Anonymous wrote:I'm disappointed that more women with advanced degrees choose not to work.

Part of the reason for this is that there are few part-time professional positions for those with advanced degrees. I would love to keep working, but our family was too stressed with 2 full time WOH parents. I have not yet been successful at finding something part-time.

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Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

+ 1

I am a working mom and even I can see this. If you really don't care, you don't lash out the way these posters do. They take it so personally because they are obviously jealous. That's the only logical explanation. Me? I have no choice but to work. If I don't work, we don't eat. Kids gotta eat. So I don't have any mixed emotions about it. That makes it easier to see that everyone is doing what's best for them and not take it personally.

Isn't this backwards? If you have the choice to work or not, what would you be jealous of? What would they have mixed emotions about? I worked hard to get where am I in life. If I wanted to do what SAHMs do, I would do that--but I don't want it. If I'm critical, it's about posts that say that they are doing better by their kids than I am. I'm not jealous that they are better moms than me--I'm annoyed that they are more self-righteous.

The people who are unsure about their choice, maybe deep down, lady out at others. Otherwise, if you (general you not you specifically) really truly don't care, why would you write such angry, bitter things?

Exactly this. Exactly, exactly this. That tells us ALL we need to know.

I think the correct term should be "professional wife". Most of my friends who are at home are certainly this. They devote far more attention to their husbands than I do. DH doesn't seem to mind but I can imagine for some men, that level of attention would be flattering.

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Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

+ 1

I am a working mom and even I can see this. If you really don't care, you don't lash out the way these posters do. They take it so personally because they are obviously jealous. That's the only logical explanation. Me? I have no choice but to work. If I don't work, we don't eat. Kids gotta eat. So I don't have any mixed emotions about it. That makes it easier to see that everyone is doing what's best for them and not take it personally.

Isn't this backwards? If you have the choice to work or not, what would you be jealous of? What would they have mixed emotions about? I worked hard to get where am I in life. If I wanted to do what SAHMs do, I would do that--but I don't want it. If I'm critical, it's about posts that say that they are doing better by their kids than I am. I'm not jealous that they are better moms than me--I'm annoyed that they are more self-righteous.

The people who are unsure about their choice, maybe deep down, lady out at others. Otherwise, if you (general you not you specifically) really truly don't care, why would you write such angry, bitter things?

I'm disappointed that more women with advanced degrees choose not to work.

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Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

Hmm, someone is irrationally bitter and angry here about total strangers. Lighten up, lady.

I'm not bitter and angry about anything, just pointing out an observation.

Really? your writing sure makes you sound that way. Feeling the need to lash out at strangers with a diatribe of insults isnt't the way calm confident people react.

Looks like we've found one of our bitter, angry, jealous dcum wohms!

Actualyy I stay at home. But folks like you who are always hurling insults make us look bad. I don't think wohm are bitter, angry or jealous, I just think they made different choices and the fact that they did so doesn't make me insecure with my own choices,

SAHM here, who worked for 20 years before having first child. I call myself a domestic engineer/cash flow manager.

My oldest is 16, and I have no intentions of going back to the workplace at age 58. I do plan to continue volunteering at my kids' schools, going to pilates and other workouts daily, and dealing with typical household issues (finances, contractors, etcl. By the time my youngest finishes high school, I will be at a typical retirement age, so that is what I shall do.

Frankly, I don't care what people think. I worked for 20 years with no prospects of marriage or kids and at age 40, all of that changed. I wouldn't change a thing and do not miss the politics and stress of the corporate world. I love that I am there for all of my kids' school events and available to them whenever they need me. No regrets at all.

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Anonymous wrote:I'd let someone in feminist PR know that there are fake feminists abounding on DCUM then- the cruelest comments I've seen made to SAHM have been from self proclaimed feminists on this board.

Really? People are saying, "I'm a feminist, and I think that [cruel comments about women without paid employment and with children at home]?" I don't remember seeing many of those, and I spend way too much time on DCUM.

Np here.
Believe it. There's s lot of sahm bashing.
But I'll say it has gotten better.

There have been times I've posted asking for advice perhaps, and I leave out the part about me being a sahm. My status would be relevant but I leave it out (I say I work part time if necessary). This is based on past threads, when I have revealed I'm a sahm, where I get very unhelpful comments.

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Back in the day when everyone had a SAHM and everyone's dad worked 30/40 years for the same company and they lived in the same house with the same neighbors....and you really could shoo your kids out the door in the morning and tell them to be back before dark because you knew every person on your street and everyone knew you, anything that a kid did would get back to their parents.....yeah, that was a different reality.

Times have changed.

Everyone didn't, actually. Every (or almost every) middle-class US-born white family did.

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Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

Hmm, someone is irrationally bitter and angry here about total strangers. Lighten up, lady.

I'm not bitter and angry about anything, just pointing out an observation.

Really? your writing sure makes you sound that way. Feeling the need to lash out at strangers with a diatribe of insults isnt't the way calm confident people react.

Looks like we've found one of our bitter, angry, jealous dcum wohms!

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Anonymous wrote:I think we can all agree that raising children in the year 2017 is a lot more work than doing it in 1957. Back then the emphasis was much more on adult relationships and everything revolved around the man's needs. Now it revolves around the children. Uou used to shoo them outside and make them play on their own all day. Now you are supposed to be actively engaging and enriching them for most of the day, shuttling them around to various activities, hosting "play dates" (a word that probably did not even exist in 1957), making sure everything they eat is organic and homemade, etc. etc.

Back in the day when everyone had a SAHM and everyone's dad worked 30/40 years for the same company and they lived in the same house with the same neighbors....and you really could shoo your kids out the door in the morning and tell them to be back before dark because you knew every person on your street and everyone knew you, anything that a kid did would get back to their parents.....yeah, that was a different reality.

Times have changed.

Right which is why the language we use has changed as well. That's my point. Back in the day, your main concern as a housewife was keeping the house clean and making sure hubby was happy. Now it's about being a cruise director for kids. Different world.

Cruise director for kids? No wonder kids today can't think for themself. Regardless of whether one works, I hope very few folks actually think this is a description of good parenting.

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Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

+ 1

I am a working mom and even I can see this. If you really don't care, you don't lash out the way these posters do. They take it so personally because they are obviously jealous. That's the only logical explanation. Me? I have no choice but to work. If I don't work, we don't eat. Kids gotta eat. So I don't have any mixed emotions about it. That makes it easier to see that everyone is doing what's best for them and not take it personally.

Isn't this backwards? If you have the choice to work or not, what would you be jealous of? What would they have mixed emotions about? I worked hard to get where am I in life. If I wanted to do what SAHMs do, I would do that--but I don't want it. If I'm critical, it's about posts that say that they are doing better by their kids than I am. I'm not jealous that they are better moms than me--I'm annoyed that they are more self-righteous.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

Hmm, someone is irrationally bitter and angry here about total strangers. Lighten up, lady.

I'm not bitter and angry about anything, just pointing out an observation.

Really? your writing sure makes you sound that way. Feeling the need to lash out at strangers with a diatribe of insults isnt't the way calm confident people react.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I completely agree with you- talk about societal changes all you want- but alll of my working friends are the default parent on top of working full time- nothing about that is appealing to me. It's why I SAH.

Bingo. I actually think the product of women's lib actually made it worse for a lot of moms. Saturated employment market, reduced salaries, but now have the cost/burden of childcare.

Families used to get on just fine on one income. Not so these days. And, yes, mom is still the default parent or primary caregiver 8/10.

So I guess we still need more women's lib.

Or we can acknowlwdge that people have different strengths, set up our families in ways that work for us, and stop pretending that different can't be even more wonderful than pretending we are all the exact same to achieve "equality".

That actually is women's lib. I'm glad that we agree.

Really? Because you seem upset whenever women say they stay home with their kids. And And God forbid they *enjoy* it.

How do yo know this? We're all Anonymous here on this forum.

Omg dcum is LOADED with bitter, angry, hateful working moms who constantly lash out at sahms. They are jealous. They pretend they aren't, but they are. There are a handful of working moms who don't care who works and who sah, but most of the wohm on dcum are bitter, jealous, and angry.

I stayed home until child started school and then started working part time. I still work part time and handle all of the stuff I did as a sahm, just not the same quality as I did when I was home. I'm currently looking to work full time, I imagine things will change when that happens. I'll need more help since I'll be working more hours outside the home. I see a lot of value in the work that sahms do. Especially the quality of childcare.

Hmm, someone is irrationally bitter and angry here about total strangers. Lighten up, lady.

I'm not bitter and angry about anything, just pointing out an observation.

Anonymous wrote:I'd let someone in feminist PR know that there are fake feminists abounding on DCUM then- the cruelest comments I've seen made to SAHM have been from self proclaimed feminists on this board.

Really? People are saying, "I'm a feminist, and I think that [cruel comments about women without paid employment and with children at home]?" I don't remember seeing many of those, and I spend way too much time on DCUM.