Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op, visit them. They will have busy lives. You need to visit, imo almost equally, where they live. They will want you to know their adult life, what it's like where they live. We've made ourselves comfortable in whatever hotel we need to stay in. We occupy our time in their location when they're busy. They are busy. They aren't taking time off work. DH and I create some of our own, independent memories where they live so our happiness and connection to their area doesn't rest solely on them. You need to be adaptable to many environments, especially when they are young adults. Don't make a fuss about inconvenience. They have busy lives. They won't always be able to come to you even if you think you've created some idillic environment and they really, really want to.

I think retired parents should visit MORE than equally. Retired parents have tons of money, tons of leave and young professionals starting out don't have that. Even parents who are 50+ and not yet retired have lots of leave at work that they can use.

My inlaws never visit us and it is hard to always be the ones who visit. We mostly go to see other siblings and family members in one place. Key is to have a big family to visit.

Anonymous wrote:I agree you need the space for visits, and also a close airport. My parents have a great house somewhere scenic and are super welcoming but it is SO hard to get to them, huge expense every time because we need connecting flights a rental car.

And I totally agree about the babyproofing/sleeping aspect. My in-laws are really bad with that. Nobody wants to stay on a couch, and when dcs were little it was horrible going because they had breakables all over the place, bar height glass table...

But really the most important thing is that they may not visit much even if you do everything "perfectly" because of other factors: They might need to also travel to see in-laws, they might not have much time off work, they may not have the money to prioritize traveling to you...So you have to be understanding and make the most of visits when they do happen and visit (without being a pita, hotel if best for them) as well.

Anonymous wrote:I would like to add...

- Having a functional and loving family of origin
- Not having addiction/abuse/adultery in family
- Everyone is educated and no one is suffering from mental illness
- Intact families and stable families
- No poverty. At a minimum, a comfortable middle class lifestyle.
- No generational trauma that impacts members of the family.

Anonymous wrote:I think you’re focusing way too much on physical characteristics. Work more on the emotional aspect. Get to know your kids for who they are, not for who you wish them to be. Love them unconditionally. Listen to them and be honest with them. Welcome their friends and significant others into your home without judgement. The rest is just window dressing.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My widowed friend sold her large house, and jointly bought largish homes with her two kids in a good school district. She has an independent suite in these houses and name on the deeds as co-owner. She takes turns living in each of these homes. She does not have to care about the maintenance of the home, grounds, utilities etc. She has become a minimalist. She has her own space, she has enabled her kids to buy homes in good school district which they could have not done on their own at a young age, she is close with her grandkids, and she has given her children their inheritance and a leg up while she is still living.

What happens when your widowed friend starts deteriorating physically and mentally? How minimalist is her home care going to be since the money is locked in the kids’ houses?

One of my mom’s friends did something like that. It was great until she needed help with basic daily living. Surprise, neither of the kids wanted to do it, and they didn’t feel like giving back part of their “inheritance” to pay for an aid either.

She is quite savvy. She has a condo too that she rents out. Probably she will sell it in the near future. She is also getting a pension. She is pretty good about nurturing care staff around her. She pays for the cleaner, cook etc. She has money to have an aide look after her, if need be. She is very astute and she has kept the money for her care. If she had less money, she would have kept the money and moved to assisted living etc. She really has no illusions about the world. First rule of thumb after you have given your kids a college education and they have launched is to be very comfortable in your retirement. If it means that you live a frugal life to get there - so be it. Don't be without money in your old age.

I agree with the last part, but frugal life is not what the adult children are demanding in order to visit - a 4 bedroom house in a popular destination, etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I go home* because my parents are there. That’s it, and it’s enough.



*Which is neither the town where I grew up nor the town where they lived for 30+ years after I went off to college.

+1. My parents moved from my childhood home when I went to college, then retired to a different state. We plan on moving from our house as soon as our youngest gets into college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your list is deranged. Living in California will be a major, major down side if your kids end up on the East Coast. I think you are imagining your adult children as toddlers who love water play and pets and need to run around. You might have grandkids like that, but your adult kids are going to be adults.

Here's what makes a difference for me:
*** Stay married!!! NO new partner trying to work his way in. NO step"siblings". NO pressure to play fake happy family with people you barely know! This is a huge deal.

*** When you have grandkids, thoroughly baby-proof your house so your kids aren't on guard for toddler safety the whole time. Get up-to-date baby stuff so that your kids don't have to bring it all with them. Have the right size diapers, a non-expired car seat, etc.

*** Make yourself aware of modern parenting trends so that you don't accidentally do something that is no longer okay. Be apprised of food rules, the latest thinking on discipline, etc. You will think all this is crazy, but it will really help you in getting along and being a relaxing and happy place to visit, rather than a place where your children feel judged and feel like if they turn their head for a moment you'll do something unsafe. And don't be judgmental if your grandchildren have special needs that affect their social behavior. Accept it. Be the accepting person in their lives, not the critical, blaming person.

*** Get a hearing aid when you need one! It's so tiresome to have to repeat myself because of my dad's vanity and denial. He can't understand what his grandchildren say, at all, and he doesn't care. It makes me so sad.

*** Don't move somewhere remote and expect them to visit because it's pretty or has skiing or whatever. They only have so many vacation days and if it's hard to get to, you'll get less visit, period.

*** Have good sleeping arrangements so that people get a good night's sleep, or don't pitch a fit when they get a hotel. I hate coming home from "vacation" more tired than I was when I started out. Have a good enough water heater for everyone to shower.

*** Be flexible about scheduling. Don't insist on Christmas or whatever on the actual calendar day. Be the easier and more flexible person in their lives and it will make it easier for them to visit you.

*** Allow them to go out and enjoy the area and see their childhood friends, do not pout if you don't get 100% of their time and attention during the visit. These social connections will help them motivate to come to your area. Similarly don't insist that everyone stand on ceremony in the living room the whole time. Let people take breaks, rest, nap telework, whatever.

*** Food should be good but you shouldn't be spending a lot of time stressing out in the kitchen or making your cooking timeline dominate the schedule. My mom is great with this-- all dinners are pre-made by her (like, a lasagna that she made and froze), and all lunches are good quality bread and cheese and charcuterie plus a soup and salad. Not a lot of actual cooking during the visit.

Great list, PP. I would like to add to it -

- Don't have a home which is hoarded, cluttered, needs repair. This is extremely stressful to grown kids.

- Maintain your physical, mental and social health. Adult kids want you to be self-sufficient, healthy and happy. Be a source of strength and support for them. Don't make them feel guilt, fear and anxiety when they see you. Have your own life, friends, travel plans etc.

- If you travel a lot. Share your travel calendar and itinerary with your kids. My AC have visited us at our vacation locations when we rented accomodation/car there. If we stay at a location for a longish time - my kids, relatives, friends will come and stay for a few days.

- Get your legal and medical papers in order. Be equal and equitable with all kids. Discuss your will with all kids together and keep on improving it for a long time until everyone feels satisfied. You want the siblings to like and support each other. This will happen if all your children feel equally loved by you and one part of it is to get equal inheritance. What does it mean? Whatever your children agree to after much discussion and debate.

- Have your boundaries very clear. I don't have pets and I don't like pets in my house. My adult kids know that and they also decided not to keep pets. If you are ok with pets then you need to understand that there maybe a grandkid or SO who don't like pets, allergic to pets or scared of pets.

- Don't get into bean counting with your DIL or SIL side of the family. Especially during holidays. Don't go creating drama.

- At least be open to listening to your kids concern about your eldercare and think of creative solutions before you are in a dire strait.

To summarize the two posts above:

1. Have lots of money
2. Spend lots of money on your grown children and bend your life to their preferences
3. Don’t ever show that you may need something from them. Only they are allowed to take.

The life of my dreams!

I am the person who added to the first list. I am the parent, not the adult child. However, I am a generation (gen X) who have looked after my parents and ILs (silent generation) because they were the most loving parents and ILs. They did their best for us, gave us a college education, paid for our modest wedding and did not ask us anything for their retirement. We still ended up having to shift them to apartments, fixing their homes, sorting out paperwork, having to find people to take care of them...surgeries, death, funerals.

Seeing their decline - I started to make a mental check-list for my own self.
1) We must be financially self-sufficient and have plans for our own decline. We must have enough insurance for all kinds of situations.
2) Become minimal and get rid of stuff. Do the Swedish Death Cleanse.
3) Enjoy travel and vacations. Let kids and family come to your vacations because that way you keep seeing them. (of course, if you have money).
4) Not have things that need taken care of - pets and plants.
5) Keep children appraised of your paperwork etc. Make wills.
6) Must keep healthy. Must exercise to not have falls in old age. Exercise, eat right, catch symptoms in time etc.

What do I need from my kids? I do not need their constant companionship because by making my home comfortable and not putting demands on them - they already love to come home.

Do I need my kids to make meals for me? Not unless I am ill or sick.

Do I need my kids to pay my bills? No. I am financially better off than them because of my inexpensive home and my fat pension. We are also very forward-thinking about adapting to new technology etc and careful about being scammed. So we pay our own bills. Once the house is paid off, and the kids are on their own, you do not spend as much. Most of our money goes towards maintaining home, yard, healthy lifestyle, socializing and travelling.

When I am that feeble that my kids need to make decisions for me - I have already done footwork for them. And then whatever they decided...I do not care.

Exactly what do I need from my kids that they will not give me? I am available to be helpful to them with childcare. Why would they not use that if we are not scums?

I cannot be a terrible mom or grandparents and then expect my kids to be devoted and filial. They learn by example. I cannot raise kids who did not launch successfully to financially look after themselves and their own families.

Oh, and if you are really a Gen X, you are old enough to know that you can’t plan for everything, including staying in good health. My father was in a great shape and got around mostly on his (non-electric) bike until he was 76. Then a blood cancer hit. His remaining years were one fall after another, broken bones, and so on, because there are things you can’t outrun. You simply don’t know what will bring you down eventually and how rough it’s going to be on your loved ones. Your super strong and agile body may be their curse for many, many years if the first thing to fail is your mind.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your list is deranged. Living in California will be a major, major down side if your kids end up on the East Coast. I think you are imagining your adult children as toddlers who love water play and pets and need to run around. You might have grandkids like that, but your adult kids are going to be adults.

Here's what makes a difference for me:
*** Stay married!!! NO new partner trying to work his way in. NO step"siblings". NO pressure to play fake happy family with people you barely know! This is a huge deal.

*** When you have grandkids, thoroughly baby-proof your house so your kids aren't on guard for toddler safety the whole time. Get up-to-date baby stuff so that your kids don't have to bring it all with them. Have the right size diapers, a non-expired car seat, etc.

*** Make yourself aware of modern parenting trends so that you don't accidentally do something that is no longer okay. Be apprised of food rules, the latest thinking on discipline, etc. You will think all this is crazy, but it will really help you in getting along and being a relaxing and happy place to visit, rather than a place where your children feel judged and feel like if they turn their head for a moment you'll do something unsafe. And don't be judgmental if your grandchildren have special needs that affect their social behavior. Accept it. Be the accepting person in their lives, not the critical, blaming person.

*** Get a hearing aid when you need one! It's so tiresome to have to repeat myself because of my dad's vanity and denial. He can't understand what his grandchildren say, at all, and he doesn't care. It makes me so sad.

*** Don't move somewhere remote and expect them to visit because it's pretty or has skiing or whatever. They only have so many vacation days and if it's hard to get to, you'll get less visit, period.

*** Have good sleeping arrangements so that people get a good night's sleep, or don't pitch a fit when they get a hotel. I hate coming home from "vacation" more tired than I was when I started out. Have a good enough water heater for everyone to shower.

*** Be flexible about scheduling. Don't insist on Christmas or whatever on the actual calendar day. Be the easier and more flexible person in their lives and it will make it easier for them to visit you.

*** Allow them to go out and enjoy the area and see their childhood friends, do not pout if you don't get 100% of their time and attention during the visit. These social connections will help them motivate to come to your area. Similarly don't insist that everyone stand on ceremony in the living room the whole time. Let people take breaks, rest, nap telework, whatever.

*** Food should be good but you shouldn't be spending a lot of time stressing out in the kitchen or making your cooking timeline dominate the schedule. My mom is great with this-- all dinners are pre-made by her (like, a lasagna that she made and froze), and all lunches are good quality bread and cheese and charcuterie plus a soup and salad. Not a lot of actual cooking during the visit.

Great list, PP. I would like to add to it -

- Don't have a home which is hoarded, cluttered, needs repair. This is extremely stressful to grown kids.

- Maintain your physical, mental and social health. Adult kids want you to be self-sufficient, healthy and happy. Be a source of strength and support for them. Don't make them feel guilt, fear and anxiety when they see you. Have your own life, friends, travel plans etc.

- If you travel a lot. Share your travel calendar and itinerary with your kids. My AC have visited us at our vacation locations when we rented accomodation/car there. If we stay at a location for a longish time - my kids, relatives, friends will come and stay for a few days.

- Get your legal and medical papers in order. Be equal and equitable with all kids. Discuss your will with all kids together and keep on improving it for a long time until everyone feels satisfied. You want the siblings to like and support each other. This will happen if all your children feel equally loved by you and one part of it is to get equal inheritance. What does it mean? Whatever your children agree to after much discussion and debate.

- Have your boundaries very clear. I don't have pets and I don't like pets in my house. My adult kids know that and they also decided not to keep pets. If you are ok with pets then you need to understand that there maybe a grandkid or SO who don't like pets, allergic to pets or scared of pets.

- Don't get into bean counting with your DIL or SIL side of the family. Especially during holidays. Don't go creating drama.

- At least be open to listening to your kids concern about your eldercare and think of creative solutions before you are in a dire strait.

To summarize the two posts above:

1. Have lots of money
2. Spend lots of money on your grown children and bend your life to their preferences
3. Don’t ever show that you may need something from them. Only they are allowed to take.

The life of my dreams!

I am the person who added to the first list. I am the parent, not the adult child. However, I am a generation (gen X) who have looked after my parents and ILs (silent generation) because they were the most loving parents and ILs. They did their best for us, gave us a college education, paid for our modest wedding and did not ask us anything for their retirement. We still ended up having to shift them to apartments, fixing their homes, sorting out paperwork, having to find people to take care of them...surgeries, death, funerals.

Seeing their decline - I started to make a mental check-list for my own self.
1) We must be financially self-sufficient and have plans for our own decline. We must have enough insurance for all kinds of situations.
2) Become minimal and get rid of stuff. Do the Swedish Death Cleanse.
3) Enjoy travel and vacations. Let kids and family come to your vacations because that way you keep seeing them. (of course, if you have money).
4) Not have things that need taken care of - pets and plants.
5) Keep children appraised of your paperwork etc. Make wills.
6) Must keep healthy. Must exercise to not have falls in old age. Exercise, eat right, catch symptoms in time etc.

What do I need from my kids? I do not need their constant companionship because by making my home comfortable and not putting demands on them - they already love to come home.

Do I need my kids to make meals for me? Not unless I am ill or sick.

Do I need my kids to pay my bills? No. I am financially better off than them because of my inexpensive home and my fat pension. We are also very forward-thinking about adapting to new technology etc and careful about being scammed. So we pay our own bills. Once the house is paid off, and the kids are on their own, you do not spend as much. Most of our money goes towards maintaining home, yard, healthy lifestyle, socializing and travelling.

When I am that feeble that my kids need to make decisions for me - I have already done footwork for them. And then whatever they decided...I do not care.

Exactly what do I need from my kids that they will not give me? I am available to be helpful to them with childcare. Why would they not use that if we are not scums?

I cannot be a terrible mom or grandparents and then expect my kids to be devoted and filial. They learn by example. I cannot raise kids who did not launch successfully to financially look after themselves and their own families.

I am the person you are responding to, and I agree, in principle, with your points 1-6 (I am Gen X too). But here is the rub - lots of it is not compatible with the demands of many adult children here. Saying yes to minimalism and staying independent to the max means a compact apartment in a highly walkable place (we are in NYC), which also means a sofa for you and a playpen for for your baby as a crib when you visit. And you better learn to manage your SUV sized stroller on the subway or bring a compact one..

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, your list is deranged. Living in California will be a major, major down side if your kids end up on the East Coast. I think you are imagining your adult children as toddlers who love water play and pets and need to run around. You might have grandkids like that, but your adult kids are going to be adults.

Here's what makes a difference for me:
*** Stay married!!! NO new partner trying to work his way in. NO step"siblings". NO pressure to play fake happy family with people you barely know! This is a huge deal.

*** When you have grandkids, thoroughly baby-proof your house so your kids aren't on guard for toddler safety the whole time. Get up-to-date baby stuff so that your kids don't have to bring it all with them. Have the right size diapers, a non-expired car seat, etc.

*** Make yourself aware of modern parenting trends so that you don't accidentally do something that is no longer okay. Be apprised of food rules, the latest thinking on discipline, etc. You will think all this is crazy, but it will really help you in getting along and being a relaxing and happy place to visit, rather than a place where your children feel judged and feel like if they turn their head for a moment you'll do something unsafe. And don't be judgmental if your grandchildren have special needs that affect their social behavior. Accept it. Be the accepting person in their lives, not the critical, blaming person.

*** Get a hearing aid when you need one! It's so tiresome to have to repeat myself because of my dad's vanity and denial. He can't understand what his grandchildren say, at all, and he doesn't care. It makes me so sad.

*** Don't move somewhere remote and expect them to visit because it's pretty or has skiing or whatever. They only have so many vacation days and if it's hard to get to, you'll get less visit, period.

*** Have good sleeping arrangements so that people get a good night's sleep, or don't pitch a fit when they get a hotel. I hate coming home from "vacation" more tired than I was when I started out. Have a good enough water heater for everyone to shower.

*** Be flexible about scheduling. Don't insist on Christmas or whatever on the actual calendar day. Be the easier and more flexible person in their lives and it will make it easier for them to visit you.

*** Allow them to go out and enjoy the area and see their childhood friends, do not pout if you don't get 100% of their time and attention during the visit. These social connections will help them motivate to come to your area. Similarly don't insist that everyone stand on ceremony in the living room the whole time. Let people take breaks, rest, nap telework, whatever.

*** Food should be good but you shouldn't be spending a lot of time stressing out in the kitchen or making your cooking timeline dominate the schedule. My mom is great with this-- all dinners are pre-made by her (like, a lasagna that she made and froze), and all lunches are good quality bread and cheese and charcuterie plus a soup and salad. Not a lot of actual cooking during the visit.

Great list, PP. I would like to add to it -

- Don't have a home which is hoarded, cluttered, needs repair. This is extremely stressful to grown kids.

- Maintain your physical, mental and social health. Adult kids want you to be self-sufficient, healthy and happy. Be a source of strength and support for them. Don't make them feel guilt, fear and anxiety when they see you. Have your own life, friends, travel plans etc.

- If you travel a lot. Share your travel calendar and itinerary with your kids. My AC have visited us at our vacation locations when we rented accomodation/car there. If we stay at a location for a longish time - my kids, relatives, friends will come and stay for a few days.

- Get your legal and medical papers in order. Be equal and equitable with all kids. Discuss your will with all kids together and keep on improving it for a long time until everyone feels satisfied. You want the siblings to like and support each other. This will happen if all your children feel equally loved by you and one part of it is to get equal inheritance. What does it mean? Whatever your children agree to after much discussion and debate.

- Have your boundaries very clear. I don't have pets and I don't like pets in my house. My adult kids know that and they also decided not to keep pets. If you are ok with pets then you need to understand that there maybe a grandkid or SO who don't like pets, allergic to pets or scared of pets.

- Don't get into bean counting with your DIL or SIL side of the family. Especially during holidays. Don't go creating drama.

- At least be open to listening to your kids concern about your eldercare and think of creative solutions before you are in a dire strait.

To summarize the two posts above:

1. Have lots of money
2. Spend lots of money on your grown children and bend your life to their preferences
3. Don’t ever show that you may need something from them. Only they are allowed to take.

The life of my dreams!

I am the person who added to the first list. I am the parent, not the adult child. However, I am a generation (gen X) who have looked after my parents and ILs (silent generation) because they were the most loving parents and ILs. They did their best for us, gave us a college education, paid for our modest wedding and did not ask us anything for their retirement. We still ended up having to shift them to apartments, fixing their homes, sorting out paperwork, having to find people to take care of them...surgeries, death, funerals.

Seeing their decline - I started to make a mental check-list for my own self.
1) We must be financially self-sufficient and have plans for our own decline. We must have enough insurance for all kinds of situations.
2) Become minimal and get rid of stuff. Do the Swedish Death Cleanse.
3) Enjoy travel and vacations. Let kids and family come to your vacations because that way you keep seeing them. (of course, if you have money).
4) Not have things that need taken care of - pets and plants.
5) Keep children appraised of your paperwork etc. Make wills.
6) Must keep healthy. Must exercise to not have falls in old age. Exercise, eat right, catch symptoms in time etc.

What do I need from my kids? I do not need their constant companionship because by making my home comfortable and not putting demands on them - they already love to come home.

Do I need my kids to make meals for me? Not unless I am ill or sick.

Do I need my kids to pay my bills? No. I am financially better off than them because of my inexpensive home and my fat pension. We are also very forward-thinking about adapting to new technology etc and careful about being scammed. So we pay our own bills. Once the house is paid off, and the kids are on their own, you do not spend as much. Most of our money goes towards maintaining home, yard, healthy lifestyle, socializing and travelling.

When I am that feeble that my kids need to make decisions for me - I have already done footwork for them. And then whatever they decided...I do not care.

Exactly what do I need from my kids that they will not give me? I am available to be helpful to them with childcare. Why would they not use that if we are not scums?

I cannot be a terrible mom or grandparents and then expect my kids to be devoted and filial. They learn by example. I cannot raise kids who did not launch successfully to financially look after themselves and their own families.