Anonymous wrote:I think PSU is a pretty icky institution, but I think this could have happened at any frat house at any large, Greek-heavy U across the country, so I think the more germane question is what exactly is it in our culture that drives college students to binge drink/have the attitude that fun=getting shitfaced in some hot basement.

our culture forces people to cope with self-medication. it just isn't college kids. american culture is poison.

my sister was working in big tech out west and was always getting super high non stop on pot and partying on molly/mdma on the weekends. many of her co-workers were alcoholics and other addicts.

she recently left and moved to spain and cleaned up overnight. just more relaxed. the whole atmosphere is more conducive to a life that doesn't required self medication.

I think PSU is a pretty icky institution, but I think this could have happened at any frat house at any large, Greek-heavy U across the country, so I think the more germane question is what exactly is it in our culture that drives college students to binge drink/have the attitude that fun=getting shitfaced in some hot basement.

I doubt a reasonable person would judge alumni based upon what happened.

I know many other schools have better reputations, but most employers care a LOT more about your work experience, skills, etc. It helps at first, but 10 years down the road, not so much.

Have they power washed that place yet?

I went to Penn State OOS in late 80s. I went because it was reasonably priced, had a good program for my major and was far enough away from home. I didn't even know they had a football team, much less a championship team--and I was accepted in January '87. I really loved it and felt I received a good education. But unlike many of my friends who still bleed blue and white, wear PSU gear every day, take RV trips up for games, and are sending their kids there from out of state, I don't exactly volunteer that I attended anymore and am disgusted by what happened and how many chose to deal with it. But I do continue to support THON--that is something I am proud to have been a part of.

PSU is definitely not cheap OOS, unlike some other, more affordable, state flagships (FSU/UF, Bama). Unless you live in PA, get recruited for athletics, or get some kind of amazing scholarship, I don't get the OOS appeal.

When I run across a PSU grad and in conversation it comes out that they’re from Pa – I don’t think anything of the fact that they went to PSU. Reality is for the last 10-15 yrs, college is about chasing the money for most middle class families; I mean middle class like a family of 4 in Pa. living on 70k, not DCUM middle class of 300k HHIs. Sure Pa. also has Pitt and Temple as state schools, but reality is that sometimes the most merit aid and grants that you get come from your state flagship – which is PSU. So I think nothing of it bc who knows what their/their family situation was at the time they went to college.

But I do give a side eye to kids choosing to go to PSU from out of state AND most importantly in this area – all the PSU grads who are still over the moon about the school and want their kids to go there. Even despite the Sandusky issue and this involuntary manslaughter at the frat – I could understand if an alum looked back fondly at their PSU time bc they met their spouse or their best friends there or whatever. But I know DMV area PSU alums (well into their 40s) who are still obsessed with PSU in that – PSU FOR LIFE – kind of way. They are sporting the gear all the time; their cars have all the stickers; they are traveling to Pa. every weekend for home football games; traveling to Big 10 championships and bowl games. And most of all they are dressing their elementary school kids in PSU gear and constantly talking about – when you go to PSU – so as to get them in that mindset young. Then I’m like – uh you do see some negatives over there, don’t you? (And often they don’t – there’s always an excuse for how PSU is right and everyone else is a hater). And what gets me is that their kids won’t be choosing PSU for the money – it’s OOS so Md./Va schools would be cheaper plus these families make 300k+ so it isn’t about – well this school is offering me $1000 more in money than that school.

Any Penn State grad has an asterisk by their name from now on.

Anonymous wrote:This horrifying death probably could have happened at any frat house in the country. There is a certain class of people raising their sons to be self-centered douchebags and you can recognize the future frat boys from about 8th grade. If my son even wanted to join a frat, I would think I had done something wrong as a parent.

But yeah, this does not help Penn State's reputation. I hope all of those men are prosecuted and receive the maximum sentence. I can't believe that not a single one had the guts to take a cell phone into another room and dial 911.

All the helicopter parenting is enough to drive anybody to drink once they escape to college. It makes me sad that kids are so joy-less and haven't had any fun or adventure until they are 20. No wonder they don't leave the house until 30.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This horrifying death probably could have happened at any frat house in the country. There is a certain class of people raising their sons to be self-centered douchebags and you can recognize the future frat boys from about 8th grade. If my son even wanted to join a frat, I would think I had done something wrong as a parent.

But yeah, this does not help Penn State's reputation. I hope all of those men are prosecuted and receive the maximum sentence. I can't believe that not a single one had the guts to take a cell phone into another room and dial 911.

Except the max sentence in Pa is 5 yrs - so if they even get the max they'll be out by 25ish and then I'm sure there are enough cult like alums of that school who will be quick to offer jobs bc they'll feel like it was just a drinking night on good fun that went wrong and these guys were unfairly blamed. White boys come out of these scandals doing just fine - someone either hooks them up with a job or their parents help them start a small business and all is behind them in a few yrs.

Meaning max sentence for involuntary manslaughter. For the guys just charged w providing alcohol etc - it's much much less.

Anonymous wrote:This horrifying death probably could have happened at any frat house in the country. There is a certain class of people raising their sons to be self-centered douchebags and you can recognize the future frat boys from about 8th grade. If my son even wanted to join a frat, I would think I had done something wrong as a parent.

But yeah, this does not help Penn State's reputation. I hope all of those men are prosecuted and receive the maximum sentence. I can't believe that not a single one had the guts to take a cell phone into another room and dial 911.

Except the max sentence in Pa is 5 yrs - so if they even get the max they'll be out by 25ish and then I'm sure there are enough cult like alums of that school who will be quick to offer jobs bc they'll feel like it was just a drinking night on good fun that went wrong and these guys were unfairly blamed. White boys come out of these scandals doing just fine - someone either hooks them up with a job or their parents help them start a small business and all is behind them in a few yrs.

Pitt has 9 national championships. Penn State has 2. Pitt would drop the football program for the catastrophe that occurred at penn state. Any normal school would.

At least the young man was 19. I'm sure the others were drunk too and scared to death. Doesn't excuse it but it's not like the horror that is the holocaust football team that runs the school (and isn't even very good with only 2 championships ever. Even U.md has 1.5 championships and doesn't even try).

This horrifying death probably could have happened at any frat house in the country. There is a certain class of people raising their sons to be self-centered douchebags and you can recognize the future frat boys from about 8th grade. If my son even wanted to join a frat, I would think I had done something wrong as a parent.

But yeah, this does not help Penn State's reputation. I hope all of those men are prosecuted and receive the maximum sentence. I can't believe that not a single one had the guts to take a cell phone into another room and dial 911.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP - Hazing death at Penn State fraternity.

That's such a sad story and the idea that these kids waited 12 hours before seeking help us incomprehensible. Terrible culture at that school.....just awful.

Mores sad details.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/05/06/shocking-final-hours-timothy-piazzas-life/312187001/