Anonymous wrote:

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

It's like saying: I want the government to build a road here, so I'm going put all of my energies into fighting the government's plan to build a road over there. That won't get the road built where I want it.

What kind of analogy is that? We don't want the road (the standards) at all.

You misunderstood the analogy. The roads represent things the government should do to fix the problems in education. So, for example, you might think that the most important thing the government should do to fix the problems in education is provide high-quality, affordable daycare. Which of your efforts would make it more likely to achieve your goal of a program providing high-quality, affordable daycare?

1. Fighting for high-quality, affordable daycare.
2. Fighting against the Common Core standards.

I think it's pretty clear that there are big problems with education in the US.

And I think it's pretty clear that there is a lot that is good about education in the US.

Anonymous wrote:

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

It's like saying: I want the government to build a road here, so I'm going put all of my energies into fighting the government's plan to build a road over there. That won't get the road built where I want it.

^Before you have this argument, you need to decide if a road is needed anywhere.

Before you have any argument, you need to make sure your assumptions are correct. That is the problem with CC.

It's not the same as the Affordable Care Act (if that's what you're comparing it to). With the ACA, it was clear to everyone that there were big problems with the health care system and they were based on clean well documented evidence (tons of it). With school standards, it's about as clear as mud.

I think it's pretty clear that there are big problems with education in the US.

Anonymous wrote:

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

What if you dislike Common Core just based on its own lack of merit? Isn't that enough to fight against it? What if you don't believe it even needs to be in place?

If you dislike the Common Core standards for themselves, then of course it makes sense to fight the Common Core standards.

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

It's like saying: I want the government to build a road here, so I'm going put all of my energies into fighting the government's plan to build a road over there. That won't get the road built where I want it.

^Before you have this argument, you need to decide if a road is needed anywhere.

Before you have any argument, you need to make sure your assumptions are correct. That is the problem with CC.

It's not the same as the Affordable Care Act (if that's what you're comparing it to). With the ACA, it was clear to everyone that there were big problems with the health care system and they were based on clean well documented evidence (tons of it). With school standards, it's about as clear as mud.

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

What if you dislike Common Core just based on its own lack of merit? Isn't that enough to fight against it? What if you don't believe it even needs to be in place?

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

It's like saying: I want the government to build a road here, so I'm going put all of my energies into fighting the government's plan to build a road over there. That won't get the road built where I want it.

What kind of analogy is that? We don't want the road (the standards) at all.

^ Tell that to the people who fought against the Vietnam War.

Anonymous wrote:

Shorter version: if you believe in something, then you should fight for that thing, instead of against something else. Does that make it clearer?

Sure. But, but it makes no sense. If you dislike Common Core, why should you not work to eliminate it. It is causing lots of problems--along with NCLB--and it is also costing lots of taxpayer money.

If you dislike the Common Core on grounds that the government should be doing other things to fix the problems in education, then you should work to get the government to do those other things to fix the problems in education.

It's like saying: I want the government to build a road here, so I'm going put all of my energies into fighting the government's plan to build a road over there. That won't get the road built where I want it.

Shorter version: if you believe in something, then you should fight for that thing, instead of against something else. Does that make it clearer?

Tell that to the gun control people.

Shorter version: if you believe in something, then you should fight for that thing, instead of against something else. Does that make it clearer?

Sure. But, but it makes no sense. If you dislike Common Core, why should you not work to eliminate it. It is causing lots of problems--along with NCLB--and it is also costing lots of taxpayer money.

Anonymous wrote:

OK, then I'm a strong opponent of the arguments that opponents use to argue against the Common Core standards.

I believe you have pro CC motivations that are not principled at all. Political or financial. Or both. You have no real facts, evidence or meaningful data to be pro CC, but it suits your political or financial ambitions. Sorry, but I just haven't been convinced. There is not enough to the whole process of CC that makes it look like a winner. I hope Uncle Sam says "I'm out" when you get in the shark tank.

I'm astonished that you can infer so much about my motivations and political or financial ambitions from my posts.

Anonymous wrote:

However, if your beliefs and principles are that the government should do X, then it's not very effective to spend your time arguing against the government doing Y.

Different poster here: This statement makes no sense at all to me. Could you clarify?

Shorter version: if you believe in something, then you should fight for that thing, instead of against something else. Does that make it clearer?

OK, then I'm a strong opponent of the arguments that opponents use to argue against the Common Core standards.

I believe you have pro CC motivations that are not principled at all. Political or financial. Or both. You have no real facts, evidence or meaningful data to be pro CC, but it suits your political or financial ambitions. Sorry, but I just haven't been convinced. There is not enough to the whole process of CC that makes it look like a winner. I hope Uncle Sam says "I'm out" when you get in the shark tank.

However, if your beliefs and principles are that the government should do X, then it's not very effective to spend your time arguing against the government doing Y.

Different poster here: This statement makes no sense at all to me. Could you clarify?