Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And to the teachers out there - how much control do you want over your students? Do you believe that parents have no idea how to teach, what their kids need, and should simply shut up, like they wanted Mr. Baer to do, because he clearly has no right to be upset that his 9th grade daughter was assigned porn?

They wanted Mr. Baer to shut up because he had already been heard, his issue had already been addressed by the school district on the day it was brought up, and it was someone else's turn to express their thoughts and feelings on their own child's education.

As far as him having the right to "be upset", as a teacher I can't tell you how many times I have explained to children that they have the right to feel however they feel, but that right doesn't excuse them from adhering to rules of civil discourse including waiting for your turn to speak.

They bait parents into anger by screwing them over. THey meet on mundane issues for 90 minutes, then they give 15 minutes for comments on a topic that should be debated for hours! Then if you fight back, you are arresstsd.


Common Core is turning into a totalitarian regime. And you support that. Says a lot about you.

He went to his child's principal who said "you're right, we should have done what you asked" and fixed it before the day was out, before the meeting at which he was arrested. After he was arrested the school board took a step further than he appears to have asked for in making the book "opt in" rather than "opt out".

How are those the actions of a totalitarian regime? Seems like that's local control at it's finest. If you're implying that I support the idea that principals have the ability to act quickly and change things the same day a parent brings them to their attention, and that school boards listen to everyone who speaks at their meetings, even the assholes, and exacts sensible changes in response quickly, then yes, I support that.

Finally, what does this have to do with Common Core?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

And to the teachers out there - how much control do you want over your students? Do you believe that parents have no idea how to teach, what their kids need, and should simply shut up, like they wanted Mr. Baer to do, because he clearly has no right to be upset that his 9th grade daughter was assigned porn?

They wanted Mr. Baer to shut up because he had already been heard, his issue had already been addressed by the school district on the day it was brought up, and it was someone else's turn to express their thoughts and feelings on their own child's education.

As far as him having the right to "be upset", as a teacher I can't tell you how many times I have explained to children that they have the right to feel however they feel, but that right doesn't excuse them from adhering to rules of civil discourse including waiting for your turn to speak.

They bait parents into anger by screwing them over. THey meet on mundane issues for 90 minutes, then they give 15 minutes for comments on a topic that should be debated for hours! Then if you fight back, you are arresstsd.


Common Core is turning into a totalitarian regime. And you support that. Says a lot about you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I hate Common Core because the standards are unreasonable for children with learning disabilities and no allowance is made for them. They are a total afterthought. My child is the collateral damage is this guinea pig scheme, THAT HAS NOT BEEN FIELD TESTED. The standarrds increased the reading levels overnight, they wrap all the math requirements in a ton of language, and my son begs not to go to school everyday. THat enough reason for you?

It's also incredibly disingenuous (and downright dumb) to say that the Common Core standards are all nice and pretty, it's just the implementation/testing. This is like saying "Go ahead and marry Prince Charming, and forget about the fact that his axe-murder mother is moving in with you too.

Standards for general education will never be made, with special education students in mind. The fact that they cannot meet the grade level standards is precisely what qualifies them for special ed status.

As for your Prince Charming analogy -- it's like saying, Keep the nice guy, but do something about the axe murderer! Not, "Dump the Prince"

You don't get to do anything about the axe murderer. By law, he comes with the prince. NO QUESTIONS ALLOWED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anonymous wrote:

And to the teachers out there - how much control do you want over your students? Do you believe that parents have no idea how to teach, what their kids need, and should simply shut up, like they wanted Mr. Baer to do, because he clearly has no right to be upset that his 9th grade daughter was assigned porn?

They wanted Mr. Baer to shut up because he had already been heard, his issue had already been addressed by the school district on the day it was brought up, and it was someone else's turn to express their thoughts and feelings on their own child's education.

As far as him having the right to "be upset", as a teacher I can't tell you how many times I have explained to children that they have the right to feel however they feel, but that right doesn't excuse them from adhering to rules of civil discourse including waiting for your turn to speak.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:http://dianeravitch.net/2014/04/23/who-wrote-the-common-core-standards-here-is-a-list/

Here is a major part of the problem.

This is an example of "guilt by association". "The standards are bad because they were written by people who have ties to testing companies."

However, the actual standards they came up with are fine, at least as far as I can see; I'm a teacher who has to use them to teach, and I like the standards.

So this argument is moot to me. I don't care who write them; they are good. Not only that, but repeatedly people have been asking those who oppose Common Core standards to state which standards they think are inappropriate, and no one has been able to point to very many. When you read articles about why people dislike Common Core State Standards, over and over again, they do NOT state any particular standard as being bad; they dislike certain worksheets, or the test questions, or the fact that Race to the Top has certain requirements.

All of this leads me to believe that this group that gathered together (whatever their expertise) actually managed to design some pretty reasonable standards.

Have you considered that it's not the actual standards, but the reason the standards were created and by whom? And how the national testing related to the standards will create data points? And how those data points can be used and/or breached?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
http://dianeravitch.net/2014/04/23/who-wrote-the-common-core-standards-here-is-a-list/

Here is a major part of the problem.

Please explain -- starting with what the problem is, specifically

My problem is the same as Ravitch's problem. How many classroom teachers were involved?

No, that's not a problem. That's a question. Is your problem that the standards are bad because classroom teachers were not involved in their development?

Not the PP, but you can go back to my long post and read what the TX Education Commissioner said - they wanted him to sign onto acceptance before the standards were even written. Would you sign a contract without knowing the terms? Now ask yourself why not.

I've already pointed out how the national testing will standardize curricula over time (so if you think you will have freedom to meet the standards the way you want to as a teacher, think again). Now consider the mass data collection as a result of these tests. Congress's $787 billion dollar stimulus bill in 2009 included a large sum for the creation of national longitudinal data systems used to track a child's progress from preschool to college - actually straight through to his/her first job. The Obama administration used the creation of these data systems as a major consideration when awarding states extra K-12 aid. The National Center for Education Statistics (part of US Dept. of Ed) also worked with state officials to create a standard coding system so they could track students who move to a different state. Sounds innocuous, right? Those codes being tracked by the feds include roughly 400 data points, some of which are pretty sensitive, such as religious affiliation, medical conditions, discipline issues, family income and VOTING STATUS.

And behind your back, the US Dept. of Ed, in 2011, made a change to the Federal Educational Rights and Privacy Act to allow schools to release student records to third-party organizations WITHOUT PARENTAL CONSENT.

Not concerned? Consider that, in combination with CC standards, the stage has now been set for the private sector and federal government together to fundamentally transform (where have we heard that phrase?) the nation's educational system. Still not concerned? Consider the privacy breaches and subsequent exploitation due to hackers. Consider the use (and misuse) of predictive technology.

So the issue remains - do parents want their kids' future determined for them? Do the kids? Do teachers?

And to the teachers out there - how much control do you want over your students? Do you believe that parents have no idea how to teach, what their kids need, and should simply shut up, like they wanted Mr. Baer to do, because he clearly has no right to be upset that his 9th grade daughter was assigned porn?

As for your Prince Charming analogy -- it's like saying, Keep the nice guy, but do something about the axe murderer! Not, "Dump the Prince"

But, wouldn't you want to know a lot more about the Prince and how he was raised?

Anonymous wrote:

I hate Common Core because the standards are unreasonable for children with learning disabilities and no allowance is made for them. They are a total afterthought. My child is the collateral damage is this guinea pig scheme, THAT HAS NOT BEEN FIELD TESTED. The standarrds increased the reading levels overnight, they wrap all the math requirements in a ton of language, and my son begs not to go to school everyday. THat enough reason for you?

It's also incredibly disingenuous (and downright dumb) to say that the Common Core standards are all nice and pretty, it's just the implementation/testing. This is like saying "Go ahead and marry Prince Charming, and forget about the fact that his axe-murder mother is moving in with you too.

Standards for general education will never be made, with special education students in mind. The fact that they cannot meet the grade level standards is precisely what qualifies them for special ed status.

As for your Prince Charming analogy -- it's like saying, Keep the nice guy, but do something about the axe murderer! Not, "Dump the Prince"

Anonymous wrote:

Is your problem that the standards are bad because classroom teachers were not involved in their development?

I do think that is a part of the problem. It is not THE problem. I would think that anyone in the education field would have a problem with front line teachers being left out of the process.

I would actually respect your argument, if you said something like this:

The Common Core standards were developed without the input of practicing teachers. This is a problem, because as a result, standards X, Y and Z were developed. Standard X (count to X) is an inappropriate standard for K students, as many K teachers know. No matter what curriculum or methods are chosen, the vast majority of children are not developmentally able to count to X until they are in 3rd grade.

That's how you make an argument. You don't just pose questions (how many teachers....) You explain what you oppose, and why having teachers would have made a difference.

I hate Common Core because the standards are unreasonable for children with learning disabilities and no allowance is made for them. They are a total afterthought. My child is the collateral damage is this guinea pig scheme, THAT HAS NOT BEEN FIELD TESTED. The standarrds increased the reading levels overnight, they wrap all the math requirements in a ton of language, and my son begs not to go to school everyday. THat enough reason for you?

It's also incredibly disingenuous (and downright dumb) to say that the Common Core standards are all nice and pretty, it's just the implementation/testing. This is like saying "Go ahead and marry Prince Charming, and forget about the fact that his axe-murder mother is moving in with you too.

Is your problem that the standards are bad because classroom teachers were not involved in their development?

I do think that is a part of the problem. It is not THE problem. I would think that anyone in the education field would have a problem with front line teachers being left out of the process.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/eight-problems-with-common-core-standards/2012/08/21/821b300a-e4e7-11e1-8f62-58260e3940a0_blog.html

Here's someone with some different reasons not to like it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
http://dianeravitch.net/2014/04/23/who-wrote-the-common-core-standards-here-is-a-list/

Here is a major part of the problem.

Please explain -- starting with what the problem is, specifically

My problem is the same as Ravitch's problem. How many classroom teachers were involved?

No, that's not a problem. That's a question. Is your problem that the standards are bad because classroom teachers were not involved in their development?

(btw -- there are at least two of us right now who are arguing in favor of the Common Core Standards; not just one person).

Anonymous wrote:
http://dianeravitch.net/2014/04/23/who-wrote-the-common-core-standards-here-is-a-list/

Here is a major part of the problem.

Please explain -- starting with what the problem is, specifically

My problem is the same as Ravitch's problem. How many classroom teachers were involved?