Anonymous wrote:If your DH is working during the week and studying on weekends to the point you rarely get a break, when does he spend time with the kids?

If a woman did this (work + school) while having young kids she would be skewered for being a selfish mother. Heck, there are women being chastised for wanting to *gasp* drink a beer at a concert without kids.

Anonymous wrote:If your DH is working during the week and studying on weekends to the point you rarely get a break, when does he spend time with the kids?

If a woman did this (work + school) while having young kids she would be skewered for being a selfish mother. Heck, there are women being chastised for wanting to *gasp* drink a beer at a concert without kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a WOHM but unexpectedly SAH due to DC medical issue the past month. I was always very curious what it would be like. My job is very flexible and I had basically a year off with each kid to work from home, but I also had help so it wasn’t the full experience.

What surprised me most — 1) the tedium. Constant food preparation became mind numbing, and on top of that the cycle of laundry, tidying, etc. Each task was fine in itself but the feeling of always having another repetitive task to do was not restful. 2) missed my work. I loved the time I had with DC but I also felt like I wasn’t engaging other parts of myself. There was bliss and awe of all the little moments with DC, but if I’m honest, also restlessness and a frustrating lack of stimulation at times. 3) fragmentation of mental space. Especially missed the chance to have thoughts that last longer than a minute or two. My work involves lots of abstract thinking, teaching, research, engaging with art etc. and this was in some ways the polar opposite because I could never get a train of thought longer than 15 seconds. 4) Less patience for both children, because DC1 would come home at the end of a long day and I’d be emotionally spent. Days in general felt much longer. More of a “second shift” feeling once kids went to sleep. 5) identity shift, not in a good way. I felt such relief at the thought that I had another life besides this one, another world. My mind became a lot more anxious at home, somehow, as if it was focused on minutiae only and everything else fell away. I think it takes a certain kind of person to do such intense caretaking and support, day in and day out, and not lose him or herself.

It was a valuable experience, though, and probably cured my itch to do it full time. The grass is always greener.

OP here- this is incredibly helpful. I actually wish I could test drive being a SAH mom like this— part of me thinks I will share this experience, but the other side wonders if it would be more like those who posted earlier saying that after a 10 yr high pressure career, SAH was easy

PP here. So my career has been fairly competitive and high pressure despite the relative flexibility (academia at a top tier research university). I think part of the fantasy of SAH was getting away from that and being in the moment with the kids. At the same time I could not romanticize SAH because my mom did it and it was kind of a grind — she was a brilliant ambitious woman who was also a kickass homemaker and mother, but we could all tell she felt frustrated and undervalued. I tried to go into the experience with an open mind, as who knows that could just be my mom’s personality or issues and it doesn’t need to be me. But now I think I understand more the malaise that I see in many (not all) SAHMs. If you’re educated and not socialized to expect taking up a very domestic role, it’s a huge shift in identity and role.

I did this “experiment” under pretty ideal circumstances — partner was home some of the time, one easy toddler to enjoy. We spent our days literally watching stingrays at the aquarium, feeding chickens, making bread and graham crackers from scratch, checking out tadpoles at the nature center. So I think if I felt that way under those circumstances it’s a good gauge. I also think it’s very different with preschool age kids — they are a lot more restless and you start to get a lot more attitude and defiance and whining as they naturally differentiate their identity.

I did take away some positive things from the experience which I’ll try to incorporate going forward. I liked being physically at home so I will try to work from my home office. I liked having the morning outings and adventures, and now that I’m more senior I will flex my schedule for to do more of that during the week. Finally, I feel more secure in the fact that my bond is the same with my kids if I work or SAH. I’ve always wondered if that would change but honestly it is not. I am glad I had this time with DC2 but I am super close with DC1 and I see that the time on the weekend and after school is sufficient to maintain that bond. Also I see that more time is not necessarily more quality time. Having a babysitter and help around the house does give me more bandwidth to be patient, plan fun activities, and give more emotional attention to both.

Hope this helps OP— I know it’s tough to weigh!

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Anonymous wrote:Resentment to DH as stated upthread, but also the resentment towards WOH moms whose kids are in daycare. I'm sorry if I'm not feeling chipper and enthusiastic like you - You are "refreshed" and haven't been with your kids since the moment they work up like a SAHM. So, yea, I am a bit burnt out by the time it is 430pm - my kids have been awake for the last 8+ hours and bedtime isn't for another 4 hours. Those 12 hrs days get long even with screen time mixed in (gasp!), outings/playground/nature center, playdates, etc. 24/7.

Yeah, I'm so refreshed after a long day at work. If working is so easy why don't you just go back?

Ha. Not that pp, but I used to envy the adult conversation that dh had at work, as well as, his ability to focus on something for longer than 3 minutes w/o a baby or toddler interrupting him. I even envied his "alone time" during his commute into work.

I can laugh at it now but, at the time, when simply going to the bathroom all by myself was not easy those were some very real feelings.

Yes!! I cried last week when my husband returned from a business trip (four hours of sweet silence each way on the Acela) and casually showed me video of some dumb Grateful Dead cover band playing in a bar he’d gone to after his meetings. I can’t remember the last time I was at a bar, or saw live music that wasn’t kid-themed, or had a beer without one eyeball following a toddler around the room. I bawled like a crazy person and he didn’t get it. At all.

Like this thread points out there are so many things about my daily SAHM routine that I need to value now. But there are also issues of dignity and basic human needs that are so tough. I don’t poop alone, ever. I rarely get a full shower/blow dry. I have to ask permission and move mountains to go to the doctor. I feel like a servant, a nanny. My marriage has suffered.

I am also so grateful to lay with my kids while they nap, and to see our city through them, and to have found part time work that I’m proud of.

This is pathetic. Stop being a mommy martyr. Hire yourself a babysitter. Have date nights. Go and see live music. Have your hair done. You don’t have to give up your life because you have some kids. Eventually they will be in school. Then what?

It's a stage of life pp. They aren't little forever and you do get your freedom back eventually. Dh & I really didn't need to go out on date nights because once the kids were sleeping through the night we would put them to bed (7pm) and have the rest of the evening together. We made it work.

Flash forward a couple of decades later - dh and I do go bar hopping on occasion, we see live music, we even stay out overnight if we want to. It does get easier. But I still remember what it was like to be in the trenches of parenting small children.

Good job losing your identity!!!

The only people who feel that their identity is wrapped up in which concerts they see or how they consume alcohol are teenagers or adults who wish they were still teenagers.
Go be something, do something, or make something, pp. Stop identifying yourself by your favorite band.

So in your opinion the choices are:

1. Quit any hobbies, no date nights, minimal personal grooming

OR

2. Stay an adolescent identifying yourself by your favorite band??

It’s sad you see motherhood as so black or white. I enjoy my interests, regular date nights, nights out with friends and still spend time and money keeping up my appearance. I also love my children. It’s not either/or.

Becoming 100% about your kids doesn’t make you a better parent!!

You can go to concerts and out to eat when you have the time and the money without it being your entire identity. I don’t feel like I have lost myself if I don’t go to a concert in a while.
And identifying yourself primarily as a wife and mother (whatever that looks like to you) DOES make you a better parent.

You know it's not just about going to a concert every once in awhile. It's about valuing your personal interests outside of being a parent. Obviously you prefer the martyr route and relish the idea of self-sacrifice but I personally enjoy being a mother to a toddler and also a lot of other things in life.

I think you can value your personal interests without them serving as your entire identity. I would feel like I lost myself if my children and spouse left me. I like going rowing, and I missed it the years I had small kids and couldn’t go, but I didn’t feel like I lost myself or my identity. It sounds like you feel the opposite. You like your spouse and your toddler, and you would miss them if they moved away, but you wouldn’t feel like you lost yourself. You would feel like you lost yourself and your identity if you couldn’t go to concerts or drinking with friends.
I don’t consider myself a martyr, just an adult. And I do think you have an adolescent mindset typical of “16 and pregnant “ crowd.

Wow, your worldview is so warped and judgmental. You can mischaracterize me all you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.

Not that pp, but reread what you wrote and what prompted pp's reply to you. You come across as pretty darned judgmental yourself.

I think there were multiple posters. I don't think any of my comments were mean-spirited--I just wanted to point out that we don't have to see ourselves as sacrificing our "freedom" to parent young children. I continue to have personal interests outside of my child that, despite what the previous poster wants to believe, do not involve going to concerts or drinking. Although, more power to the moms who get to go to concerts! I'm just not cool enough.

You still have your own personal interests even after you have kids but unless you are able to drop your kids off with a regular sitter on a regular basis there is going to be a very real limit as to how often you will be free to pursue your own given interests. Sometimes you just plain have to wait until the kids are a bit older. It's not like you have kids and BAM! your whole life is over. But the reality is that little kids need a ton of supervision and unless you have a lot of excess income, you are not going to be able to SAH, AND outsource a lot of your childcare AND afford to go fun adult places and do fun adult things. It's just not practical.

Why do you need to afford childcare to go do fun adult things? Can’t your DH watch the kids once a week and give you a few hours on the weekend to go for a run, meet a girlfriend for brunch, read a book at a coffee shop, etc.? Just because you’re a SAHM doesn’t mean you’re on kid duty 24/7. I work, but even if I stopped working, I’d still expect DH to do his fair share outside of working hours. In dual income families, working parents still put in plenty of time with kids after work. I don’t understand SAHPs who let the working spouse off the hook for helping out just because they have a job. It’s totally possible to have a full time career and take care of the kids and house while your spouse gets a break.

If you are mommy 24/7 and not expecting your partner to give you a break, you’re doing it wrong.

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Anonymous wrote:Resentment to DH as stated upthread, but also the resentment towards WOH moms whose kids are in daycare. I'm sorry if I'm not feeling chipper and enthusiastic like you - You are "refreshed" and haven't been with your kids since the moment they work up like a SAHM. So, yea, I am a bit burnt out by the time it is 430pm - my kids have been awake for the last 8+ hours and bedtime isn't for another 4 hours. Those 12 hrs days get long even with screen time mixed in (gasp!), outings/playground/nature center, playdates, etc. 24/7.

Yeah, I'm so refreshed after a long day at work. If working is so easy why don't you just go back?

Ha. Not that pp, but I used to envy the adult conversation that dh had at work, as well as, his ability to focus on something for longer than 3 minutes w/o a baby or toddler interrupting him. I even envied his "alone time" during his commute into work.

I can laugh at it now but, at the time, when simply going to the bathroom all by myself was not easy those were some very real feelings.

Yes!! I cried last week when my husband returned from a business trip (four hours of sweet silence each way on the Acela) and casually showed me video of some dumb Grateful Dead cover band playing in a bar he’d gone to after his meetings. I can’t remember the last time I was at a bar, or saw live music that wasn’t kid-themed, or had a beer without one eyeball following a toddler around the room. I bawled like a crazy person and he didn’t get it. At all.

Like this thread points out there are so many things about my daily SAHM routine that I need to value now. But there are also issues of dignity and basic human needs that are so tough. I don’t poop alone, ever. I rarely get a full shower/blow dry. I have to ask permission and move mountains to go to the doctor. I feel like a servant, a nanny. My marriage has suffered.

I am also so grateful to lay with my kids while they nap, and to see our city through them, and to have found part time work that I’m proud of.

This is pathetic. Stop being a mommy martyr. Hire yourself a babysitter. Have date nights. Go and see live music. Have your hair done. You don’t have to give up your life because you have some kids. Eventually they will be in school. Then what?

It's a stage of life pp. They aren't little forever and you do get your freedom back eventually. Dh & I really didn't need to go out on date nights because once the kids were sleeping through the night we would put them to bed (7pm) and have the rest of the evening together. We made it work.

Flash forward a couple of decades later - dh and I do go bar hopping on occasion, we see live music, we even stay out overnight if we want to. It does get easier. But I still remember what it was like to be in the trenches of parenting small children.

Good job losing your identity!!!

The only people who feel that their identity is wrapped up in which concerts they see or how they consume alcohol are teenagers or adults who wish they were still teenagers.
Go be something, do something, or make something, pp. Stop identifying yourself by your favorite band.

So in your opinion the choices are:

1. Quit any hobbies, no date nights, minimal personal grooming

OR

2. Stay an adolescent identifying yourself by your favorite band??

It’s sad you see motherhood as so black or white. I enjoy my interests, regular date nights, nights out with friends and still spend time and money keeping up my appearance. I also love my children. It’s not either/or.

Becoming 100% about your kids doesn’t make you a better parent!!

You can go to concerts and out to eat when you have the time and the money without it being your entire identity. I don’t feel like I have lost myself if I don’t go to a concert in a while.
And identifying yourself primarily as a wife and mother (whatever that looks like to you) DOES make you a better parent.

You know it's not just about going to a concert every once in awhile. It's about valuing your personal interests outside of being a parent. Obviously you prefer the martyr route and relish the idea of self-sacrifice but I personally enjoy being a mother to a toddler and also a lot of other things in life.

I think you can value your personal interests without them serving as your entire identity. I would feel like I lost myself if my children and spouse left me. I like going rowing, and I missed it the years I had small kids and couldn’t go, but I didn’t feel like I lost myself or my identity. It sounds like you feel the opposite. You like your spouse and your toddler, and you would miss them if they moved away, but you wouldn’t feel like you lost yourself. You would feel like you lost yourself and your identity if you couldn’t go to concerts or drinking with friends.
I don’t consider myself a martyr, just an adult. And I do think you have an adolescent mindset typical of “16 and pregnant “ crowd.

Wow, your worldview is so warped and judgmental. You can mischaracterize me all you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.

Not that pp, but reread what you wrote and what prompted pp's reply to you. You come across as pretty darned judgmental yourself.

I think there were multiple posters. I don't think any of my comments were mean-spirited--I just wanted to point out that we don't have to see ourselves as sacrificing our "freedom" to parent young children. I continue to have personal interests outside of my child that, despite what the previous poster wants to believe, do not involve going to concerts or drinking. Although, more power to the moms who get to go to concerts! I'm just not cool enough.

You still have your own personal interests even after you have kids but unless you are able to drop your kids off with a regular sitter on a regular basis there is going to be a very real limit as to how often you will be free to pursue your own given interests. Sometimes you just plain have to wait until the kids are a bit older. It's not like you have kids and BAM! your whole life is over. But the reality is that little kids need a ton of supervision and unless you have a lot of excess income, you are not going to be able to SAH, AND outsource a lot of your childcare AND afford to go fun adult places and do fun adult things. It's just not practical.

Why do you need to afford childcare to go do fun adult things? Can’t your DH watch the kids once a week and give you a few hours on the weekend to go for a run, meet a girlfriend for brunch, read a book at a coffee shop, etc.? Just because you’re a SAHM doesn’t mean you’re on kid duty 24/7. I work, but even if I stopped working, I’d still expect DH to do his fair share outside of working hours. In dual income families, working parents still put in plenty of time with kids after work. I don’t understand SAHPs who let the working spouse off the hook for helping out just because they have a job. It’s totally possible to have a full time career and take care of the kids and house while your spouse gets a break.

If you are mommy 24/7 and not expecting your partner to give you a break, you’re doing it wrong.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Resentment to DH as stated upthread, but also the resentment towards WOH moms whose kids are in daycare. I'm sorry if I'm not feeling chipper and enthusiastic like you - You are "refreshed" and haven't been with your kids since the moment they work up like a SAHM. So, yea, I am a bit burnt out by the time it is 430pm - my kids have been awake for the last 8+ hours and bedtime isn't for another 4 hours. Those 12 hrs days get long even with screen time mixed in (gasp!), outings/playground/nature center, playdates, etc. 24/7.

Yeah, I'm so refreshed after a long day at work. If working is so easy why don't you just go back?

Ha. Not that pp, but I used to envy the adult conversation that dh had at work, as well as, his ability to focus on something for longer than 3 minutes w/o a baby or toddler interrupting him. I even envied his "alone time" during his commute into work.

I can laugh at it now but, at the time, when simply going to the bathroom all by myself was not easy those were some very real feelings.

Yes!! I cried last week when my husband returned from a business trip (four hours of sweet silence each way on the Acela) and casually showed me video of some dumb Grateful Dead cover band playing in a bar he’d gone to after his meetings. I can’t remember the last time I was at a bar, or saw live music that wasn’t kid-themed, or had a beer without one eyeball following a toddler around the room. I bawled like a crazy person and he didn’t get it. At all.

Like this thread points out there are so many things about my daily SAHM routine that I need to value now. But there are also issues of dignity and basic human needs that are so tough. I don’t poop alone, ever. I rarely get a full shower/blow dry. I have to ask permission and move mountains to go to the doctor. I feel like a servant, a nanny. My marriage has suffered.

I am also so grateful to lay with my kids while they nap, and to see our city through them, and to have found part time work that I’m proud of.

This is pathetic. Stop being a mommy martyr. Hire yourself a babysitter. Have date nights. Go and see live music. Have your hair done. You don’t have to give up your life because you have some kids. Eventually they will be in school. Then what?

It's a stage of life pp. They aren't little forever and you do get your freedom back eventually. Dh & I really didn't need to go out on date nights because once the kids were sleeping through the night we would put them to bed (7pm) and have the rest of the evening together. We made it work.

Flash forward a couple of decades later - dh and I do go bar hopping on occasion, we see live music, we even stay out overnight if we want to. It does get easier. But I still remember what it was like to be in the trenches of parenting small children.

Good job losing your identity!!!

The only people who feel that their identity is wrapped up in which concerts they see or how they consume alcohol are teenagers or adults who wish they were still teenagers.
Go be something, do something, or make something, pp. Stop identifying yourself by your favorite band.

So in your opinion the choices are:

1. Quit any hobbies, no date nights, minimal personal grooming

OR

2. Stay an adolescent identifying yourself by your favorite band??

It’s sad you see motherhood as so black or white. I enjoy my interests, regular date nights, nights out with friends and still spend time and money keeping up my appearance. I also love my children. It’s not either/or.

Becoming 100% about your kids doesn’t make you a better parent!!

You can go to concerts and out to eat when you have the time and the money without it being your entire identity. I don’t feel like I have lost myself if I don’t go to a concert in a while.
And identifying yourself primarily as a wife and mother (whatever that looks like to you) DOES make you a better parent.

You know it's not just about going to a concert every once in awhile. It's about valuing your personal interests outside of being a parent. Obviously you prefer the martyr route and relish the idea of self-sacrifice but I personally enjoy being a mother to a toddler and also a lot of other things in life.

I think you can value your personal interests without them serving as your entire identity. I would feel like I lost myself if my children and spouse left me. I like going rowing, and I missed it the years I had small kids and couldn’t go, but I didn’t feel like I lost myself or my identity. It sounds like you feel the opposite. You like your spouse and your toddler, and you would miss them if they moved away, but you wouldn’t feel like you lost yourself. You would feel like you lost yourself and your identity if you couldn’t go to concerts or drinking with friends.
I don’t consider myself a martyr, just an adult. And I do think you have an adolescent mindset typical of “16 and pregnant “ crowd.

Wow, your worldview is so warped and judgmental. You can mischaracterize me all you want if it makes you feel better about yourself.

Not that pp, but reread what you wrote and what prompted pp's reply to you. You come across as pretty darned judgmental yourself.

I think there were multiple posters. I don't think any of my comments were mean-spirited--I just wanted to point out that we don't have to see ourselves as sacrificing our "freedom" to parent young children. I continue to have personal interests outside of my child that, despite what the previous poster wants to believe, do not involve going to concerts or drinking. Although, more power to the moms who get to go to concerts! I'm just not cool enough.

You still have your own personal interests even after you have kids but unless you are able to drop your kids off with a regular sitter on a regular basis there is going to be a very real limit as to how often you will be free to pursue your own given interests. Sometimes you just plain have to wait until the kids are a bit older. It's not like you have kids and BAM! your whole life is over. But the reality is that little kids need a ton of supervision and unless you have a lot of excess income, you are not going to be able to SAH, AND outsource a lot of your childcare AND afford to go fun adult places and do fun adult things. It's just not practical.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My husband hoped I would become a SAHM, but when we discussed it before we got married he said it was my choice.

Good thing he said it was “your choice”. I can’t imagine going on a second date with a dude who clearly preferred SAHMs.

Why not? I told my DH about our 3/4th date that I hoped to be a SAHM. Luckily he was fine with that, or we wouldn’t have lasted. I’ve known forever I wanted this. I had a working mom and hated it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a WOHM but unexpectedly SAH due to DC medical issue the past month. I was always very curious what it would be like. My job is very flexible and I had basically a year off with each kid to work from home, but I also had help so it wasn’t the full experience.

What surprised me most — 1) the tedium. Constant food preparation became mind numbing, and on top of that the cycle of laundry, tidying, etc. Each task was fine in itself but the feeling of always having another repetitive task to do was not restful. 2) missed my work. I loved the time I had with DC but I also felt like I wasn’t engaging other parts of myself. There was bliss and awe of all the little moments with DC, but if I’m honest, also restlessness and a frustrating lack of stimulation at times. 3) fragmentation of mental space. Especially missed the chance to have thoughts that last longer than a minute or two. My work involves lots of abstract thinking, teaching, research, engaging with art etc. and this was in some ways the polar opposite because I could never get a train of thought longer than 15 seconds. 4) Less patience for both children, because DC1 would come home at the end of a long day and I’d be emotionally spent. Days in general felt much longer. More of a “second shift” feeling once kids went to sleep. 5) identity shift, not in a good way. I felt such relief at the thought that I had another life besides this one, another world. My mind became a lot more anxious at home, somehow, as if it was focused on minutiae only and everything else fell away. I think it takes a certain kind of person to do such intense caretaking and support, day in and day out, and not lose him or herself.

It was a valuable experience, though, and probably cured my itch to do it full time. The grass is always greener.

OP here- this is incredibly helpful. I actually wish I could test drive being a SAH mom like this— part of me thinks I will share this experience, but the other side wonders if it would be more like those who posted earlier saying that after a 10 yr high pressure career, SAH was easy

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a WOHM but unexpectedly SAH due to DC medical issue the past month. I was always very curious what it would be like. My job is very flexible and I had basically a year off with each kid to work from home, but I also had help so it wasn’t the full experience.

What surprised me most — 1) the tedium. Constant food preparation became mind numbing, and on top of that the cycle of laundry, tidying, etc. Each task was fine in itself but the feeling of always having another repetitive task to do was not restful. 2) missed my work. I loved the time I had with DC but I also felt like I wasn’t engaging other parts of myself. There was bliss and awe of all the little moments with DC, but if I’m honest, also restlessness and a frustrating lack of stimulation at times. 3) fragmentation of mental space. Especially missed the chance to have thoughts that last longer than a minute or two. My work involves lots of abstract thinking, teaching, research, engaging with art etc. and this was in some ways the polar opposite because I could never get a train of thought longer than 15 seconds. 4) Less patience for both children, because DC1 would come home at the end of a long day and I’d be emotionally spent. Days in general felt much longer. More of a “second shift” feeling once kids went to sleep. 5) identity shift, not in a good way. I felt such relief at the thought that I had another life besides this one, another world. My mind became a lot more anxious at home, somehow, as if it was focused on minutiae only and everything else fell away. I think it takes a certain kind of person to do such intense caretaking and support, day in and day out, and not lose him or herself.

It was a valuable experience, though, and probably cured my itch to do it full time. The grass is always greener.

OP here- this is incredibly helpful. I actually wish I could test drive being a SAH mom like this— part of me thinks I will share this experience, but the other side wonders if it would be more like those who posted earlier saying that after a 10 yr high pressure career, SAH was easy

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My husband hoped I would become a SAHM, but when we discussed it before we got married he said it was my choice.

Good thing he said it was “your choice”. I can’t imagine going on a second date with a dude who clearly preferred SAHMs.

He grew up with a SAHM and it’s what he knew and loved. Most big decisions are joint decisions in my marriage, but some things (like how much I work) are mine alone. If he wanted to cut back at work I’d respect his choice and we’d make it work.

Of course. Who doesn’t love a free live in cook, nanny and housekeeper??

Exactly. I’d love it too. His first preference would be for me to be a happy SAHM. But since that didn’t work out, he’ll take a happy WOHM over an unhappy SAHM any day of the week.