Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAHM job is one of the hardest - totally undervalued and underestimated.

It’s precisely valued. Nanny and housekeeper rates are readily available

And yet, when working parents had to do this during the pandemic, there was a widespread trend of leaving the workforce because it was too hard. Obviously, it’s not as simple as what you describe. Otherwise people would not have quit higher paying careers to take care of their children.

Your attitude is the epitome of how caregiving is devalued in this country. Until we stop ignoring and minimizing the realities of this (often unpaid) labor, women will continue to leave the workforce en masse. That hurts ALL working women, it hurts the economy and sets the entire country backwards.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Literally no one cares what you are doing with your day, OP. You are imagining that they are thinking about you and how you have free time? They are all too busy, whether they are SAH or WOH or whatever

Sometimes people ask things of SAHMs that they won’t of working moms because they assume they have the time and flexibility to do them. So that might be where this is coming from.

No. SAHM Imagine people ask them to do things that they don’t ask working moms. My friends father had a stroke and she sent a group text to all of us saying hey can you help with the kids over the next five days. All the working moms had no problem finding time to help I even took a whole day off work to do some of her grocery shopping and laundry. Some of the SAHMs also helped.

The comment from one of the SAHM’s was “I guess you think I just have tons of time”. Like no we just think you’re part of our community and we help each other out.

Is completely in our imagination that this was a time where we thought only the stay at home moms were going to help.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Literally no one cares what you are doing with your day, OP. You are imagining that they are thinking about you and how you have free time? They are all too busy, whether they are SAH or WOH or whatever

Sometimes people ask things of SAHMs that they won’t of working moms because they assume they have the time and flexibility to do them. So that might be where this is coming from.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You have more time than someone that works all day and has child care and household responsibilities at night. Makes sense?

Exactly. No one is saying you are lounging around doing nothing, but imagine being at work 8 hours a day, plus an hour commute each way, and then tack on seeing your child for an hour or two in the evening and then needing to call your parents to check in.

The difference is that a SAH probably doesn't have a cleaning service and it's likely that her DH has dumped his chores on her because ' she has free time'. In reality, the house is getting more messed up from DC being home all day vs. in daycare so SAH has more cleaning not less. The SAH mom is doing all the childcare, all the extra housework and all the cooking. When I worked in an office I could take long lunches, shop on line, have long adult conversations, go to happy hour after work. Going to work in an office was 10X easier than being a SAH.

Then you were a pretty crap-ass parent. Every working mom I know (including myself) works through lunch on a regular basis so she can head out early and spend time with the kids. Happy hour maybe once or twice a month.

Yeah, who are these working moms taking long lunches and going to happy hour on the regular?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone's boundaries and capacities are different regardless of SAH or WOH. We all know (or are!) SAH parents who stay home precisely so they CAN be involved with the PTA, have more time for working out or working around the house, be the one who volunteers to pick up random things for the kids' classroom, etc. So it's a little rich to sneer that yes, you stay at home, but you are still omg too busy to do these things. The better tack is to graciously hold your boundary if there is ever an incorrect assumption of how you specifically choose to use your time: "I'm sorry, I'm not available to do x at y time." Don't make it a thing.

Well said. And it's certainly reasonable to assume that a SAHM has more free time than a WOH mom!

Not if the children are under the age of 3 (or 4, depending on when they start PK). Being the full time caregiver for a 2 year old will absolutely melt your brain. The idea that it's easier for someone in that situation to do things for other people is crazy. To go back to OP's original point, imagine if you hired a nanny to care for your 2 year old and then the nanny was like "ok, but I've got a bunch of volunteer stuff to do for the PTA at my kid's school, and also I need to run some errands for some of my friends and neighbors, and pick up my sister's friends from school because she has a real job."

A 2 year old is a full time, exhausting job. Full stop. Anyone with kids, whether you SAHed or not, should know that. If you have ever spent 2-3 hours caring for a child this age, you should understand that it does not lend itself to a leisurely life of volunteer work and getting in workouts. When I was a SAHM of a child this age, I probably showered twice a week and regularly just ate cheese slices and an orange for 90% of my meals because I barely had time to take care of myself, much less do favors for friends.

Being a full time parent is exhausting and time consuming, no one is disputing that. The point that a lot of you are missing is that it’s not actually a job - no one is paying you for it, it’s not labor in the Marxian sense. And because of that, you are not accountable to anyone else for your time or performance. You have total flexibility and determination over your day.

Tell that to the 2 year old! Can I watch you explain Karl Marx while he screams at you that he wants yellow cheese, not white cheese, and he wants it RIGHT NOW! You could sell tickets to this little pay and become a true capitalist!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAHM job is one of the hardest - totally undervalued and underestimated.

It’s precisely valued. Nanny and housekeeper rates are readily available

And yet, when working parents had to do this during the pandemic, there was a widespread trend of leaving the workforce because it was too hard. Obviously, it’s not as simple as what you describe. Otherwise people would not have quit higher paying careers to take care of their children.

Your attitude is the epitome of how caregiving is devalued in this country. Until we stop ignoring and minimizing the realities of this (often unpaid) labor, women will continue to leave the workforce en masse. That hurts ALL working women, it hurts the economy and sets the entire country backwards.

Daycare workers earn around $15/hour. But keep thinking that you should earn income sitting at home. Ok. LMAO

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just saw the thread on the mom who wants to put it in her nanny contract that the nanny not use her cell phone while baby is awake.

I SAH with a 2 year old, and have two school age kids. I definitely use my cell phone during the day, but I DO try to hold myself to similar standards a WOH parent would hold a nanny - that is, I focus on my kid when he’s awake, so no, I don’t have time for an hour long phone call to chat with my parents, or to drive to pick up random things for the older kids classroom, or whatever. And ideally I’d not set up my two year old in front of the TV so I can workout or whatever else people think SAHMs have to a of time for but would NEVER let their nanny do!

That’s all. I find other SAH parents get that my hands are full, but I’m shocked how many WOHMs think I have all this time on my hands when they simultaneously seem aware that a nanny should be focusing on the kid.

OP. when your kids get older, you will shocked at the moms who claimed to work FT but work only a few hours per week.

So much depends on the age of kids, the specific kid, and/or specific job. At my last job I only had about 5 hrs work per day and spent the rest of the time just tooling around. My manager seemed to rarely work and would go run errands midday. That job did give me more “free” time than being a SAHM. I have a different position now that is much busier and more challenging. Still less stressful than caring for a toddler.

Maybe. But I am talking about elementary school age kids' SAHMs who do as little as possible - and give that term a whole new meaning.

I agree, I think it’s a shame when SAHM of elem kids with zero toddlers at home can’t volunteer or do anything other than go to the gym and salon. Yes, I know people like this. They’re nice people, but please contribute to the community in some way. I have worked, SAH with young kids, and had a few months at home when my youngest hit K. Those months quote literally felt like vacation. But OP has young kids, which is a completely different story. I wouldn’t expect her to do volunteer work. Her kid and home will keep her plenty busy, and she deserves a break during the kids nap time, just as a nanny does.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just saw the thread on the mom who wants to put it in her nanny contract that the nanny not use her cell phone while baby is awake.

I SAH with a 2 year old, and have two school age kids. I definitely use my cell phone during the day, but I DO try to hold myself to similar standards a WOH parent would hold a nanny - that is, I focus on my kid when he’s awake, so no, I don’t have time for an hour long phone call to chat with my parents, or to drive to pick up random things for the older kids classroom, or whatever. And ideally I’d not set up my two year old in front of the TV so I can workout or whatever else people think SAHMs have to a of time for but would NEVER let their nanny do!

That’s all. I find other SAH parents get that my hands are full, but I’m shocked how many WOHMs think I have all this time on my hands when they simultaneously seem aware that a nanny should be focusing on the kid.

OP. when your kids get older, you will shocked at the moms who claimed to work FT but work only a few hours per week.

So much depends on the age of kids, the specific kid, and/or specific job. At my last job I only had about 5 hrs work per day and spent the rest of the time just tooling around. My manager seemed to rarely work and would go run errands midday. That job did give me more “free” time than being a SAHM. I have a different position now that is much busier and more challenging. Still less stressful than caring for a toddler.

Maybe. But I am talking about elementary school age kids' SAHMs who do as little as possible - and give that term a whole new meaning.

I agree, I think it’s a shame when SAHM of elem kids with zero toddlers at home can’t volunteer or do anything other than go to the gym and salon. Yes, I know people like this. They’re nice people, but please contribute to the community in some way. I have worked, SAH with young kids, and had a few months at home when my youngest hit K. Those months quote literally felt like vacation. But OP has young kids, which is a completely different story. I wouldn’t expect her to do volunteer work. Her kid and home will keep her plenty busy, and she deserves a break during the kids nap time, just as a nanny does.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just saw the thread on the mom who wants to put it in her nanny contract that the nanny not use her cell phone while baby is awake.

I SAH with a 2 year old, and have two school age kids. I definitely use my cell phone during the day, but I DO try to hold myself to similar standards a WOH parent would hold a nanny - that is, I focus on my kid when he’s awake, so no, I don’t have time for an hour long phone call to chat with my parents, or to drive to pick up random things for the older kids classroom, or whatever. And ideally I’d not set up my two year old in front of the TV so I can workout or whatever else people think SAHMs have to a of time for but would NEVER let their nanny do!

That’s all. I find other SAH parents get that my hands are full, but I’m shocked how many WOHMs think I have all this time on my hands when they simultaneously seem aware that a nanny should be focusing on the kid.

OP. when your kids get older, you will shocked at the moms who claimed to work FT but work only a few hours per week.

So much depends on the age of kids, the specific kid, and/or specific job. At my last job I only had about 5 hrs work per day and spent the rest of the time just tooling around. My manager seemed to rarely work and would go run errands midday. That job did give me more “free” time than being a SAHM. I have a different position now that is much busier and more challenging. Still less stressful than caring for a toddler.

Maybe. But I am talking about elementary school age kids' SAHMs who do as little as possible - and give that term a whole new meaning.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone's boundaries and capacities are different regardless of SAH or WOH. We all know (or are!) SAH parents who stay home precisely so they CAN be involved with the PTA, have more time for working out or working around the house, be the one who volunteers to pick up random things for the kids' classroom, etc. So it's a little rich to sneer that yes, you stay at home, but you are still omg too busy to do these things. The better tack is to graciously hold your boundary if there is ever an incorrect assumption of how you specifically choose to use your time: "I'm sorry, I'm not available to do x at y time." Don't make it a thing.

Well said. And it's certainly reasonable to assume that a SAHM has more free time than a WOH mom!

Not if the children are under the age of 3 (or 4, depending on when they start PK). Being the full time caregiver for a 2 year old will absolutely melt your brain. The idea that it's easier for someone in that situation to do things for other people is crazy. To go back to OP's original point, imagine if you hired a nanny to care for your 2 year old and then the nanny was like "ok, but I've got a bunch of volunteer stuff to do for the PTA at my kid's school, and also I need to run some errands for some of my friends and neighbors, and pick up my sister's friends from school because she has a real job."

A 2 year old is a full time, exhausting job. Full stop. Anyone with kids, whether you SAHed or not, should know that. If you have ever spent 2-3 hours caring for a child this age, you should understand that it does not lend itself to a leisurely life of volunteer work and getting in workouts. When I was a SAHM of a child this age, I probably showered twice a week and regularly just ate cheese slices and an orange for 90% of my meals because I barely had time to take care of myself, much less do favors for friends.

Being a full time parent is exhausting and time consuming, no one is disputing that. The point that a lot of you are missing is that it’s not actually a job - no one is paying you for it, it’s not labor in the Marxian sense. And because of that, you are not accountable to anyone else for your time or performance. You have total flexibility and determination over your day.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAHM job is one of the hardest - totally undervalued and underestimated.

It’s precisely valued. Nanny and housekeeper rates are readily available

And yet, when working parents had to do this during the pandemic, there was a widespread trend of leaving the workforce because it was too hard. Obviously, it’s not as simple as what you describe. Otherwise people would not have quit higher paying careers to take care of their children.

Your attitude is the epitome of how caregiving is devalued in this country. Until we stop ignoring and minimizing the realities of this (often unpaid) labor, women will continue to leave the workforce en masse. That hurts ALL working women, it hurts the economy and sets the entire country backwards.

Anonymous wrote:I am always surprised at how up in arms the WOHMs get when some SAHM talks about being busy. The SAHMs are typically doing during the day what a nanny does (taking care of kids), plus other things for the household that a nanny doesn't do. The SAHMs who act like they are doing both are delusional -- they are hiring childcare to do all this during the day.

And everyone know that there is PLENTY of free time during the workday for working parents to do all kinds of errands, most of which can be done online. I mean, so many people around here are mid-grade feds who seem to barely work at all.

Anonymous wrote:I’m a working mom, and I spend exactly zero time thinking about how SAHMs spend their time. We really aren’t thinking about you OP; we’ve got our own stuff to worry about.