Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This reminds me of our elementary school in NW DC: i swear there were mothers who operated under the motto of "An activity isn't worth doing (or a party worth hosting, etc) unless someone else is being excluded."


My kids ended up at a Big3 private for high school and the grads from their school have no problem getting into the top clubs (investment, etc) at Ivies. It's all a name game. I hate this; thankfully my kids are studying the humanities.

Folks, something is getting strangely lost in translation on this whole club discussion.

My kid is at an Ivy and laughed out loud at the idea that the investment or finance or consulting clubs are dominated by wealthy kids.

These clubs are run by the kids scratching their way to jobs at McKinsey or Goldman or wherever...not kids where if dad makes a call they can work there.

Eating Clubs/Final Clubs/Fraternities...completely different animal.

Agree 💯 on the banking /PE clubs being for non-wealthy and unconnected kids.

What’s your point on eating clubs?
What is a final club?

Eating Clubs = Fraternities at Princeton and there are a bunch that are exclusive and generally limited to wealthy kids (and a bunch that are not). Final Clubs is the equivalent at Harvard. Not sure if the Final Clubs are all exclusive, or not.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dc (entering freshman) was a little shocked by the student club culture. Every single club needs applications and interviews and most have a very low probability of acceptance. Seriously regretting the decision to go to an Ivy. This was hardly DC's idea of what college life would be. We were willy to not know about any of this stuff?

Same at Vanderbilt for my freshman son.

It is every top school not just ivies. Your son will find other things to do ! Have him talk to upperclassman who often have great perspective on the club culture and the unnecessary emphasis placed by freshmen.

Thank you!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dc (entering freshman) was a little shocked by the student club culture. Every single club needs applications and interviews and most have a very low probability of acceptance. Seriously regretting the decision to go to an Ivy. This was hardly DC's idea of what college life would be. We were willy to not know about any of this stuff?

Same at Vanderbilt for my freshman son.

It is every top school not just ivies. Your son will find other things to do ! Have him talk to upperclassman who often have great perspective on the club culture and the unnecessary emphasis placed by freshmen.

Thank you!

Anonymous wrote:Are you talking about the underground clubs? Those clubs are very creepy. Because the admin has no control over them and the kids feel they are entitled they are worse than frats which at least can be kicked off campus. I remember one at Harvard that advertised really nasty stuff on flyers to promote one of their parties like fat ch*cks for h**d only. It was pretty shocking.

That has to be a tale from the 80s or 90s . That would never fly now

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dc (entering freshman) was a little shocked by the student club culture. Every single club needs applications and interviews and most have a very low probability of acceptance. Seriously regretting the decision to go to an Ivy. This was hardly DC's idea of what college life would be. We were willy to not know about any of this stuff?

Same at Vanderbilt for my freshman son.

It is every top school not just ivies. Your son will find other things to do ! Have him talk to upperclassman who often have great perspective on the club culture and the unnecessary emphasis placed by freshmen.

Are you talking about the underground clubs? Those clubs are very creepy. Because the admin has no control over them and the kids feel they are entitled they are worse than frats which at least can be kicked off campus. I remember one at Harvard that advertised really nasty stuff on flyers to promote one of their parties like fat ch*cks for h**d only. It was pretty shocking.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not being accepted to the Princeton Tiddlywinks Club could be a career wrecker.

New poster: you’re a jerk. Some clubs have a real impact on the future. An EMT club gets you certified, credit hours and clinical hours for med school apps. A law related fraternity gets you guest speakers for connections and info, jobs placement bumps, and special study materials and tutoring for the LSAT.

What "special study materials"?

PP is serving up handwringing BS. No one needs a special EMT club or a special law club to get in to med or law school. No one at these competitive schools needs or used “special” study materials. Going to see a speaker, even if it were somehow related to club membership(which it almost never is for big speakers coming to top schools), has nothing to do with a resume. There are so many different clubs and newclubs one can start. The competitive ones are usually the worst for freshman, and also highly overrated in what they actually help with. Move on and encourage resilience in your college children! They should their big brain filled with ideas and initiative to do something different if your first plan does not pan out.

Anonymous wrote:Dc (entering freshman) was a little shocked by the student club culture. Every single club needs applications and interviews and most have a very low probability of acceptance. Seriously regretting the decision to go to an Ivy. This was hardly DC's idea of what college life would be. We were willy to not know about any of this stuff?

Same at Vanderbilt for my freshman son.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son at an Ivy hasn’t run into this.

He made the Club sport team and joined the club he wanted.

Same. My kid is unhooked. He has found lots of friends, joined club and a sports team and is having fun.

I guess it depends on the Ivy.

+1

Same. Club sports team he made is competitive though. Rolling cuts over 3 days of tryouts. 100 kids for 4 Freshman spots. He got one of them. But, club travels and plays other colleges- flys to championships, etc. This one plays nearly year round. Most colleges certain sports are very competitive to make the teams. Very large schools near impossible.

There are intramural teams for kids not on the Varsity or Club teams.

This. One at an Ivy and one at UVA. The Ivy kid has had much more opportunity--easily gotten into clubs he wanted. Not wealthy, not hooked, etc. The culture at UVA was much harder to get into things. And club sports were even more like a rush than talent and the sheer numbers coming out for the popular sports made it impossible.

100%, my kid at Penn has had a much easier time with finding groups and getting into clubs than his best friend from high school who is at UVA. UVA is extremely competitive with clubs. All top schools are, this is not an ivy thing at all.

Anonymous wrote:I've recommended this book before -- The Years That Matter Most: How College Makes or Breaks Us, by Paul Tough. He explains how this is actually what the top colleges are: social incubators that require a certain amount of exclusivity.

The students who attend an Ivy ready to work really hard and get top grades don't get it when the rich kids who did none of the work get the plum internships upon recommendation of the professor after hanging out in office hours. Top colleges are about networking, they aren't a community college career training program. With that being the case, well, you don't let everyone into skull and bones.

Professors hate rich kids and don't have any motivation or incentive to recommend dumb rich kids for internships.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD at Penn was pretty miserable about the club culture freshman year. I think the thing that was hardest was that she had no idea things were so competitive and it came right at the beginning of her time at Penn when she was still trying to find her footing. It didn't feel great to have rejection right off the bat. Fast forward to junior year and she has found more than enough enjoyable, fulfilling extra curricular activities, all of which are a better fit than what she thought she was interested during her second week of freshman year. Things were MUCH easier for kid #2 (at a different ivy) because he was prepared for the club applications/competition and knew that things end up working out fine.

Frankly, she should have known about the clubs at penn. There's a subreddit on them. One thread, three years ago, goes into excruciating detail about the clubs at Penn. There have also been multiple theads on competitive clubs here and on College Confidential. Everyone needs to read up
in the culture at the schools their kid is applying to. If you don't want these kind of clubs then don't apply to Ivies

Not everyone wants to get their info from reddit and, in any event, it all worked out great (if you had read to the end)

Anonymous wrote:I've recommended this book before -- The Years That Matter Most: How College Makes or Breaks Us, by Paul Tough. He explains how this is actually what the top colleges are: social incubators that require a certain amount of exclusivity.

The students who attend an Ivy ready to work really hard and get top grades don't get it when the rich kids who did none of the work get the plum internships upon recommendation of the professor after hanging out in office hours. Top colleges are about networking, they aren't a community college career training program. With that being the case, well, you don't let everyone into skull and bones.

This book is spot on.
Assessment here matches what I’ve seen too.

Anonymous wrote:I find this very sad. Why the capacity limit on clubs?

Signaling value. Same reason why Ivies aren't constantly drastically expanding

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not being accepted to the Princeton Tiddlywinks Club could be a career wrecker.

New poster: you’re a jerk. Some clubs have a real impact on the future. An EMT club gets you certified, credit hours and clinical hours for med school apps. A law related fraternity gets you guest speakers for connections and info, jobs placement bumps, and special study materials and tutoring for the LSAT.

What "special study materials"?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD at Penn was pretty miserable about the club culture freshman year. I think the thing that was hardest was that she had no idea things were so competitive and it came right at the beginning of her time at Penn when she was still trying to find her footing. It didn't feel great to have rejection right off the bat. Fast forward to junior year and she has found more than enough enjoyable, fulfilling extra curricular activities, all of which are a better fit than what she thought she was interested during her second week of freshman year. Things were MUCH easier for kid #2 (at a different ivy) because he was prepared for the club applications/competition and knew that things end up working out fine.

Frankly, she should have known about the clubs at penn. There's a subreddit on them. One thread, three years ago, goes into excruciating detail about the clubs at Penn. There have also been multiple theads on competitive clubs here and on College Confidential. Everyone needs to read up
in the culture at the schools their kid is applying to. If you don't want these kind of clubs then don't apply to Ivies

How bad is Cornell?
Duke?
Vanderbilt?
Northwestern?

You are going to have to google. I just googled "Cornell competitive social clubs" and many entries came up. Go past the brag posts from Cornell itself - look for student comments online like College Confidential and Reddit