Anonymous wrote:I believe that was a misfired Hamas rocket that hit Al-Shifa hospital.

IDF denied it but the NBC journalist who witnessed it said it was an idf drone

Anonymous wrote:Report from Gaza at 6:31pm: Earlier this evening, a Hamas Fajr long range rocket launched towards Central Israel from a playground outside Shifa hospital in Gaza, failed to launch correctly and exploded, causing wounded and fatalities...including children.

There are 100 kilograms of explosives in a Fajr warhead.

i am sure they will find a way to blamed the Israelis for this one too.

This is evil. There is no other way to describe it. That Palestinians would put rockets in a playground outside a hospital, and then that they say Israel is targeting innocent children and hospitals trying to get at the rockets. Sick tactics. Sick. These are your own children and wounded you are making targets of, so you can prove Israel is in the wrong. Beyond belief Palestinians. Beyond what any civilized person can comprehend.

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So you support the bombings in Ireland? Dreadful.

I support the Irish who came to America and made a new life for themselves and became an integral part of American culture.

We just mourned the loss of Nelson Mandela and pretty much everyone recounted what a great man he was and the amazing changes he brought about through peaceful means. I don't know how I could be changing the goal posts when I keep saying that change took place in South Africa through world-wide non-violent commitment to change. That's how it happened.

No one should ever win a political struggle through violent means.

I am not sure to which bombings in Ireland you referring. The armed struggle for Irish independence to which I referred is this one:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_War_of_Independence

I understand that you have limited knowledge of history, particularly history involving Nelson Mandela. But, since political struggle should never be waged by violent means, how do you feel about the Zionist terrorist groups that helped achieve Israel's independence. These include:

The Irgun, led by eventual Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin, which blew up the King David Hotel:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing

The Stern Gang, led by another eventual Prime Minister of Israel, Yitzhak Shamir. The Stern Gang assassinated Lord Moyne, British Minister Resident in the Middle East and used a truck bomb to destroy the Salam building in Haifa.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stern_Gang

The Haganah, who blew up the Christian-owned Semiramis Hotel in Jerusalem, killing 20 persons, among them Viscount de Tapia, the Spanish Consul

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semiramis_Hotel_bombing

The Irgun and Stern Gang joined forces to commit the massacre of Deir Yassin:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre

I assume that you consider it tragic that these proponents of violence against civilians succeeded in their goal of an independent country?

This is total insanity, especially this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stern_Gang

But this is ancient history. What can you give me that explains today's situation?

I believe that was a misfired Hamas rocket that hit Al-Shifa hospital.

Israel just bombed the biggest hospital in Gaza, Al-Shifa hospital

And did you know that in the last hour, there was a new Massacre at the first day of Eid, more than 50 children were playing in a park west of Gaza when the F16s targeted them.10 children killed in one strike."TEN INNOCENT CHILDREN! Who will not celebrate Eid

Anonymous wrote:

Report from Gaza at 6:31pm: Earlier this evening, a Hamas Fajr long range rocket launched towards Central Israel from a playground outside Shifa hospital in Gaza, failed to launch correctly and exploded, causing wounded and fatalities...including children.

There are 100 kilograms of explosives in a Fajr warhead.

i am sure they will find a way to blamed the Israelis for this one too.

Please the Israelis have captured a lot of these rockets. This is a way for the Israelis to kill more women and children.

What are you talking about? How does this have to do with Hamas's rocket launching in playground outside Shifa hospital and killing Palestinian children?

Anonymous wrote:

Report from Gaza at 6:31pm: Earlier this evening, a Hamas Fajr long range rocket launched towards Central Israel from a playground outside Shifa hospital in Gaza, failed to launch correctly and exploded, causing wounded and fatalities...including children.

There are 100 kilograms of explosives in a Fajr warhead.

i am sure they will find a way to blamed the Israelis for this one too.

Please the Israelis have captured a lot of these rockets. This is a way for the Israelis to kill more women and children.

I knew that was coming. Why dont you just say "Its Israel fault for existing. Otherwise, we wouldnt have to shoot off all these rockets from inside playgrounds and hospitals."

Muslima wrote:And I tell you again , you are wrong. I just came from the Eid prayer and trust me , the imam and the people there don't care. You can believe what you want to believe, that doesn't make it true. Yes I believe I would know more about what Sunnis believe since I have been one my entire life, just like a buddhist would know more about Budda than I do. The shias are our brothers in faith, though we don't agree with some of their practices and this is the MAJORITY sunni belief. As Muslims, we all follow one book , the Quran and there's no mention of shias or sunnis in it. The divisions are political but for you to make it a Sunni ideology shows a lot of misunderstanding of Islam regardless of whether you speak arabic or not.

I am not wrong and you are not wrong. You have simply not been exposed to the experiences I'm citing, and just like I'm not denying your experiences, you have no business denying mine.

I am not arguing these divisions aren't political, I'm arguing that the religious philosophy was crafted, evolved and disseminated to serve the political ends, just like the entire Sunni-Shia divide.

There is nothing I misunderstand about Islam, and that's typically what Muslims says when they are confronted by uncomfortable questions from the non-Muslim side. Muslims have no monopoly on understanding Islam.

Report from Gaza at 6:31pm: Earlier this evening, a Hamas Fajr long range rocket launched towards Central Israel from a playground outside Shifa hospital in Gaza, failed to launch correctly and exploded, causing wounded and fatalities...including children.

There are 100 kilograms of explosives in a Fajr warhead.

i am sure they will find a way to blamed the Israelis for this one too.

Please the Israelis have captured a lot of these rockets. This is a way for the Israelis to kill more women and children.

Muslima, do you recognize Israel's right to exist?

Report from Gaza at 6:31pm: Earlier this evening, a Hamas Fajr long range rocket launched towards Central Israel from a playground outside Shifa hospital in Gaza, failed to launch correctly and exploded, causing wounded and fatalities...including children.

There are 100 kilograms of explosives in a Fajr warhead.

i am sure they will find a way to blamed the Israelis for this one too.

And I tell you again , you are wrong. I just came from the Eid prayer and trust me , the imam and the people there don't care. You can believe what you want to believe, that doesn't make it true. Yes I believe I would know more about what Sunnis believe since I have been one my entire life, just like a buddhist would know more about Budda than I do. The shias are our brothers in faith, though we don't agree with some of their practices and this is the MAJORITY sunni belief. As Muslims, we all follow one book , the Quran and there's no mention of shias or sunnis in it. The divisions are political but for you to make it a Sunni ideology shows a lot of misunderstanding of Islam regardless of whether you speak arabic or not.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:
Not true. I have been Muslim all of my life, I am a sunni and 90% of the Muslims i know are Sunnis and we don't go around wishing death to the Shi'a. Yes there are Sunni/Shia conflicts around the world but those are in very specific areas and very politicized , religion is really secondary in those conflicts even though people use religion's name most of the time to justify their actions.

I am sure you don't, and this is not about individual attitudes of Sunnis to Shias. Yes, it is political, but the whole Sunni/Shia split was political and has since been enshrined in the mainstream Sunni ideology, which serves to cement the dominant position of Sunnis over the Muslim "community", whatever that means (and it honestly means nothing in the absence of external enemy). Saudi textbooks, which AlSaud's money has spread around the world as the chapter-and-verse of true Islam refers to Shia blood and property as halal to kill and take over. Of course the conflict in Iraq is about political power but that feeling of entitlement to domination both politically and economically is very much a part of mainstream Sunni discourse bolstered by the ideology. If you don't know this, you simply haven't read it, which is OK, but don't say it doesn't exist.

Lol. You really think you know what sunnis believe more than I do because of what you think you learn or read or saw? I live this religion, I don't just watch it in the news or listen to debates about it. I will say it again, Sunnis don't wake up thinking "jeez , what are we going to do about shias today" the same way catholics don't wake up thinking about protestants .There is 1.6 Billion of Muslims in the world, the majority being sunni, and they are not exporting their vision of Islam anywhere, nor are they fighting around the world about who is who or believe in what. Saudi arabia has a branch of wahadism that teaches what you re referring to. But let me tell you that this is no way the majority Sunni beliefs or teachings. You don't hear 90% of the sunnis ever in the media, that should tell you something. The other conflicts that you're talking about are the minority who again because of political strategies, agendas export their own version of islam. But don't tell me that's what the Sunnis believe because that is definitely not true

Well, let's address your first question. Does being Muslim imparts on you, by osmosis, more knowledge about what Sunnis believe? No, not really, because the sources of information available to you are equally available to Arabic-fluent non-Muslims, and these sources are out available to see to all and sundry. There are no special Muslims-only sources.

Of course, 90% of Sunnis aren't in the media - 99% of ANY community is never in the media, in armed conflicts or in politics, and 90% of any community spends zero time thinking about this. That doesn't mean that this community has no ideology, no policy, no philosophy, and 90% of it members may have never heard of these things, but it doesn't mean they don't exist. Of course 90% of any community members don't wake up thinking about these things but let me ask you something: walk into any Sunni mosque and ask the imam what his position is on the Shia community. And report back, please, if anyone says, without qualification, "they are our brothers and sisters in the faith and we have to stand with them." Just curious.

Again, this is not about what people "on the ground" believe. This is about what the ideology of one group says about members of another group.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all the posters advocating peaceful means, when will you begin boycotting companies that do business with Israel? When will you begin demanding the US stop supporting Israel. This and only this is what broke the South Africa Apartheid. Money.

Exactly. It was the boycotting of South Africa, the embargo and complete withdrawal of financial dealings that did them in. NOT blowing people up.

Now that we know it's possible, how can we support people who engage in violence to make these kinds of changes?

Who was blown up in the past 19 days? Do I need to remind you the facts?

About 5,870 Palestinians have been wounded with 1000+ dead, over 80% civilians

Israeli deaths are 40 soldiers and two civilians.


Who is engaging in Violence?

Please, just discuss the reality of the situation instead of pretending. What's going on now is a result of the Palestinians repeatedly attacking the Israelis. The Israelis are fight back -- and they're winning because they are much bigger and more powerful.

It's not a fair fight and you know. The Israelis took an Uzi to a kitchen knife fight. If the US would give the Palestinians the same arms they provide to Israel, then we can begin to talk about a fair fight. In regards to Palestinians repeatedly attacking the Israelis, I guess you only believe what you want to believe and not facts. There have been former and current IDF soldiers who say otherwise in regards to who is initiating many of these attacks, but you choose to ignore them.

NP. Yes, you are correct. It is not a fair fight.

When you attack another country, you don't get to then complain it's not a "fair fight" because the country you attacked is stronger than you are, and hits back harder than you hit them.

You keep spouting this line, but the real narrative is that Israel is isolating itself in the process of destroying Gaza. It is the Palestinians who have been humanized because we all live in a world full of suffering, and the Israelis who are viewed as bestial, detached and debauched. I had no idea Israeli Jews were capable of inflicting so much damage on others or on themselves.