I


Agreed, I think people ascribe too much agency to parents. I'm the oldest and I know when my parents get older it will all be on me. Is it because I'm the only daughter? Is it because I'm the only neurotypical one? (I don't think so, at some point being being totally self centered is on you, not ADHD.) My brothers haven't been scarred or mistreated by our parents, I just can't see them going out of their way for anyone.


It's going to vary from family to family. I will say that coming from a dysfunctional family with a ton of abuse and neglect, there was a "golden child" dynamic with my older sister that persisted until my parents were in their 70s, and she had a similar attitude to this for a long time -- assumed the rest of us were just self centered and dumping the responsibility for our parents on her. But then she went to therapy (because my parents are a nightmare and being with them so much was causing huge problems for her) and she finally came to terms with the abuse in our family. Now all the siblings work together to make sure my parents have their basic needs taken care of, but none of us are taking on their mental health. They will move into a home soon and we'll visit and make sure the bills get paid. But I think at one point my sister assumed the rest of us were abandoning her to care for our parents on her own, and now she understands that we were simply holding firm boundaries to protect ourselves from further abuse. It was such a relief when she figured this out and now we can be a team.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 16:36     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:Even within the same family, you can see such major differences between siblings which makes me think it can’t be solely how one is raised. I


Agreed, I think people ascribe too much agency to parents. I'm the oldest and I know when my parents get older it will all be on me. Is it because I'm the only daughter? Is it because I'm the only neurotypical one? (I don't think so, at some point being being totally self centered is on you, not ADHD.) My brothers haven't been scarred or mistreated by our parents, I just can't see them going out of their way for anyone.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 16:25     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Yeah, my grandparents seemed nice on the surface but they did some really bizarre stuff to my mom. Like they threw my mom's.older sister a huge high school graduation party, then a year later, my mom was valedictorian and no one even came. This dynamic was pretty constant, my aunt could do no wrong my mom was never good enough. It started extending to us kids too, my cousin was perfect and my brother and I were bad. By the time my grandmother died when I was 10, I honestly hated her.

Some people are lucky to have good parents and some just don't.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 16:18     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:Hurt people create hurt kids. They in turn lash out and hurt those around them. Some families are in such a perpetual cycle of bullies and bullied. What this amounts to is people hurting each other as a way to feel good about themselves as they never learned to feel good and worthy on their own merit. If a parent was a bully, kids became the same as they are only thought that they are worthy by hurting others. Almost always, it comes to this. Kids abandon such parents bcs parents used them to feel good about themselves. Now, power structures have changed and adult kids are only doing what they grew up with. Hurting parents by abandoning them, so they can feel good. Their kids will do the same to them.
Breaking out of this bullying cycle might be hard.


I was with you until the bolded. I think instead what happens is that adult children recognize the cycle of abuse and attempt to set healthy boundaries, and this is viewed as "abandonment" by parents who are still stuck in the cycle of their own childhood trauma.

You are right that breaking out of this cycle is difficult. But it is sometimes made more difficult because people will indict you for wanting some distance from people who abused or neglected you as a child, and needing independence so that you can heal from your own trauma and ensure it is not passed on to your own kids. Viewing this process as abandonment of obligations to your parents makes it much harder to do. Which is why assuming that adult children are terrible and mean because they don't visit their parents more often can be a mistake. Everyone in this scenario is an adult and responsible for their own emotions. You cannot expect people to submit themselves to further abuse simply because it will prevent an older person from feeling lonely. I cannot fix what my grandparents did to my parents. But I can do something about what my parents did to me. It might mean I don't see them as much and that might hurt them. I have to take care of myself and my children. I am not lashing out at my parents -- the opposite really.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 16:02     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:I think a lot of it boils down to luck (just like good marriages). Some of the worst parents will produce some of the most amazing, respectful, and polished children and vice-versa with amazing parents producing lousy, entitled, and resentful children.



See this with DH who is so on the ball but his son is an alcoholic and manipulative to his own wife. I'm shocked by what I've heard from him (stepson) because DH has never displayed any of that crazy. I guess I'm lucky I married a good man.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 15:58     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Op your title is pretty inflammatory. Relationships are very complicated. I have been there for my parents for over 8 years, through the decline and death of dad and now dealing with some pretty atrocious behavior from mom which apparently isn't dementia. It forced me to really evaluate my childhood and come to terms with the fact she has always been explosive and emotionally abusive, it's just now she can't turn on the charm and smooth things over so easily and now slowly those who see her often are seeing it too. I have had to gradually back away to save my sanity and get professionals involved much to her rage. I suspect my the time she passes away if she isn't the death of me first, I will do the obligatory ceremony, but I will have nothing genuinely kind left to say. Abuse changes the brain. I don't know that I can lie and do some glowing tribute. I will just tell the religious person to do some generic sermon about her being a good perso since that is what she would want. Knowing her she might write her own eulogy and it would be very tempting when reading it to let everyone know she wrote it.That would speak volumes.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 15:53     Subject: Re:How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
Anonymous wrote:I'm one of the adult kids who abandoned my emotionally-disturbed and physically abusive mom in our home country. The other PP is right. Many people would tell me that my mom loves and misses me but none of them saw the times when she used to choke my neck, slap me, or grab me by my hair at home. She's older now and cannot touch me but she plays a great martyr and victim. Yes, she changed my diapers and kept me alive when I was a baby. But I feel like I have paid my dues by being her physical and emotional punching bag. I cannot stand being around her or even to talk to her on the phone. I moved to another continent and am so glad that she will never torment ever again. Flame away.


No flames. Just compassion. I’m sorry you had to endure that. Peace to you.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 15:08     Subject: How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
I think a lot of it boils down to luck (just like good marriages). Some of the worst parents will produce some of the most amazing, respectful, and polished children and vice-versa with amazing parents producing lousy, entitled, and resentful children.

Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 15:00     Subject: Re:How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
My mother is a manipulative, controlling, liar. The siblings that still circle around her are like flies on s#it.

Nothing is as it seems.
Anonymous
Post 09/26/2021 13:49     Subject: Re:How do some people luck out with great adult kids and others have kids who abandon them
I'm one of the adult kids who abandoned my emotionally-disturbed and physically abusive mom in our home country. The other PP is right. Many people would tell me that my mom loves and misses me but none of them saw the times when she used to choke my neck, slap me, or grab me by my hair at home. She's older now and cannot touch me but she plays a great martyr and victim. Yes, she changed my diapers and kept me alive when I was a baby. But I feel like I have paid my dues by being her physical and emotional punching bag. I cannot stand being around her or even to talk to her on the phone. I moved to another continent and am so glad that she will never torment ever again. Flame away.