Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 15:12     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
hunters poison animals to sell their skins. A trail is a good place for animals to pass. They got out of hand


And fearing they'd been caught, the hunters use chloroform on the wayward hikers and their dog, leaving them to die from heat.



+1 and made off on their motorcycles afterwards


But for good measure - and to trick the police - they set off a boulder avalanche to cover up the tire tracks of the motorcycle.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 15:10     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
hunters poison animals to sell their skins. A trail is a good place for animals to pass. They got out of hand


And fearing they'd been caught, the hunters use chloroform on the wayward hikers and their dog, leaving them to die from heat.



+1 and made off on their motorcycles afterwards
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 15:08     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:When it's in the 90s and above, even the military has "black flag" conditions and are supposed to allow for specific periods of rest, water, shade and monitoring during drills. And this is military members.

So a 109 degree hike for several miles with a 20 lb baby and gear plus possibly an ailing dog is basically against all logic.


Looking at weather reports it looks like it was in the 80s when they started. Maybe they planned to be back by the time temps reached into the upper 90s to 100+.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 15:03     Subject: What happened to this California family?
When it's in the 90s and above, even the military has "black flag" conditions and are supposed to allow for specific periods of rest, water, shade and monitoring during drills. And this is military members.

So a 109 degree hike for several miles with a 20 lb baby and gear plus possibly an ailing dog is basically against all logic.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 15:02     Subject: What happened to this California family?
I doubt it was foul play, after reading all these posts. I think that this couple totally underprepared for the hike and overestimated their abilities. This unfortunately happens all the time. I just think of my husband, who is otherwise professionally quite accomplished, never thinking of bringing enough water on hikes, even with the kids. A couple of years ago, there was a physician who died on a hike (I think at the Grand Canyon?) because she, a medical doctor, under-estimated how much water she and the kids would need. The mom died and the kids were found alone.
I think that the parents realized they were in danger, the dad sat down with the kid and dog, and the mom died not far away seeking help. If you've ever seen heatstroke, which I have seen first hand having traveled extensively in the Middle East, it can be fatal very, very quickly. You become disoriented and your body just shuts down.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:42     Subject: What happened to this California family?
This is so sad. I wonder if they got lost, causing them to stay out much longer than anticipated.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:37     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Cases like this really drive home the need to get a device like an InReach satellite tracker if you're serious about hiking or adventuring outdoors. My DH enjoys backpacking and picked one up for a few hundred and basically has unlimited text even with no cell service. Even with the most basic subscription, you can call for rescue if you're somehow injured or lost.

That would be smart. My husband borrowed one when he went fishing alone in the mountains, in case he slipped and fell on the rocks. Also, whenever he is in an out of cell service area, he gives a start and end time so I know if I need to worry.


Yeah, we bought an InReach that my husband uses when he does solo hikes so I can keep track and know if he has a problem. We don't usually take it if we are hiking together, though, but now I might change that habit. Something like that could have made a real difference in this case.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:32     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As a mom, if your baby died and your husband was dying, would you leave the dead baby to go for aid? I’m not sure I would be rationale enough to leave them and may take their corpse but that could have been the scene here.


Splitting off to get help is a reasonable and pretty common survival strategy and has resulted in people saving their entire parties.



Yes, and it would also make sense to do what she did, which is leave the baby and dog with the husband because they are heavy and lessen her chances of making it to help.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:26     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As a mom, if your baby died and your husband was dying, would you leave the dead baby to go for aid? I’m not sure I would be rationale enough to leave them and may take their corpse but that could have been the scene here.


Add in feeling sick yourself and experiencing emotional trauma that may have intensified the dehydration. Or all of them just too weak/sick to go on.


The baby was 20 pounds. The mom was tiny - maybe 115 pounds soaking wet. I highly doubt she could carry the child over adverse terrain and in 100F. Which is why she left her. Probably to both call for help and drive the car quickly up the trail and get the baby inside with A/C.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:12     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Cases like this really drive home the need to get a device like an InReach satellite tracker if you're serious about hiking or adventuring outdoors. My DH enjoys backpacking and picked one up for a few hundred and basically has unlimited text even with no cell service. Even with the most basic subscription, you can call for rescue if you're somehow injured or lost.


Is that same as PLB?

Personal locator beacons (PLBs)


The one my DH has is something like this. It's a topo map with 2-way text service via Iridium. You pay subscription levels for the amount of text service you want from emergency only all the way up to unlimited 2-way.

https://www.thegpsstore.com/GPS-Units/Hiking-Handheld-GPS/Garmin-inReach-Explorer-?msclkid=b60c200ec2ff1b19117b4123d8d8cdb1


There are also ones that are $100 cheaper that don't have the topo mapping function .. they're basically just for satellite texting and geolocation in case of emergency. Iridium has solid global coverage, so good for hiking, boating, or wherever else you may have limited cell coverage.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:09     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Cases like this really drive home the need to get a device like an InReach satellite tracker if you're serious about hiking or adventuring outdoors. My DH enjoys backpacking and picked one up for a few hundred and basically has unlimited text even with no cell service. Even with the most basic subscription, you can call for rescue if you're somehow injured or lost.


Is that same as PLB?

Personal locator beacons (PLBs)


The one my DH has is something like this. It's a topo map with 2-way text service via Iridium. You pay subscription levels for the amount of text service you want from emergency only all the way up to unlimited 2-way.

https://www.thegpsstore.com/GPS-Units/Hiking-Handheld-GPS/Garmin-inReach-Explorer-?msclkid=b60c200ec2ff1b19117b4123d8d8cdb1
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:06     Subject: Re:What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I live in the SW, in an area that is seeing highs in the range of 103-108 (like the day they went hiking). I think the piece of this i STILL cannot understand, is why they were on this hike or what they were doing.

Yes, I know people die all the time of heat stroke. But they KNEW this area, it’s not like many of the cases listed here where it was tourists. I know they’d only lived there a year but that’s plenty of time to be familiar enough with the heat.

Also, living in this desert climate….it’s not like DC. It’s not like the weather is a surprise to anyone. They would have known the forecast for the day. There’s simply no way they didn’t know how hot it was and what was coming. It’s really really hot, every day, for months.

Even assuming that they got a later start than they planned or just somehow didn’t fully realize the heat, there’s no way they wouldn’t have realized soon into their hike that it is REALLY hot out and only getting hotter and there’s no shade. I don’t see why they wouldn’t have anticipated that things were going south. Not in an OMG we are gonna die kind of way. But just in a “this isn’t goood for the baby and really sucks” kind of way. You don’t need to be an expert hiker to discern those things. Why didn’t they turn back sooner into the hike?

Also….1 year olds don’t like to be in hiking carriers for hours. They just don’t. The baby had turned 1 in august.

The whole trip was weirdly conceived.

Now keep a few things in mind….

1. They went somewhere that they likely knew would have no foot traffic
2. They told no one where they were going
3. according to some reports, they did not bring very much water
4. They knew the conditions of the area and where they were going in advance (not clueless tourists)

I go back and forth between FA and heat stroke, but the hike was so ill conceived, and they stuck to it. It strikes me as just not adding up to an accidental hike gone wrong.


+1 (and I also live in the SW) NO ONE in their right mind would go on a hike like this with a baby. OR with a dog you care about at all. Just NO. The only people that do this sort of thing are (1) dumb tourists and (2) reckless young people in their teens and 20s. I just can’t emphasize this enough. If they were alone, it would be more plausible but it would take a special kind of stupid to go out like this with a baby or a dog.

They are either complete idiots who were overconfident and got in completely over their heads, or it’s a murder-suicide. I think the latter.


The only thing I can think is they intended to start really early and go on a <4mi hike. Something happened that made them start a bit later than intended, but it was still pretty cool at 8am when they actually started on the trail. Then something or a collection of somethings dragged their hike out. They made a series of little decisions that culminated in them being unable to make it back to the car by mid-morning like they'd planned. I can't think that heat was NOT a factor, but perhaps something else was going on as well.




Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 14:03     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As a mom, if your baby died and your husband was dying, would you leave the dead baby to go for aid? I’m not sure I would be rationale enough to leave them and may take their corpse but that could have been the scene here.


Add in feeling sick yourself and experiencing emotional trauma that may have intensified the dehydration. Or all of them just too weak/sick to go on.



Yes, it is most convincing that some combination of heat stroke plus emotional trauma (whether a parent, the dog, or baby initially) overwhelmed them and no one was functional enough to get help.
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 13:59     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:Cases like this really drive home the need to get a device like an InReach satellite tracker if you're serious about hiking or adventuring outdoors. My DH enjoys backpacking and picked one up for a few hundred and basically has unlimited text even with no cell service. Even with the most basic subscription, you can call for rescue if you're somehow injured or lost.


Is that same as PLB?

Personal locator beacons (PLBs)
Anonymous
Post 08/30/2021 13:59     Subject: What happened to this California family?
Anonymous wrote:Cases like this really drive home the need to get a device like an InReach satellite tracker if you're serious about hiking or adventuring outdoors. My DH enjoys backpacking and picked one up for a few hundred and basically has unlimited text even with no cell service. Even with the most basic subscription, you can call for rescue if you're somehow injured or lost.

That would be smart. My husband borrowed one when he went fishing alone in the mountains, in case he slipped and fell on the rocks. Also, whenever he is in an out of cell service area, he gives a start and end time so I know if I need to worry.