Anonymous wrote:People make snarky comments about having 3+ all the time but it’s been a life saver for these kids to have each other during the pandemic. They haven’t been lonely and still get tons of play. So we’re quite happy with having gone with more than the norm

Anonymous wrote:For me it was one then surprise twins. But I am happy to have three even though I might not have had a third separately (or might not have tried very hard). I like kids, I can afford it, why not? I am not too stressed or tired.

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Anonymous wrote:I’m a SAHM so this thread isn’t addressed to me but what do you mean by “spending time with your kids”? My kids would rather play with their friends (or each other now that we’re locked down). We do fun stuff together, in the before times we did solo outings occasionally, but I’m their mom, not their playmate. If they want to help me cook dinner or go for a walk and talk about life or weed the garden together, cool.

This. I like you, PP. And I'm a WOHM (currently working at home). I enjoy it when people who make different choices can agree on things. I wish more of DCUM was like this.

Agree. What is with all the insistence of 1:1 time. Kids don't want that daily for prolonged periods

It’s not just about 1:1 time. A parent also has to spend time thinking about the kid too. Whether they’re meeting milestones. Whether they’re okay physically, emotionally, socially, academically. Helping them with homework. Buying clothes for them. Finding good activities and summer camps to enroll them in. Participating in events for school and activities.

Most parents with demanding jobs and too many kids either outsource all of that parenting to others. Or else decide they’re not going to bother and just do the bare minimum for their kids. And I’m not a SAHM, btw.

I’m the original SAHM poster, and I absolutely would not be able to do all the stuff I do and have a demanding full-time job. But most of what I do could be easily done by someone else! School events, assessing activities and milestones and helping kids deal with social issues, sure, that really does want a parent. But my time is mostly spent tidying, cooking, cleaning, mediating squabbles, wiping butts, transporting — all of that a good nanny or housekeeper could do just fine. It’s not how I choose to live my life, both because I enjoy doing these things to take care of my family and because it’s easier to keep track of what’s going on my kids’ lives when we’re in the same place, but it’s certainly possible. My husband seems to do all the “this really needs a parent” jobs while running a company. I guess he and I spend more time talking about the kids than we would with a hypothetical nanny?

Thank you. Someone has to do those things, but they are not the most important part of parenting. The important part is the helping with emotional regulation, the emotional support, listening. I can pay someone to wipe butts if I have a job. For us we waited to have a third until we felt we could be emotionally present enough for them. This requires outsourcing of other things so we could prioritize our mental health. Can’t pour from an empty cup and all that

Kids need their parents doing those things as its part of parenting. If you outsource everything down to wiping butts, then what really is your role as a parent except to pay for things. Clothing, shopping, cooking are not a big deal and those can be outsourced, but its part of being involved as a parent.

DH and I work FT (albeit in very flexible, not typically demanding jobs) and have three kids. I think too many parents focus on quality over quantity time with their kids, but kids need at least some quantity, too. The people who are wiping butts are also the ones *present* most of the time. Being able to truly help kids with emotional development means knowing them and being around enough to have a sense of what they need. You can’t just do that while you’re at brunch Sunday morning or at your weekly outing or whatever.

Even things like schlepping kids to activities: you can learn SO much about your kids during those car rides, whether from talking to them or listening to their conversations with friends when you’re older. So, sure, we had our kids in daycare before they started school, but they also didn’t spend 11 hours/day there, nor did we hire babysitters for large chunks of our weekends. There’s a balance between spending every non-working moment with your kids and outsourcing everything.

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I don't disagree that there are easier ways to show you have resources, but I absolutely think there are people who have a third (or fourth, now) kid to signal status. They may not even be aware of that as a factor, but I know way too many Type A people who get a charge out of their ability to display their professional and parental prowess by having 3+ kids. It wasn't why we have three kids, but is that a reason for some people? Totally.

Maybe it's because I don't live in DC, but there's nothing impressive to most people I know about 3 or 4 kids. 7 kids, yes, people do a double take. 3 or 4, nobody gives a hoot.

Where do you live? When I lived in the Midwest, yeah, I agree. But then, people there generally weren't as professionally ambitious as they are here. It's less the more kids thing, it's more kids AND a demanding career, which is the whole point of this thread.

Yes, the Midwest. The professional ambitions here aren't as prestigious, but I know plenty of people who work long hours and/or have to travel a lot. I don't get the impression this thread is limited to brain surgeons who work 90+ hours every week.

Yes, because that's the only demanding job out there. Actual work hours aside, the culture in DC is palpably different from the Midwest, and that's part of why having more kids here becomes a status thing in a way it's not there. I don't think that's a positive, but it is what it is.

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I don't disagree that there are easier ways to show you have resources, but I absolutely think there are people who have a third (or fourth, now) kid to signal status. They may not even be aware of that as a factor, but I know way too many Type A people who get a charge out of their ability to display their professional and parental prowess by having 3+ kids. It wasn't why we have three kids, but is that a reason for some people? Totally.

Maybe it's because I don't live in DC, but there's nothing impressive to most people I know about 3 or 4 kids. 7 kids, yes, people do a double take. 3 or 4, nobody gives a hoot.

Where do you live? When I lived in the Midwest, yeah, I agree. But then, people there generally weren't as professionally ambitious as they are here. It's less the more kids thing, it's more kids AND a demanding career, which is the whole point of this thread.

Yes, the Midwest. The professional ambitions here aren't as prestigious, but I know plenty of people who work long hours and/or have to travel a lot. I don't get the impression this thread is limited to brain surgeons who work 90+ hours every week.

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Anonymous wrote:I’m a SAHM so this thread isn’t addressed to me but what do you mean by “spending time with your kids”? My kids would rather play with their friends (or each other now that we’re locked down). We do fun stuff together, in the before times we did solo outings occasionally, but I’m their mom, not their playmate. If they want to help me cook dinner or go for a walk and talk about life or weed the garden together, cool.

This. I like you, PP. And I'm a WOHM (currently working at home). I enjoy it when people who make different choices can agree on things. I wish more of DCUM was like this.

Agree. What is with all the insistence of 1:1 time. Kids don't want that daily for prolonged periods

It’s not just about 1:1 time. A parent also has to spend time thinking about the kid too. Whether they’re meeting milestones. Whether they’re okay physically, emotionally, socially, academically. Helping them with homework. Buying clothes for them. Finding good activities and summer camps to enroll them in. Participating in events for school and activities.

Most parents with demanding jobs and too many kids either outsource all of that parenting to others. Or else decide they’re not going to bother and just do the bare minimum for their kids. And I’m not a SAHM, btw.

I’m the original SAHM poster, and I absolutely would not be able to do all the stuff I do and have a demanding full-time job. But most of what I do could be easily done by someone else! School events, assessing activities and milestones and helping kids deal with social issues, sure, that really does want a parent. But my time is mostly spent tidying, cooking, cleaning, mediating squabbles, wiping butts, transporting — all of that a good nanny or housekeeper could do just fine. It’s not how I choose to live my life, both because I enjoy doing these things to take care of my family and because it’s easier to keep track of what’s going on my kids’ lives when we’re in the same place, but it’s certainly possible. My husband seems to do all the “this really needs a parent” jobs while running a company. I guess he and I spend more time talking about the kids than we would with a hypothetical nanny?

What does this mean?

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I don't disagree that there are easier ways to show you have resources, but I absolutely think there are people who have a third (or fourth, now) kid to signal status. They may not even be aware of that as a factor, but I know way too many Type A people who get a charge out of their ability to display their professional and parental prowess by having 3+ kids. It wasn't why we have three kids, but is that a reason for some people? Totally.

Maybe it's because I don't live in DC, but there's nothing impressive to most people I know about 3 or 4 kids. 7 kids, yes, people do a double take. 3 or 4, nobody gives a hoot.

Where do you live? When I lived in the Midwest, yeah, I agree. But then, people there generally weren't as professionally ambitious as they are here. It's less the more kids thing, it's more kids AND a demanding career, which is the whole point of this thread.

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Anonymous wrote:
I don't disagree that there are easier ways to show you have resources, but I absolutely think there are people who have a third (or fourth, now) kid to signal status. They may not even be aware of that as a factor, but I know way too many Type A people who get a charge out of their ability to display their professional and parental prowess by having 3+ kids. It wasn't why we have three kids, but is that a reason for some people? Totally.

Maybe it's because I don't live in DC, but there's nothing impressive to most people I know about 3 or 4 kids. 7 kids, yes, people do a double take. 3 or 4, nobody gives a hoot.

Anonymous wrote:
I don't disagree that there are easier ways to show you have resources, but I absolutely think there are people who have a third (or fourth, now) kid to signal status. They may not even be aware of that as a factor, but I know way too many Type A people who get a charge out of their ability to display their professional and parental prowess by having 3+ kids. It wasn't why we have three kids, but is that a reason for some people? Totally.