Watching this Men Tell All episode... so many guys I hardly remember! And man did she wade through a lot of toads.

I've posted a few times already, writing that I think it's Bryan, that Peter is monotonous and seems unsure of his 'relationship' with Rachel, and Eric, while sincere, is much less experienced and emotionally mature than Rachel. When Rachel is with Eric, it feels like he's her younger brother; they just are not on the same level in different ways. Bryan is ultra smooth and really has Rachel wrapped around his finger. Rachel does come across as more into Peter than vice versa. As posted already, she is engaged, so it has to be one of these three.

It's hard to know whether to choose the guy that's into you, or to choose the guy you are into. If she chooses Bryan, and it's based on lust, then I don't see that lasting forever. If she chooses Peter, and he never solidifies it, that's a waste of the whole "journey". Eric is the underdog but he might be the best bet. Since it's already spoiled that she's engaged, can we assume she didn't pick Peter?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm sure she's going to pick Bryan, and they'll be broken up within three months. Hell, they may even be broken up by the time after the rose airs.

God, Bryan is awful. Rachel would have the MIL from hell!

But the passion!!! Ugh, if I hear her talk one more time about passion, I am going to barf. I really liked her going in, but I cannot believe she can't see through his crap. Especially after her FAMILY called him on it. But I am 100% sure Bryan is the one she's going to pick and I'm so disgusted. I mean, her father is a FEDERAL JUDGE. I can't imagine how mortified he must be by all this.

I've been way too invested in this season and have been checking other discussion boards. The more I see it, the more I wonder if it is crappy editing to make us more invested in who gets the lead next. Plus if they showed Bryan to be a great, nice guy and you see the bachelorette clearly falling for him, where would be the interest in watching or talking about it? I see the whole Latin Lover, too smooth, stereotype they are putting on Bryan. It reminds me of Roberto with Ally. Yes, I see you ABC. What would they have done if there was a white guy that was all-in with Rachel and ready to get married - what edit would he have gotten?

I've been watching some of this SM/interview stuff and Dean has been more than a little shady lately. It's gone from, I will always be a little in love with Rachel to looking forward to growing our friendship to she is blinding by lust with Bryan (how is that respectful putting your "friend" on blast and trashing her relationship) to I want Peter to be the next bachelor but he would be kinda boring, to liking a borderline racist IG post about him not dating black women any more/now he's back (upping the ante in his ATR comment)

Peter, don't get me started with Peter. I was team #pachel in the beginning. But I don't see why ABC editing wouldn't have given us a true two guys all-in chasing Rachel /who will she choose, if they had that on tape. I'm seeing Rachel doing most of the work for Peter and wondering if she is the Bachelorette or is he the Bachelor. People are turning up the heat on Rachel that she should accept a guy that isn't into her and lower her expectations. Look at the Bachelorettes that are still together with their picks - did any of their guys make them feel less than secure in his feelings? You stand by and run the risk of it being that Harry Met Sally line where she said "all this time I've been saying that he didn't want to get married, when the truth is he didn't want to marry me". It's clear that either Peter isn't into Rachel or he isn't secure enough to go for it/he is not use to working for it. Say what you want about Bryan, but he isn't putting it on cruise control.

Anonymous wrote:Do you think the guys knew she was the bachelorette going into this?

It's possible that they didn't know before they applied but they tell them who the bachelorette is going to be and confirm they want to go on the show before starting.

Do you think the guys knew she was the bachelorette going into this?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm sure she's going to pick Bryan, and they'll be broken up within three months. Hell, they may even be broken up by the time after the rose airs.

God, Bryan is awful. Rachel would have the MIL from hell!

But the passion!!! Ugh, if I hear her talk one more time about passion, I am going to barf. I really liked her going in, but I cannot believe she can't see through his crap. Especially after her FAMILY called him on it. But I am 100% sure Bryan is the one she's going to pick and I'm so disgusted. I mean, her father is a FEDERAL JUDGE. I can't imagine how mortified he must be by all this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you can truly know how you're going to feel after 9 weeks unless you're actually in the process. Better that he's cautious now than proposing and breaking up later.

I agree but if he isn't into Rachel, he should just take himself out like Brooks did with Desriee or other contestants that weren't feeling it. I feel like he is giving her just enough to keep her coming (or himself in the running to be the next bachelor) but not enough she would pick him. To me, being on the same page about the pace of the relationship is important to being compatible. If he really needs more than 9 weeks to be willing to propose and isn't open to the possibility it could happen to him like it did his,parents that have been married for 35 years or so, he could be on a dating show like BIP that has less of a commitment, or date someone younger that isn't to settle down anytime soon, or find someone that doesn't care if they live together and don't get married.

There was a great post from Ask Caroline years ago about ultimatums and marriage. I can't remember how the woman phrased it but it was so spot on, like she didn't want to beg the guy to marry her or pressure him to do so if that wasn't what he wanted. She wanted to be married some day and to have children and if those weren't the things he wanted, she wanted him to let her go to find that with someone that did want those things. It's not about compromising, it's like Rachel tweeted that it's about finding the person that wants the same things as you and wants them with you. My mom likes to say that love is not always enough. What if Peter had said that he doesn't want kids while Rachel said she wanted to be a mom? Neither is wrong but it isn't fair to ask Rachel to give up on her dream of motherhood or to have Peter have a child he doesn't want. The right answer is to move on to someone on the same page.

While I agree with what you're saying, I think it's on Rachel to cut it off at this point. The guy is being honest about where he's at. He's not leading her on. He's not forcing, or even asking, her to give up her dreams. He's just happy with the relationship and wants to proceed at the normal pace, rather than Bachelor show pace. Since their current relationship is fine for him, but not for her, then she's the one who's not getting what she needs out of it and it's on her to break it off. When a guy tells you he's not going to marry you, listen to him. Don't hope that he means something else.

That's a good point. When you want different things, who has the responsibility to break it off? Part of me thinks Rachel since she hands out the roses. Part of me thinks Peter since he came to the show and knew what Rachel wanted from day one - there was no mystery there. So did he change his mind like he thought 9 weeks would be enough and finding that it isn't or was he hoping she would change her mind once they were involved more or was he just trying to be the next Bachelor, of would 9 weeks be enough with the right woman and Rachel isn't it and rather than say that he is trying to put it on her. It's the guy that does everything to make you break up with him instead of being upfront - this way he isn't "the bad guy".

Anonymous wrote:I'm sure she's going to pick Bryan, and they'll be broken up within three months. Hell, they may even be broken up by the time after the rose airs.

God, Bryan is awful. Rachel would have the MIL from hell!

Peter and Bryan are both after being The Bachelor, not after Rachel.

Eric is the only one who actually cares about Rachel, and sadly, I don't think it's going to be him. Rachel's going to use her lust to make a decision and end up alone again -- and unfortunately, it's not like Bachelor Nation is padded with lots of high-quality husband material. She'd be better off meeting dudes on eHarmony in Dallas. She's a catch.

I'm sure she's going to pick Bryan, and they'll be broken up within three months. Hell, they may even be broken up by the time after the rose airs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you can truly know how you're going to feel after 9 weeks unless you're actually in the process. Better that he's cautious now than proposing and breaking up later.

I agree but if he isn't into Rachel, he should just take himself out like Brooks did with Desriee or other contestants that weren't feeling it. I feel like he is giving her just enough to keep her coming (or himself in the running to be the next bachelor) but not enough she would pick him. To me, being on the same page about the pace of the relationship is important to being compatible. If he really needs more than 9 weeks to be willing to propose and isn't open to the possibility it could happen to him like it did his,parents that have been married for 35 years or so, he could be on a dating show like BIP that has less of a commitment, or date someone younger that isn't to settle down anytime soon, or find someone that doesn't care if they live together and don't get married.

There was a great post from Ask Caroline years ago about ultimatums and marriage. I can't remember how the woman phrased it but it was so spot on, like she didn't want to beg the guy to marry her or pressure him to do so if that wasn't what he wanted. She wanted to be married some day and to have children and if those weren't the things he wanted, she wanted him to let her go to find that with someone that did want those things. It's not about compromising, it's like Rachel tweeted that it's about finding the person that wants the same things as you and wants them with you. My mom likes to say that love is not always enough. What if Peter had said that he doesn't want kids while Rachel said she wanted to be a mom? Neither is wrong but it isn't fair to ask Rachel to give up on her dream of motherhood or to have Peter have a child he doesn't want. The right answer is to move on to someone on the same page.

While I agree with what you're saying, I think it's on Rachel to cut it off at this point. The guy is being honest about where he's at. He's not leading her on. He's not forcing, or even asking, her to give up her dreams. He's just happy with the relationship and wants to proceed at the normal pace, rather than Bachelor show pace. Since their current relationship is fine for him, but not for her, then she's the one who's not getting what she needs out of it and it's on her to break it off. When a guy tells you he's not going to marry you, listen to him. Don't hope that he means something else.

Anonymous wrote:I don't think you can truly know how you're going to feel after 9 weeks unless you're actually in the process. Better that he's cautious now than proposing and breaking up later.

I agree but if he isn't into Rachel, he should just take himself out like Brooks did with Desriee or other contestants that weren't feeling it. I feel like he is giving her just enough to keep her coming (or himself in the running to be the next bachelor) but not enough she would pick him. To me, being on the same page about the pace of the relationship is important to being compatible. If he really needs more than 9 weeks to be willing to propose and isn't open to the possibility it could happen to him like it did his,parents that have been married for 35 years or so, he could be on a dating show like BIP that has less of a commitment, or date someone younger that isn't to settle down anytime soon, or find someone that doesn't care if they live together and don't get married.

There was a great post from Ask Caroline years ago about ultimatums and marriage. I can't remember how the woman phrased it but it was so spot on, like she didn't want to beg the guy to marry her or pressure him to do so if that wasn't what he wanted. She wanted to be married some day and to have children and if those weren't the things he wanted, she wanted him to let her go to find that with someone that did want those things. It's not about compromising, it's like Rachel tweeted that it's about finding the person that wants the same things as you and wants them with you. My mom likes to say that love is not always enough. What if Peter had said that he doesn't want kids while Rachel said she wanted to be a mom? Neither is wrong but it isn't fair to ask Rachel to give up on her dream of motherhood or to have Peter have a child he doesn't want. The right answer is to move on to someone on the same page.

In a way I can't blame him. How many times have guys started to get down on one knee to propose, and then the woman stops him and says she's in love with the other guy. He only wants to propose once.

I don't think you can truly know how you're going to feel after 9 weeks unless you're actually in the process. Better that he's cautious now than proposing and breaking up later.