Anonymous
Post 06/24/2016 05:49     Subject: Re:Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I think that smart, accomplished women overestimate how much a man will value her education and professional experience. In fact, I think that men feel threatened by women who are more successful. It stings when a man at your level prefers a state school sorority bunny.


Smart, accomplished women learn early on in life - for me, it was in 8th grade - that you need to look for that true gem of a man who is not only not threatened by an intelligent, successful woman, but who seek that type of woman out.


I must be the only smart, accomplished woman who had no dating trouble. I'm a national merit scholar who skipped three grades, became a big law attorney at 22 after getting a master's in chemistry. I have a bunch of other accomplishments. I always had a boyfriend and was married by 28. If anything, my smarts attracted men. Maybe it's that I'm super domestic? Or that I'm foreign (but married an American white guy)? I just never found that most men found my accomplishments unattractive.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2016 04:26     Subject: Re:Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:In my office, all the high ranking women are 2nd wives with step-children and no biological kids of their own. The one who did get married and had twins, divorced her husband because she was making more than him.

It is very easy to say "Lean In", but nothing in the corporate world actually encourage that and motherhood.


This is what it comes down to, and this is what so pisses me off about the mommy wars (which, frankly, this thread seems to be a spin-off of). It's difficult to get a good, "real" job without a solid education. Because of parental abuse, I became independent in my late teens and worked in restaurants for over a decade while I went to school very part-time and supported myself. Even though I did earn a degree, at 30, I was married with a young child at that point and had very limited options for starting a career that would offset the cost of daycare. It would have been more expensive for my family for me to work and pay a daycare bill earning what I could as a bartender than it has been for me to just stay home. Bartending also doesn't really fit the narrative of family life for me (long and odd hours, physical labor, questionable work environment).

The mommy wars presuppose that all working mothers have a high earning capacity or a professional career to continue building. It doesn't take into account the experiences of working class women, like me, for whom work has not historically been glamorous nor well-paying. Having a degree now feels pointless. It's one thing to say that we, as a society, seek to create opportunities for educated women. However, in a case like mine, this feels like cheap talk: realistically speaking, how am I to build a career that's truly worth it to me and my family?


1+

I am going through the same thing.
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2016 03:41     Subject: Re:Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:In my office, all the high ranking women are 2nd wives with step-children and no biological kids of their own. The one who did get married and had twins, divorced her husband because she was making more than him.

It is very easy to say "Lean In", but nothing in the corporate world actually encourage that and motherhood.


This is what it comes down to, and this is what so pisses me off about the mommy wars (which, frankly, this thread seems to be a spin-off of). It's difficult to get a good, "real" job without a solid education. Because of parental abuse, I became independent in my late teens and worked in restaurants for over a decade while I went to school very part-time and supported myself. Even though I did earn a degree, at 30, I was married with a young child at that point and had very limited options for starting a career that would offset the cost of daycare. It would have been more expensive for my family for me to work and pay a daycare bill earning what I could as a bartender than it has been for me to just stay home. Bartending also doesn't really fit the narrative of family life for me (long and odd hours, physical labor, questionable work environment).

The mommy wars presuppose that all working mothers have a high earning capacity or a professional career to continue building. It doesn't take into account the experiences of working class women, like me, for whom work has not historically been glamorous nor well-paying. Having a degree now feels pointless. It's one thing to say that we, as a society, seek to create opportunities for educated women. However, in a case like mine, this feels like cheap talk: realistically speaking, how am I to build a career that's truly worth it to me and my family?
Anonymous
Post 06/24/2016 03:24     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think this is true of most men. I think many professional men want to be with a professional woman even though they might have a more mommy-track professional job that's not quite as demanding as theirs. It's a lot of pressure to be the sole breadwinner even if you're making a ton. Plus I think many ambitious men are attracted to ambitious women and would be much less attracted to someone who is very smart and highly educated that's content with being a dog walker.


Nah. You are projecting your desires onto men.


Sounds like it. If ambitious equates to unavailable because of work and/or ball-buster, ambitious isn't even a good thing in a woman I might meet. The smart dog walker looks more attractive.


Yikes. Well I'm glad I married my DH and not someone with your attitude. If you have a daughter please don't teach her that ambition is an unattractive quality in a woman.


Nothing wrong with it unless she wants to get married and have children.


And stay home and not work


Nah, it's a problem even if she wants to keep working. Ambitious woman is going to have trouble finding a man and breeding.

Do you think Michelle Obama had difficulty dating? Did Hillary?


Not to belabor the point, because I know education, pedigree, and success is likely important to Bill and Barack, but please keep in mind: these men are politicians. Of course they're going to marry women that reflect well on them in terms of Ivy education and career success. They're strategic and image-obsessed - no way in hell would they have married a waitress.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 23:09     Subject: Re:Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
In my office, all the high ranking women are 2nd wives with step-children and no biological kids of their own. The one who did get married and had twins, divorced her husband because she was making more than him.

It is very easy to say "Lean In", but nothing in the corporate world actually encourage that and motherhood.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 23:04     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think this is true of most men. I think many professional men want to be with a professional woman even though they might have a more mommy-track professional job that's not quite as demanding as theirs. It's a lot of pressure to be the sole breadwinner even if you're making a ton. Plus I think many ambitious men are attracted to ambitious women and would be much less attracted to someone who is very smart and highly educated that's content with being a dog walker.


Nah. You are projecting your desires onto men.


Sounds like it. If ambitious equates to unavailable because of work and/or ball-buster, ambitious isn't even a good thing in a woman I might meet. The smart dog walker looks more attractive.


Yikes. Well I'm glad I married my DH and not someone with your attitude. If you have a daughter please don't teach her that ambition is an unattractive quality in a woman.


Nothing wrong with it unless she wants to get married and have children.


And stay home and not work


Nah, it's a problem even if she wants to keep working. Ambitious woman is going to have trouble finding a man and breeding.

Do you think Michelle Obama had difficulty dating? Did Hillary?
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 23:01     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think this is true of most men. I think many professional men want to be with a professional woman even though they might have a more mommy-track professional job that's not quite as demanding as theirs. It's a lot of pressure to be the sole breadwinner even if you're making a ton. Plus I think many ambitious men are attracted to ambitious women and would be much less attracted to someone who is very smart and highly educated that's content with being a dog walker.


Nah. You are projecting your desires onto men.


Sounds like it. If ambitious equates to unavailable because of work and/or ball-buster, ambitious isn't even a good thing in a woman I might meet. The smart dog walker looks more attractive.


Yikes. Well I'm glad I married my DH and not someone with your attitude. If you have a daughter please don't teach her that ambition is an unattractive quality in a woman.


Nothing wrong with it unless she wants to get married and have children.


And stay home and not work


Nah, it's a problem even if she wants to keep working. Ambitious woman is going to have trouble finding a man and breeding.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 22:56     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Plus for men....All they really care for are good looks.

Look at all the successful men that had relationships w/their children's nannies for instance.

Etc.

Point proven.


To refute your point, Arnold had a relationship with his housekeeper and that woman is a total hosebeast. He obviously didn't care about looks.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 21:54     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think this is true of most men. I think many professional men want to be with a professional woman even though they might have a more mommy-track professional job that's not quite as demanding as theirs. It's a lot of pressure to be the sole breadwinner even if you're making a ton. Plus I think many ambitious men are attracted to ambitious women and would be much less attracted to someone who is very smart and highly educated that's content with being a dog walker.


Nah. You are projecting your desires onto men.


Sounds like it. If ambitious equates to unavailable because of work and/or ball-buster, ambitious isn't even a good thing in a woman I might meet. The smart dog walker looks more attractive.


Yikes. Well I'm glad I married my DH and not someone with your attitude. If you have a daughter please don't teach her that ambition is an unattractive quality in a woman.


Nothing wrong with it unless she wants to get married and have children.


And stay home and not work
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 21:48     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Less ambitious the better. Just be nice.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 21:37     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Matt Damon married a waitress. Patrick Dempsey married a makeup artist.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 21:35     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
I am not sure what you mean by a "real" job.....??

Every job has dignity & is important.

There are no "pseudo"-jobs that I am aware of.

Plus for men....All they really care for are good looks.

Look at all the successful men that had relationships w/their children's nannies for instance.

• Ethan Hawke (He married his!)
• Robin Williams (He married his as well.)
• Jude Law
• Ben Affleck
• Gwen Stefani's ex-husband Gavin

Etc.

Point proven.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 20:37     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Didn't hurt Michelle Obama.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 20:36     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think this is true of most men. I think many professional men want to be with a professional woman even though they might have a more mommy-track professional job that's not quite as demanding as theirs. It's a lot of pressure to be the sole breadwinner even if you're making a ton. Plus I think many ambitious men are attracted to ambitious women and would be much less attracted to someone who is very smart and highly educated that's content with being a dog walker.


Nah. You are projecting your desires onto men.


Sounds like it. If ambitious equates to unavailable because of work and/or ball-buster, ambitious isn't even a good thing in a woman I might meet. The smart dog walker looks more attractive.


Yikes. Well I'm glad I married my DH and not someone with your attitude. If you have a daughter please don't teach her that ambition is an unattractive quality in a woman.


Nothing wrong with it unless she wants to get married and have children.
Anonymous
Post 06/23/2016 20:32     Subject: Men: Would you date a woman who did not have a "real job"?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think this is true of most men. I think many professional men want to be with a professional woman even though they might have a more mommy-track professional job that's not quite as demanding as theirs. It's a lot of pressure to be the sole breadwinner even if you're making a ton. Plus I think many ambitious men are attracted to ambitious women and would be much less attracted to someone who is very smart and highly educated that's content with being a dog walker.


Nah. You are projecting your desires onto men.


Sounds like it. If ambitious equates to unavailable because of work and/or ball-buster, ambitious isn't even a good thing in a woman I might meet. The smart dog walker looks more attractive.


Yikes. Well I'm glad I married my DH and not someone with your attitude. If you have a daughter please don't teach her that ambition is an unattractive quality in a woman.


I wrote "if". I've read on one of these forums a woman complaining about being passed over for a dog walker. She was proud of busting balls at work. So what. Is she fun? Is she available, making time in her schedule? Those are prerequisites.