Anonymous wrote:Can we please let go of this storyline about white kids scoring high in DC, higher than the rest of the US?

If you compared them against similar SES in say, Greenwich, CT, or even (god forbid) Bethesda or Fairfax, I doubt they score higher in DC. You cannot lump people together by race, ignoring SES.

Just, can we please all let that go.

No, they really do, on the PISA test at 4th and 8th grade. Look it up.

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Anonymous wrote:So what would happen to Powell in say 5 years when say 50 Gentrifier families have sent their kids there in each year. Based on earlier posts these higher SES parents would have a really big difference.

In the past most people have just left the city when they could (if they had the money). But right now it seems like there is a chance for a tipping point- as so many people are buying the high priced renovations.

So why I suggest is a Gentrifiera pact- where we all agree to pick one school and send our kids there. Each year we sign up more and more parents- and when are kids are too young for school we get enough of us to help in advance of attendance. Kind of like a pay it forward pact.

Anyone else think this could work?

It could definitely work if you remember to all wear the uniform t-shirts that say "GREAT WHITE SAVIOR." This way, all of you will be able to find each other when you're out and about. Then you can compare notes while sitting in your high-priced renovated homes.

As unsavory as you may find it, yes, white kids help make schools better on paper - which is what many people look at. The tend to score the best on standardized tests, upping test scores for a school. Lots of education research supports this.

Where in my 'T shirts" post does it say that I fail to understand that white children score higher than not-white children on DCCAS tests? Of course they do. They score higher than anyone else in the United States, as a cohort.

No, see, my issue is with the OP's loathsome attitude about how they're going to storm the targeted school and take it over with the sheer force of their awesomeness. Their noblesse oblige, too -- she's gonna "pay it forward" for the few old-timer kids, who it is assumed do not get to enjoy high-priced renovations.

NP here wondering, "what the fuck is wrong with you" with your obsession with home renovation? People shouldn't invest in their homes, as opposed to letting them fall apart? A lot of gentrifiers are buying homes that are often 100+ years old, which in many cases suffered decades of neglect. Should they let the roof leak and let the wood continue to rot? Should they just grin and bear it when the fuses blow when they try toast a slice of bread? Chances are, they've already spent more money buying the place than the surrounding residents ever did, and as such they have an even greater stake in making sure the money they invested in that home doesn't go down the drain.

As for the "loathsome attitude" and all the rest of your hyperbole, I hope you some day realize that 98% of that interpretation is entirely in your own head. And oh, by the way, it's not white kids that score higher than anyone else in the United States, it's Asians.

DC's white kids score higher than any other state cohort of white kids in the US.

Gentrification has nothing to do with race. If wealthier whites move into a neighborhood that was historically poorer whites, that's gentrification. If wealthier blacks move into a neighborhood that was historically poorer blacks, that's gentrification. And, for that matter, if wealthy blacks move into a poor white neighborhood, that's gentrification too. It's about changes in economics, not about race.

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]^ One thing that is unusual in DC is that given its nature of being home to so much policy, research and analysis, there are more PhD's per capita in DC than there are in just about any other city in the US. And, a significant percentage of them are white. And, quite likely, in those highly-educated households, education is heavily emphasized and reinforced at home. As such, it would stand to reason that many of the white kids in DC who come from those households would score quite highly. As opposed to a white blue collar community in coal mining country, where the white kids aren't anywhere near as likely to come up with similar high scores. There are a lot of factors involved.[/quote]

We're a black couple with doctoral degrees (Ph.D and M.D.). We moved here recently from another part of the country and bought EOTP, in an increasingly affluent neighborhood. We enrolled our child in PK3 at our neighborhood school, and we're working on increasing enrollment by neighborhood families, both white and minority. We see increased IB enrollment as a good thing, hopefully leading to incremental gains in parental engagement, test scores, and financial support of the school. Increased IB enrollment will likely change the racial makeup of the school a bit; not sure how much. Are we too gentrifiers? I dunno.

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Eotp you're not a minority, rather whites are the minority.

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Anonymous wrote:^ One thing that is unusual in DC is that given its nature of being home to so much policy, research and analysis, there are more PhD's per capita in DC than there are in just about any other city in the US. And, a significant percentage of them are white. And, quite likely, in those highly-educated households, education is heavily emphasized and reinforced at home. As such, it would stand to reason that many of the white kids in DC who come from those households would score quite highly. As opposed to a white blue collar community in coal mining country, where the white kids aren't anywhere near as likely to come up with similar high scores. There are a lot of factors involved.

We're a black couple with doctoral degrees (Ph.D and M.D.). We moved here recently from another part of the country and bought EOTP, in an increasingly affluent neighborhood. We enrolled our child in PK3 at our neighborhood school, and we're working on increasing enrollment by neighborhood families, both white and minority. We see increased IB enrollment as a good thing, hopefully leading to incremental gains in parental engagement, test scores, and financial support of the school. Increased IB enrollment will likely change the racial makeup of the school a bit; not sure how much. Are we too gentrifiers? I dunno.

Yes, of course. Not that it's a bad thing.

Yes. And thank you for proving the point that gentrifiers are not classified by race, but socioeconomic status. Which is okay.

Of course, you're right PP. The trouble is that the NAEP doesn't break out the scores of black kids in DC whose parents have doctoral degrees and high income or net worth.

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Anonymous wrote:^ One thing that is unusual in DC is that given its nature of being home to so much policy, research and analysis, there are more PhD's per capita in DC than there are in just about any other city in the US. And, a significant percentage of them are white. And, quite likely, in those highly-educated households, education is heavily emphasized and reinforced at home. As such, it would stand to reason that many of the white kids in DC who come from those households would score quite highly. As opposed to a white blue collar community in coal mining country, where the white kids aren't anywhere near as likely to come up with similar high scores. There are a lot of factors involved.

We're a black couple with doctoral degrees (Ph.D and M.D.). We moved here recently from another part of the country and bought EOTP, in an increasingly affluent neighborhood. We enrolled our child in PK3 at our neighborhood school, and we're working on increasing enrollment by neighborhood families, both white and minority. We see increased IB enrollment as a good thing, hopefully leading to incremental gains in parental engagement, test scores, and financial support of the school. Increased IB enrollment will likely change the racial makeup of the school a bit; not sure how much. Are we too gentrifiers? I dunno.

Yes, of course. Not that it's a bad thing.

Yes. And thank you for proving the point that gentrifiers are not classified by race, but socioeconomic status. Which is okay.

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Anonymous wrote:^ One thing that is unusual in DC is that given its nature of being home to so much policy, research and analysis, there are more PhD's per capita in DC than there are in just about any other city in the US. And, a significant percentage of them are white. And, quite likely, in those highly-educated households, education is heavily emphasized and reinforced at home. As such, it would stand to reason that many of the white kids in DC who come from those households would score quite highly. As opposed to a white blue collar community in coal mining country, where the white kids aren't anywhere near as likely to come up with similar high scores. There are a lot of factors involved.

We're a black couple with doctoral degrees (Ph.D and M.D.). We moved here recently from another part of the country and bought EOTP, in an increasingly affluent neighborhood. We enrolled our child in PK3 at our neighborhood school, and we're working on increasing enrollment by neighborhood families, both white and minority. We see increased IB enrollment as a good thing, hopefully leading to incremental gains in parental engagement, test scores, and financial support of the school. Increased IB enrollment will likely change the racial makeup of the school a bit; not sure how much. Are we too gentrifiers? I dunno.

Yes, of course. Not that it's a bad thing.

Anonymous wrote:^ One thing that is unusual in DC is that given its nature of being home to so much policy, research and analysis, there are more PhD's per capita in DC than there are in just about any other city in the US. And, a significant percentage of them are white. And, quite likely, in those highly-educated households, education is heavily emphasized and reinforced at home. As such, it would stand to reason that many of the white kids in DC who come from those households would score quite highly. As opposed to a white blue collar community in coal mining country, where the white kids aren't anywhere near as likely to come up with similar high scores. There are a lot of factors involved.

We're a black couple with doctoral degrees (Ph.D and M.D.). We moved here recently from another part of the country and bought EOTP, in an increasingly affluent neighborhood. We enrolled our child in PK3 at our neighborhood school, and we're working on increasing enrollment by neighborhood families, both white and minority. We see increased IB enrollment as a good thing, hopefully leading to incremental gains in parental engagement, test scores, and financial support of the school. Increased IB enrollment will likely change the racial makeup of the school a bit; not sure how much. Are we too gentrifiers? I dunno.

Long time close-in DC resident here who has been reading about these debates for a LONG time. My kid will be entering the system in the fall.

I have been frustrated for my 16 years here that people who move to gentrifying neighborhoods are basically not allowed to want something better. You're not even allowed to voice your desire for something better. That, because these neighborhood schools are crappy, and that crappiness is the direct result of years of a bigger racist system that is set up against the long time residents, the newcomers have to just shut up and take it, or move away. And that somehow you are a righteous entitled brat if you ask about how to improve things. The crazy thing is that most of these crappy schools are under-enrolled, so it's not like you're robbing the original residents of their right to their school. There's this big issue that the gentrifying parents have to sit back and be observers, lest they interfere in the parents who are already there trying to fix things. But the reality is that nothing is going to fix until more rich kids (regardless of race) enroll in these schools. And more rich kids aren't going to come until lots of rich kids are already there. Which is only going to happen by letting the gentrifying parents get really vocal and involved. By making the gentrifying parents shut up and take a back seat, you effectively resign the school to staying mostly poor and therefore never improving.

Sorry for the rant. In more seriousness, my impression is that spending money doesn't do anything. All the PTA activities, fundraisers, volunteer events, park cleans etc are nothing more than a mechanism/signal for other high SES parents to connect with each other and to send a signal to each other and other potential parents that the school may be on the up and up -- so long as the momentum stays in place. But the activities themselves (better libraries, better park etc) have no bearing on the quality and educational outcomes. Nothing affects that other than the quality of the kids coming in.

Anonymous wrote:Top concerns if you are looking at a lower test score school are 1) how good are the SPED services at the school and 2) how deep is the differentiation within the classroom. Does the Principal have thoughtful and substantive responses to these questions. If the SPED is bad and the teachers I'll equipped or under supported in differentiating work, then any child who tests above the school average will be at a real disadvantage in that environment. However, if these areas are thoughtfully and strongly supported it can work quite well.

+100

More often than not, teachers just teach to the middle and ignore the upper and lower segments. They will pay lip service to differentiation, but teachers who are actually able to do a good job of differentiation are few and far between.

Top concerns if you are looking at a lower test score school are 1) how good are the SPED services at the school and 2) how deep is the differentiation within the classroom. Does the Principal have thoughtful and substantive responses to these questions. If the SPED is bad and the teachers I'll equipped or under supported in differentiating work, then any child who tests above the school average will be at a real disadvantage in that environment. However, if these areas are thoughtfully and strongly supported it can work quite well.

Anonymous wrote:Can we please let go of this storyline about white kids scoring high in DC, higher than the rest of the US?

If you compared them against similar SES in say, Greenwich, CT, or even (god forbid) Bethesda or Fairfax, I doubt they score higher in DC. You cannot lump people together by race, ignoring SES.

Just, can we please all let that go.

Actually there was a report that did extrapolate DC white test scores and they were the highest in the country. Greenwich May have money but it still doesn't top the kids in DC

Anonymous wrote:Can we please let go of this storyline about white kids scoring high in DC, higher than the rest of the US?

If you compared them against similar SES in say, Greenwich, CT, or even (god forbid) Bethesda or Fairfax, I doubt they score higher in DC. You cannot lump people together by race, ignoring SES.

Just, can we please all let that go.

That's a reasonable hypothesis, PP. With some work, it can be proven or refuted using NAEP results. However, I think you would have to sign an agreement and get access to the raw data in order to do so.

Here's another hypothesis, also reasonable: The NAEP scores of white kids in DC are very impressive given that many of them live in two-income households earning civil servant, government contractor, non-profit, etc. salaries.

The benefit that these kids have is not so much family wealth or income, but rather family educational attainment. These families are probably less wealthy than would be predicted by their educational attainment. So, when we write about high SES families, do we mean family income, family wealth, or family educational attainment?

^ One thing that is unusual in DC is that given its nature of being home to so much policy, research and analysis, there are more PhD's per capita in DC than there are in just about any other city in the US. And, a significant percentage of them are white. And, quite likely, in those highly-educated households, education is heavily emphasized and reinforced at home. As such, it would stand to reason that many of the white kids in DC who come from those households would score quite highly. As opposed to a white blue collar community in coal mining country, where the white kids aren't anywhere near as likely to come up with similar high scores. There are a lot of factors involved.