Anonymous
02/23/2019 16:03
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st-century planner for a rising school system.
With 70% economically disadvantaged students, and 40% at-risk, you are truly not their target audience. They know that your kids -- like all kids with educated parents, good housing and nutrition -- will be fine in the long run, getting into and attending college and entering the workforce.
Achieving even some of those outcomes for the rest of the students is far from guaranteed.
It should not require 'incentives' to get you to embrace your by-right school. Just do it.
How naive. Yes my good will do “fine” anywhere but I actually want her challenges. And around a better cohort of kids. Those kids need a huge amount of help but not at the expense of my kid. I know we are the mobility so we will move or go private. It’s a shame because EoTP is gentrifying but McFarland is going to be as weak as brookland. I can’t believe someone thought that was a success?
Anonymous
02/23/2019 15:06
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
No I go into this eyes open, interested in taking on these challenges. I've been around the block with DCPS, and this remains our plan. Good luck with your plans too!
Anonymous
02/23/2019 09:53
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.
I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.
You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.
This is just about the most misguided post I've ever read here. You personally don't have the authority or funding to make it happen and you're ignoring the Principal and other school officials, teachers, DCPS HQ, funding requirements, other parents who might not want what you want, etc. Plus you still have issues regarding peer group and systemic poverty issues. But go ahead and drink the DCPS HQ koolaid that all you have to do is show up and put in an effort and everything will be great for your kid.
Anonymous
02/23/2019 09:04
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.
I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.
You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.
Maybe, but from what I've observed over the years, what really works to effect steady change in a DCPS middle school is a strong principal who, for whatever reasons, happens to care about serving neighborhood kids academically. Not just paying lip service to meeting their needs, but actually meeting them.
We wouldn't have touched Stuart Hobson under the previous head, who left 18 months ago. From where I sit, the new guy has made more positive changes to draw in neighborhood families during his short stint at the school than the previous head made in the ten years prior.
Sorry, but you can't necessary "make it happen" when your principal isn't on the same page as you are, no matter how willing you are to roll up your sleeves and get to work.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 15:47
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
I agree with 15:25.
And as for the people who lament cobbling together MS solutions, the reality is that DCPS re-captures many of you for high school -- especially SWW.
If you move, your home will almost certainly be sold for more than you paid for it, bringing additional funds to the city. if it is sold to a childless couple or person, all the better, because those people use fewer city services than families with children.
DCPS does care about enrolling high school students and keeping them through graduation. That's where the movement is -- Bard, early college at Coolidge, expansion of Banneker, upping the admissions bar at McKinley.
And the middle/upper-income population at Ellington is climbing quickly.
And as for the people who lament cobbling together MS solutions, the reality is that DCPS re-captures many of you for high school -- especially SWW.
If you move, your home will almost certainly be sold for more than you paid for it, bringing additional funds to the city. if it is sold to a childless couple or person, all the better, because those people use fewer city services than families with children.
DCPS does care about enrolling high school students and keeping them through graduation. That's where the movement is -- Bard, early college at Coolidge, expansion of Banneker, upping the admissions bar at McKinley.
And the middle/upper-income population at Ellington is climbing quickly.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 15:25
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
I feel that basically if we show up we will win. And I’ll be honest about it, if people with money and degrees put their kids in a school and demand certain courses for their kids they’ll get it. DC has the money. My experience with building projects has consistently been that if empowered people with ability to get things done show up for their own self-interest DC will either cater to them in proportion to their numbers.
I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.
You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.
I’m not going to put myself here but when I send my older kid to MacFarland in a couple years I know that with my engagement and that of other parents they’ll be an Algebra class for my child to join. And follow-on options. I plan to make it happen. Not play the lottery or stay on the sidelines or move to Silver Spring.
You may not do take the plow yourselves but the furrow will be plowed. And soon.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:58
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st-century planner for a rising school system.
With 70% economically disadvantaged students, and 40% at-risk, you are truly not their target audience. They know that your kids -- like all kids with educated parents, good housing and nutrition -- will be fine in the long run, getting into and attending college and entering the workforce.
Achieving even some of those outcomes for the rest of the students is far from guaranteed.
It should not require 'incentives' to get you to embrace your by-right school. Just do it.
It shouldn't, but it absolutely does with the overwhelming majority of high SES neighborhood families. So become more pragmatic, DCPS, to help poor kids as much as anything else. At-risk students benefit from being in diverse schools, period. I should know, I received free school meals as a minority kid in mostly white schools. My peer group taught me to aim high in a way that a low-SES environment could not have, no matter how strong the academics might have been. The tyranny of low expectations can be seen on various levels in this city.
+1. middle/upper middle class folks aren't sending their kids to low performing DCPS schools full of at risk kids without getting some serious benefits not offered at charters or better DCPS. You can bitch & moan about it but it won't change a thing. Offering incentives too good to pass up is the only way.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:56
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st-century planner for a rising school system.
With 70% economically disadvantaged students, and 40% at-risk, you are truly not their target audience. They know that your kids -- like all kids with educated parents, good housing and nutrition -- will be fine in the long run, getting into and attending college and entering the workforce.
Achieving even some of those outcomes for the rest of the students is far from guaranteed.
It should not require 'incentives' to get you to embrace your by-right school. Just do it.
It shouldn't, but it absolutely does with the overwhelming majority of high SES neighborhood families. So become more pragmatic, DCPS, to help poor kids as much as anything else. At-risk students benefit from being in diverse schools, period. I should know, I received free school meals as a minority kid in mostly white schools. My peer group taught me to aim high in a way that a low-SES environment could not have, no matter how strong the academics might have been. The tyranny of low expectations can be seen on various levels in this city.
High SES neighborhoods are few and far between in DC, and virtually all DO have a viable MS. Look at the census tract data. There are simply too many poor and otherwise disadvantaged kids.
The places where these struggles are the truly mixed neighborhoods racially, ethnically and economically (see Brookland, Takoma, Brightwood for examples) or where the "high SES" families have abandoned their neighborhood schools and families from less affluent neighborhoods have availed themselves of the empty space in the feeders or the MS itself.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:51
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:.
Yes, because DCPS foolishly has no vision of creating true neighborhood middle schools. This is the case although it's better for parents, and communities, to have access to neighborhood schools most in-boundary families are fine with than to dash to far flung public middle schools, contributing to rush hour traffic snarls. I'm not sure I agree that SH honors classes have never been offered as a promise to lure in-boundary parents into enrolling. The new principal is certainly pushing the envelope on that score, more in deed than in word. More power to him - he's ahead of his time as an admin in this unusually poorly governed large East Coast city.
Why do you think honors classes are only appropriate or needed for IB students?
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:49
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st-century planner for a rising school system.
With 70% economically disadvantaged students, and 40% at-risk, you are truly not their target audience. They know that your kids -- like all kids with educated parents, good housing and nutrition -- will be fine in the long run, getting into and attending college and entering the workforce.
Achieving even some of those outcomes for the rest of the students is far from guaranteed.
It should not require 'incentives' to get you to embrace your by-right school. Just do it.
It shouldn't, but it absolutely does with the overwhelming majority of high SES neighborhood families. So become more pragmatic, DCPS, to help poor kids as much as anything else. At-risk students benefit from being in diverse schools, period. I should know, I received free school meals as a minority kid in mostly white schools. My peer group taught me to aim high in a way that a low-SES environment could not have, no matter how strong the academics might have been. The tyranny of low expectations can be seen on various levels in this city.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:48
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st century planner for a rising school system.
Agreed, and that's what makes me so mad. DC leaders could throw enough money at the problems to make some of these middle and high schools more appealing, but they consistently choose not to. If they provided excellent principals and teachers who have been trained on the latest methods, built state of the art science labs, offered test-in honors classes, free after school music lessons, sponsored amazing free field trips, built indoor pools, etc., then they could start to attract families who couldn't afford privates but want these amenities. The rising tide would lift all boats and all DC children would benefit.
The only thing that makes any sense to me is that these corrupt politicians know that parents of school-aged children attending public schools are a small percentage of the vote so it's not in their personal interest to do it.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:37
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
p I like you. Can’t say I hate everyone on DCUM any more!
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:24
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st-century planner for a rising school system.
With 70% economically disadvantaged students, and 40% at-risk, you are truly not their target audience. They know that your kids -- like all kids with educated parents, good housing and nutrition -- will be fine in the long run, getting into and attending college and entering the workforce.
Achieving even some of those outcomes for the rest of the students is far from guaranteed.
It should not require 'incentives' to get you to embrace your by-right school. Just do it.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:19
Subject: Re:What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
From a logic perspective, the more neighborhood families embracing a by-right middle school the better.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st century planner for a rising school system.
Visionary DCPS leaders could provide by-right middle schools with incentives to staff the darn honors classes, even if few (or no) students are in a position to take advantage of them during year one.
If you build it, they will come. And boy will they come if you can see beyond the end of your nose as a 21st century planner for a rising school system.
Anonymous
02/22/2019 14:14
Subject: What are folks doing for MS EOTP?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:DCPS's track record with renovated Cardozo, McKinley Middle, and of course BM (Brookland Middle) seems to point the way towards its projected success with MacFarland.
There's a reason the former DCPS Chancellor declared "Maybe Charters are better at middle school than DCPS."
it's so pathetic especially when they have the Stuart Hobson model actually working just offer some sort of differentiation/honors tracking already
There's more to it -- until and unless the stdent body changes, the results will be mixed. A sampling of middle schools find they all are serving some high need students, but overall there are fewer high needs students at SH and Hardy.
SH
29% at-risk
1% ELL
1% homeless
12% students with disabilities
Hardy
20% at risk
6% ELL
1% homeless
14% students with disabilities
Brookland
67% at risk
2% ELL
19% homeless
27% students with disabilities
MacFarland
41% at risk
36% ELL
2% homeless
10% students with disabilities
Jefferson
59% at risk
1%ELL
3% homeless
20% students with disabilities
I get your point if there was tracking/honors at the schools then more people would select them instead of charter/private/moving which would change the at-risk%
it's a chicken and egg problem you need a reason for people to embrace the school
True -- but you need critical mass to offer honors classes. Right now the school's top priorities are, and have to be IMO, serving the students they have.
SH's honors classes didn't magically appear when the first higher SES parents began enrolling their kids, and they weren't promised as a carrot to lure parents into enrolling. Schools have to reach a minimum threshold of students who are ready for more advanced work to be able to offer them (see SH and Hardy for 2 examples). From a staffing perspective, it isn't viable to offer honors classes for a handful of students.
Yes, because DCPS foolishly has no vision of creating true neighborhood middle schools. This is the case although it's better for parents, and communities, to have access to neighborhood schools most in-boundary families are fine with than to dash to far flung public middle schools, contributing to rush hour traffic snarls. I'm not sure I agree that SH honors classes have never been offered as a promise to lure in-boundary parents into enrolling. The new principal is certainly pushing the envelope on that score, more in deed than in word. More power to him - he's ahead of his time as an admin in this unusually poorly governed large East Coast city.