Anonymous wrote:Shias pray 3 times per day and Sunnis pray 5 - not all Muslims pray the same way.

ohhh my!

b/c those extra two sessions bring them closer to Allah!

Give me a fucking break!

Shias pray 3 times per day and Sunnis pray 5 - not all Muslims pray the same way.

Muslima wrote:
I don't have a Version of Islam. There is One version of Islam that all muslims share, the one that was revealed to Prophet Muhammad saw 1400 years ago. Not a single dot was changed/added to it. Muslims will have differing opinions on some things of course but we are blessed as a community in that we have our original book and have had it for 1400 years unchanged and the complete record of the life of our prophet. If anyone comes and says, "This or that is Islam," we can easily check and verify whether or not it's true. If it doesn't come from the Qur'an or Hadith, then it can't be Islam. So we must use those two sources to explain what Islam really is. Sincere people seek to learn and practice the truth and Allah guides those who seek him. Anything else is opinion.

I think the people arguing with you have made their point- a religion is reflected by its adherents.

Your response here indicates that you aren't really taking this seriously. Really, you'd call the disagreements between different sects of Islam "differing opinions?" Isn't that a bit of an understatement? Aren't there several civil wars being fought right now, at this moment, that contradict this? You really think people haven't managed to interpret the Quran and Hadith differently? And maybe you need to have a bit of self-reflection: couldn't it be possible that this narrow, legalistic, "everything you'll ever need to know is HERE! In this book!" form of thinking could perhaps be part of the PROBLEM in the Islamic world? Especially since you can find basically anything you want in said book???

Anonymous wrote:When you're THAT anchored to some text - like the Quran or the Bible - then something's just not quite right . . .

I prefer to learn about human nature through literature.

Who doesn't love Kahlil Gibran?

I love Kahlil Gibran. " I have learned silence from the talkative, tolerance from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet strange, I am ungrateful to these teachers."

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am anti-Islam because Muslim extremists tried to kill my uncle. I don't really have any better reasons than that. I understand all of the arguments, that not all practitioners of Islam are violent, that Islam had a golden age sometime in the Middle Ages, that Christians have persecuted millions, etc., etc. But I can't help but notice that so much evil in the world today revolves around Islam.

This does not mean that I am anti-Muslim. I have a lot of Muslim friends and basically keep my sentiments to myself, except for right now as I type this.

I hope that one day, you can experience the beauty of Islam so that somehow, you can see it for more than the evil actions of some. In the end, love will always be stronger than hate

Somehow this response really peeves me. My uncle was almost murdered, do you think that I am interested in experiencing anything that has to do with Islam? I've gotten to see a LOT of Islam, and color me unimpressed.

I am sorry but nor I or Islam are responsible for your uncle almost getting murdered. I hope one day you can experience the beauty of Islam, that is my wish for you~

Yeah, Muslima, if you can't understand how this type of response comes off as arrogant and out-of-touch, you've got an issue that you need to figure out.

You insist, over and over again, that Islam is "perfect" and all those nasty people and terrorists aren't Muslim, but you are, and therefore your version of Islam is the right one. Do you see how this is not really convincing to anyone? Like, if I want to learn about Islam, am I supposed to email you and visit you in particular so I make sure I learn about "real" Islam? I feel that you desperately want to defend Islam but you don't really understand that this forum is not really the best avenue for that. A lot of times I see comments against my religion and I want to defend it, but I realize that people have made their decisions based on their individual experiences and that nothing I can say is going to sway them one way or another.

For good or bad, and this applies to every religion, the best way to "defend" your religion is to live your life in a way that inspires the people around you. That is, with integrity, honesty, and joy.

I've lived in a Muslim country, worked with Muslim people, been woken up by loudspeaker prayers at 5 am, had Muslim friends in college, had Muslim friends from countries all around the world. Never, not once, have I thought "Gee, this person's life has inspired me to learn more about Islam." Something my husband and I have noticed, in fact, is that our Muslim friends frequently have a super casual attitude about lying, and that's the only pattern we've discovered between the two of us.

Don't twist my words. I never said I was perfect, or that I was the Islamic de facto expert. I said if you want to learn about islam, Read the Quran , research the Qu'ran. Don't look at the Muslims and judge Islam by them. That's been my message all along. I don't represent Islam, Islam represents Islam. Allah guides whom he wants and chooses to it, so no you won't be inspired by just interacting with a Muslim....

As far as your experience with Muslims, I wasn't there , can't judge or comment on that, but if that's your experience with all of your Muslim friends, you probably need better friends....

Who says that I haven't read the Quran? The Quran, like many ancient religious books, is more of a "beauty in the eye of the beholder" type of document. It can be interpreted in thousands of different ways, just as the Bible has. It's not particularly inspiring. The way Muslims behave IS important. Muslims around the world represent the many interpretations of the Quran, just like Christians around the world represent Christianity. And you HAVE pointed out, many times, that the people practicing a repressive form of Islam are not really Muslim, or not doing it right. I look at the thousands of Christian denominations different from my own, and I can't just go "oh, all those people aren't Christians because they aren't doing things the way I am." But that's what you've been doing.

Either repressive Islam IS a form of Islam, or YOUR version of Islam is the right one. That's the story you've been giving us through your many, many posts on this topic.

Who says that I haven't read the Quran? The Quran, like many ancient religious books, is more of a "beauty in the eye of the beholder" type of document

That wasn't directed at you, but in general for whoever is curious about Islam, the Quran should be where to get answers but not based on how Muslims choose to live their lives, coz not every Muslim implements the Quranic teachings in their lives. I agree with the last part of your sentence.

you HAVE pointed out, many times, that the people practicing a repressive form of Islam are not really Muslim, or not doing it right. I look at the thousands of Christian denominations different from my own, and I can't just go "oh, all those people aren't Christians because they aren't doing things the way I am." But that's what you've been doing.

Again do not twist words. I have no ability to determine who is a Muslim or not, only Allah knows. As Muslims we Can Not say that a Muslim is a Kaffir unless he tells us so, so be careful with twisting my words. What I said is that the practices and teachings like terrorism, women subjugation, violence, ect are NOT Islamic. Now as far as Christianity is concerned, when I opened a thread about it, Christians came and said there was a gazillion way to practice Christianity and not 2 Christians are alike. Well, Islam is not like that, we have one islam. Muslims all over the world pray the same way and follow the same 5 pillars. There are differences of opinions on some things because we have 4 Schools of Fiqh but the differences among the schools of Jurisprudence do not concern the major beliefs and practices of Islam, rather they properly belong to the area of furu' or the details of religion.

Either repressive Islam IS a form of Islam, or YOUR version of Islam is the right one. That's the story you've been giving us through your many, many posts on this topic

I don't have a Version of Islam. There is One version of Islam that all muslims share, the one that was revealed to Prophet Muhammad saw 1400 years ago. Not a single dot was changed/added to it. Muslims will have differing opinions on some things of course but we are blessed as a community in that we have our original book and have had it for 1400 years unchanged and the complete record of the life of our prophet. If anyone comes and says, "This or that is Islam," we can easily check and verify whether or not it's true. If it doesn't come from the Qur'an or Hadith, then it can't be Islam. So we must use those two sources to explain what Islam really is. Sincere people seek to learn and practice the truth and Allah guides those who seek him. Anything else is opinion.

The person I know is a conservative Christian RINO who is desperate for an identity and a need to belong, so he went with hating Muslims and loving America, freedom and Jesus. Which are fine things to love if you love them sincerely and not out of some need to identify with others. Idolizes the military and police, too.

When you're THAT anchored to some text - like the Quran or the Bible - then something's just not quite right . . .

I prefer to learn about human nature through literature.

Who doesn't love Kahlil Gibran?

Anonymous wrote:

Don't look at the Muslims and judge Islam by them. 

But how else are we to judge them if not by their actions.

I am Catholic. If a priest is caught molesting little boys, yet he always preaches virtue and chastity and protecting the innocent, what shows more honesty?

His words or his actions?

The same goes for every religion.

You can pick the kindest, most flowery and reasonable words that you want but if the practice is different then that is the truth, not the pretty words.

Catholic here too, well said!!

And who appointed Muslima the official ambassador of Islam on DCUM? It's getting old, on quite a few forums here.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am anti-Islam because Muslim extremists tried to kill my uncle. I don't really have any better reasons than that. I understand all of the arguments, that not all practitioners of Islam are violent, that Islam had a golden age sometime in the Middle Ages, that Christians have persecuted millions, etc., etc. But I can't help but notice that so much evil in the world today revolves around Islam.

This does not mean that I am anti-Muslim. I have a lot of Muslim friends and basically keep my sentiments to myself, except for right now as I type this.

I hope that one day, you can experience the beauty of Islam so that somehow, you can see it for more than the evil actions of some. In the end, love will always be stronger than hate

Somehow this response really peeves me. My uncle was almost murdered, do you think that I am interested in experiencing anything that has to do with Islam? I've gotten to see a LOT of Islam, and color me unimpressed.

I am sorry but nor I or Islam are responsible for your uncle almost getting murdered. I hope one day you can experience the beauty of Islam, that is my wish for you~

Yeah, Muslima, if you can't understand how this type of response comes off as arrogant and out-of-touch, you've got an issue that you need to figure out.

You insist, over and over again, that Islam is "perfect" and all those nasty people and terrorists aren't Muslim, but you are, and therefore your version of Islam is the right one. Do you see how this is not really convincing to anyone? Like, if I want to learn about Islam, am I supposed to email you and visit you in particular so I make sure I learn about "real" Islam? I feel that you desperately want to defend Islam but you don't really understand that this forum is not really the best avenue for that. A lot of times I see comments against my religion and I want to defend it, but I realize that people have made their decisions based on their individual experiences and that nothing I can say is going to sway them one way or another.

For good or bad, and this applies to every religion, the best way to "defend" your religion is to live your life in a way that inspires the people around you. That is, with integrity, honesty, and joy.

I've lived in a Muslim country, worked with Muslim people, been woken up by loudspeaker prayers at 5 am, had Muslim friends in college, had Muslim friends from countries all around the world. Never, not once, have I thought "Gee, this person's life has inspired me to learn more about Islam." Something my husband and I have noticed, in fact, is that our Muslim friends frequently have a super casual attitude about lying, and that's the only pattern we've discovered between the two of us.

Don't twist my words. I never said I was perfect, or that I was the Islamic de facto expert. I said if you want to learn about islam, Read the Quran , research the Qu'ran. Don't look at the Muslims and judge Islam by them. That's been my message all along. I don't represent Islam, Islam represents Islam. Allah guides whom he wants and chooses to it, so no you won't be inspired by just interacting with a Muslim....

As far as your experience with Muslims, I wasn't there , can't judge or comment on that, but if that's your experience with all of your Muslim friends, you probably need better friends....

Who says that I haven't read the Quran? The Quran, like many ancient religious books, is more of a "beauty in the eye of the beholder" type of document. It can be interpreted in thousands of different ways, just as the Bible has. It's not particularly inspiring. The way Muslims behave IS important. Muslims around the world represent the many interpretations of the Quran, just like Christians around the world represent Christianity. And you HAVE pointed out, many times, that the people practicing a repressive form of Islam are not really Muslim, or not doing it right. I look at the thousands of Christian denominations different from my own, and I can't just go "oh, all those people aren't Christians because they aren't doing things the way I am." But that's what you've been doing.

Either repressive Islam IS a form of Islam, or YOUR version of Islam is the right one. That's the story you've been giving us through your many, many posts on this topic.

^^-which you have- ^^

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am anti-Islam because Muslim extremists tried to kill my uncle. I don't really have any better reasons than that. I understand all of the arguments, that not all practitioners of Islam are violent, that Islam had a golden age sometime in the Middle Ages, that Christians have persecuted millions, etc., etc. But I can't help but notice that so much evil in the world today revolves around Islam.

This does not mean that I am anti-Muslim. I have a lot of Muslim friends and basically keep my sentiments to myself, except for right now as I type this.

I hope that one day, you can experience the beauty of Islam so that somehow, you can see it for more than the evil actions of some. In the end, love will always be stronger than hate

Somehow this response really peeves me. My uncle was almost murdered, do you think that I am interested in experiencing anything that has to do with Islam? I've gotten to see a LOT of Islam, and color me unimpressed.

I am sorry but nor I or Islam are responsible for your uncle almost getting murdered. I hope one day you can experience the beauty of Islam, that is my wish for you~

Yeah, Muslima, if you can't understand how this type of response comes off as arrogant and out-of-touch, you've got an issue that you need to figure out.

You insist, over and over again, that Islam is "perfect" and all those nasty people and terrorists aren't Muslim, but you are, and therefore your version of Islam is the right one. Do you see how this is not really convincing to anyone? Like, if I want to learn about Islam, am I supposed to email you and visit you in particular so I make sure I learn about "real" Islam? I feel that you desperately want to defend Islam but you don't really understand that this forum is not really the best avenue for that. A lot of times I see comments against my religion and I want to defend it, but I realize that people have made their decisions based on their individual experiences and that nothing I can say is going to sway them one way or another.

For good or bad, and this applies to every religion, the best way to "defend" your religion is to live your life in a way that inspires the people around you. That is, with integrity, honesty, and joy.

I've lived in a Muslim country, worked with Muslim people, been woken up by loudspeaker prayers at 5 am, had Muslim friends in college, had Muslim friends from countries all around the world. Never, not once, have I thought "Gee, this person's life has inspired me to learn more about Islam." Something my husband and I have noticed, in fact, is that our Muslim friends frequently have a super casual attitude about lying, and that's the only pattern we've discovered between the two of us.

Don't twist my words. I never said I was perfect, or that I was the Islamic de facto expert. I said if you want to learn about islam, Read the Quran , research the Qu'ran. Don't look at the Muslims and judge Islam by them. That's been my message all along. I don't represent Islam, Islam represents Islam. Allah guides whom he wants and chooses to it, so no you won't be inspired by just interacting with a Muslim....

As far as your experience with Muslims, I wasn't there , can't judge or comment on that, but if that's your experience with all of your Muslim friends, you probably need better friends....

Actually the pp said that you have previously stated that Islam is perfect- which have have- not that you said you were perfect.

Don't look at the Muslims and judge Islam by them. 

But how else are we to judge them if not by their actions.

I am Catholic. If a priest is caught molesting little boys, yet he always preaches virtue and chastity and protecting the innocent, what shows more honesty?

His words or his actions?

The same goes for every religion.

You can pick the kindest, most flowery and reasonable words that you want but if the practice is different then that is the truth, not the pretty words.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am anti-Islam because Muslim extremists tried to kill my uncle. I don't really have any better reasons than that. I understand all of the arguments, that not all practitioners of Islam are violent, that Islam had a golden age sometime in the Middle Ages, that Christians have persecuted millions, etc., etc. But I can't help but notice that so much evil in the world today revolves around Islam.

This does not mean that I am anti-Muslim. I have a lot of Muslim friends and basically keep my sentiments to myself, except for right now as I type this.

I hope that one day, you can experience the beauty of Islam so that somehow, you can see it for more than the evil actions of some. In the end, love will always be stronger than hate

Somehow this response really peeves me. My uncle was almost murdered, do you think that I am interested in experiencing anything that has to do with Islam? I've gotten to see a LOT of Islam, and color me unimpressed.

I am sorry but nor I or Islam are responsible for your uncle almost getting murdered. I hope one day you can experience the beauty of Islam, that is my wish for you~

Yeah, Muslima, if you can't understand how this type of response comes off as arrogant and out-of-touch, you've got an issue that you need to figure out.

You insist, over and over again, that Islam is "perfect" and all those nasty people and terrorists aren't Muslim, but you are, and therefore your version of Islam is the right one. Do you see how this is not really convincing to anyone? Like, if I want to learn about Islam, am I supposed to email you and visit you in particular so I make sure I learn about "real" Islam? I feel that you desperately want to defend Islam but you don't really understand that this forum is not really the best avenue for that. A lot of times I see comments against my religion and I want to defend it, but I realize that people have made their decisions based on their individual experiences and that nothing I can say is going to sway them one way or another.

For good or bad, and this applies to every religion, the best way to "defend" your religion is to live your life in a way that inspires the people around you. That is, with integrity, honesty, and joy.

I've lived in a Muslim country, worked with Muslim people, been woken up by loudspeaker prayers at 5 am, had Muslim friends in college, had Muslim friends from countries all around the world. Never, not once, have I thought "Gee, this person's life has inspired me to learn more about Islam." Something my husband and I have noticed, in fact, is that our Muslim friends frequently have a super casual attitude about lying, and that's the only pattern we've discovered between the two of us.

Don't twist my words. I never said I was perfect, or that I was the Islamic de facto expert. I said if you want to learn about islam, Read the Quran , research the Qu'ran. Don't look at the Muslims and judge Islam by them. That's been my message all along. I don't represent Islam, Islam represents Islam. Allah guides whom he wants and chooses to it, so no you won't be inspired by just interacting with a Muslim....

As far as your experience with Muslims, I wasn't there , can't judge or comment on that, but if that's your experience with all of your Muslim friends, you probably need better friends....

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am anti-Islam because Muslim extremists tried to kill my uncle. I don't really have any better reasons than that. I understand all of the arguments, that not all practitioners of Islam are violent, that Islam had a golden age sometime in the Middle Ages, that Christians have persecuted millions, etc., etc. But I can't help but notice that so much evil in the world today revolves around Islam.

This does not mean that I am anti-Muslim. I have a lot of Muslim friends and basically keep my sentiments to myself, except for right now as I type this.

I hope that one day, you can experience the beauty of Islam so that somehow, you can see it for more than the evil actions of some. In the end, love will always be stronger than hate

Somehow this response really peeves me. My uncle was almost murdered, do you think that I am interested in experiencing anything that has to do with Islam? I've gotten to see a LOT of Islam, and color me unimpressed.

I am sorry but nor I or Islam are responsible for your uncle almost getting murdered. I hope one day you can experience the beauty of Islam, that is my wish for you~

Yeah, Muslima, if you can't understand how this type of response comes off as arrogant and out-of-touch, you've got an issue that you need to figure out.

You insist, over and over again, that Islam is "perfect" and all those nasty people and terrorists aren't Muslim, but you are, and therefore your version of Islam is the right one. Do you see how this is not really convincing to anyone? Like, if I want to learn about Islam, am I supposed to email you and visit you in particular so I make sure I learn about "real" Islam? I feel that you desperately want to defend Islam but you don't really understand that this forum is not really the best avenue for that. A lot of times I see comments against my religion and I want to defend it, but I realize that people have made their decisions based on their individual experiences and that nothing I can say is going to sway them one way or another.

For good or bad, and this applies to every religion, the best way to "defend" your religion is to live your life in a way that inspires the people around you. That is, with integrity, honesty, and joy.

I've lived in a Muslim country, worked with Muslim people, been woken up by loudspeaker prayers at 5 am, had Muslim friends in college, had Muslim friends from countries all around the world. Never, not once, have I thought "Gee, this person's life has inspired me to learn more about Islam." Something my husband and I have noticed, in fact, is that our Muslim friends frequently have a super casual attitude about lying, and that's the only pattern we've discovered between the two of us.

I'm a Muslim born and raised in the US and I have noticed this as a cultural part of many Muslim countries that are developing nations. I don't know the reason behind it, but needless to say that it isn't at all related to Islamic teachings. But certainly perhaps a system of authority that has been constructed in Muslim nations that priioritizes the wrong things.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am anti-Islam because Muslim extremists tried to kill my uncle. I don't really have any better reasons than that. I understand all of the arguments, that not all practitioners of Islam are violent, that Islam had a golden age sometime in the Middle Ages, that Christians have persecuted millions, etc., etc. But I can't help but notice that so much evil in the world today revolves around Islam.

This does not mean that I am anti-Muslim. I have a lot of Muslim friends and basically keep my sentiments to myself, except for right now as I type this.

I hope that one day, you can experience the beauty of Islam so that somehow, you can see it for more than the evil actions of some. In the end, love will always be stronger than hate

Somehow this response really peeves me. My uncle was almost murdered, do you think that I am interested in experiencing anything that has to do with Islam? I've gotten to see a LOT of Islam, and color me unimpressed.

I am sorry but nor I or Islam are responsible for your uncle almost getting murdered. I hope one day you can experience the beauty of Islam, that is my wish for you~

Yeah, Muslima, if you can't understand how this type of response comes off as arrogant and out-of-touch, you've got an issue that you need to figure out.

You insist, over and over again, that Islam is "perfect" and all those nasty people and terrorists aren't Muslim, but you are, and therefore your version of Islam is the right one. Do you see how this is not really convincing to anyone? Like, if I want to learn about Islam, am I supposed to email you and visit you in particular so I make sure I learn about "real" Islam? I feel that you desperately want to defend Islam but you don't really understand that this forum is not really the best avenue for that. A lot of times I see comments against my religion and I want to defend it, but I realize that people have made their decisions based on their individual experiences and that nothing I can say is going to sway them one way or another.

For good or bad, and this applies to every religion, the best way to "defend" your religion is to live your life in a way that inspires the people around you. That is, with integrity, honesty, and joy.

I've lived in a Muslim country, worked with Muslim people, been woken up by loudspeaker prayers at 5 am, had Muslim friends in college, had Muslim friends from countries all around the world. Never, not once, have I thought "Gee, this person's life has inspired me to learn more about Islam." Something my husband and I have noticed, in fact, is that our Muslim friends frequently have a super casual attitude about lying, and that's the only pattern we've discovered between the two of us.