Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP - most of us who are "attacking" you on this board are just annoyed that you took over the thread.

No, I've been attacked for these sentiments for months. (And this thread was useless BS from page 1.) I was accused of "alienating" the parents on the SN board, when all I was doing was challenging their assumptions, not insulting their children. Everyone jumped on me - how dare you be ungrateful for the services that are being offered and ignore your child's problems, when what I was doing was far from that. I misjudged that forum, and perhaps my questions would have been better posed in general parenting. But to say the least, I was astounded that no one felt it was normal to question the validity of these assessments, the manner in which they are conducted, and the assumptions drawn from them. Just as I am astounded that no one feels it is normal to question the state of public education these days and the quality and affect of the city's PS and PK programs on our children.

Wow, we got a lot of that, too. To include being browbeaten by the ES principal who basically suggested what we were doing by not having the most extreme forms of intervention with medication and aides for our child was tantamount to child abuse, when all DC was really ever doing is spacing out in class - not acting out, not being violent or disruptive in any way. We told that principal to go to hell and pulled our child out. Turns out we were right, the poor kid's only real "problem" turned out to mostly consist of offsetting boredom and not being sufficiently challenged in class with daydreaming and zoning out.

I totally feel for you, and am so glad to hear your child is doing well now. We firmly believe that a better care situation, being near family, and the advice of a reputable doctor will do wonders.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP - most of us who are "attacking" you on this board are just annoyed that you took over the thread.

No, I've been attacked for these sentiments for months. (And this thread was useless BS from page 1.) I was accused of "alienating" the parents on the SN board, when all I was doing was challenging their assumptions, not insulting their children. Everyone jumped on me - how dare you be ungrateful for the services that are being offered and ignore your child's problems, when what I was doing was far from that. I misjudged that forum, and perhaps my questions would have been better posed in general parenting. But to say the least, I was astounded that no one felt it was normal to question the validity of these assessments, the manner in which they are conducted, and the assumptions drawn from them. Just as I am astounded that no one feels it is normal to question the state of public education these days and the quality and affect of the city's PS and PK programs on our children.

Wow, we got a lot of that, too. To include being browbeaten by the ES principal who basically suggested what we were doing by not having the most extreme forms of intervention with medication and aides for our child was tantamount to child abuse, when all DC was really ever doing is spacing out in class - not acting out, not being violent or disruptive in any way. We told that principal to go to hell and pulled our child out. Turns out we were right, the poor kid's only real "problem" turned out to mostly consist of offsetting boredom and not being sufficiently challenged in class with daydreaming and zoning out.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP - most of us who are "attacking" you on this board are just annoyed that you took over the thread.

No, I've been attacked for these sentiments for months. (And this thread was useless BS from page 1.) I was accused of "alienating" the parents on the SN board, when all I was doing was challenging their assumptions, not insulting their children. Everyone jumped on me - how dare you be ungrateful for the services that are being offered and ignore your child's problems, when what I was doing was far from that. I misjudged that forum, and perhaps my questions would have been better posed in general parenting. But to say the least, I was astounded that no one felt it was normal to question the validity of these assessments, the manner in which they are conducted, and the assumptions drawn from them. Just as I am astounded that no one feels it is normal to question the state of public education these days and the quality and affect of the city's PS and PK programs on our children.

If you want to "question the state of public education these days and the quality..." start your own thread about that.

Oh that's right, you had a thread where you question the "validity of these assessments, etc." for your own child and you did not want to hear from other parents who have been through the system recently with the same issues and actually came out OK. Only wanted validation about what you thought was right or wrong. Fine. Keep ranting and raving. Try General Parenting. Good luck!

Anonymous wrote:PP - most of us who are "attacking" you on this board are just annoyed that you took over the thread.

No, I've been attacked for these sentiments for months. (And this thread was useless BS from page 1.) I was accused of "alienating" the parents on the SN board, when all I was doing was challenging their assumptions, not insulting their children. Everyone jumped on me - how dare you be ungrateful for the services that are being offered and ignore your child's problems, when what I was doing was far from that. I misjudged that forum, and perhaps my questions would have been better posed in general parenting. But to say the least, I was astounded that no one felt it was normal to question the validity of these assessments, the manner in which they are conducted, and the assumptions drawn from them. Just as I am astounded that no one feels it is normal to question the state of public education these days and the quality and affect of the city's PS and PK programs on our children.

PP - most of us who are "attacking" you on this board are just annoyed that you took over the thread.

Anonymous wrote:Both can and do happen. Overdiagnosis, underdiagnosis, those who need help not getting it, and those who don't need help getting even more screwed up than they were to begin with by the "help".

Back in elementary school were told by "experts" that DC would need an aide in the classroom, we had professional head shrinkers tell us DC would always have lifelong debilitating functional issues. Turns out they were just some temporary developmental quirks that DC has since grown out of and DC is in fact now thriving and flourishing, on the honor roll, lots of activities, and has lots of friends. Looking back, we thank the heavens we didn't heed the advice and medicate the crap out of poor DC as some wanted us to. I have a family member who went that route and their child now has worse problems as a side-effect of being heavily medicated than the original problems were - some of which result in permanent alteration of brain chemistry, and not in a good way. Psychology and psychiatrics are VERY far from being any kind of exact science or anywhere near as reliable as other areas of medicine.

Thank you, PP. So see, all of you ladies who've attacked me mercilessly for months, I am not crazy, and I am NOT the only one who has ever or will ever feel the way I do about this process. I patently refuse to medicate my child (as has been suggested) or freak out over every "armchair" diagnosis (there have been many), or accept the word of some so-called "school psychologist" who can't even explain his own assessments. Am I concerned about certain aspects of my child's development? Sure. Do I have to simply accept what others say because they are "experts?" No. I'm still on the waiting lists for respected developmental peds, we've accepted certain services at school (after having been very involved in the entire process, pushing back, challenging assumptions and asking a ton of questions) and we will continue to stay on it. But I'm with PP - we can't just label and medicate every single child who doesn't fit some preconceived notion of "normal." That doesn't mean I don't believe there are children who legitimately are diagnosed and legitimately need medication and services. And while I can accept that perhaps not every preschool program is as structured as the one we are in, I am still concerned that the testing culture of the system is trickling down into the development of early childhood programs in the sense that what used to be expected of children in K is now being expected at younger and younger ages. At least at my school, I don't think I'm imagining it. And I fear that it is robbing a lot of kids of their childhood.

Both can and do happen. Overdiagnosis, underdiagnosis, those who need help not getting it, and those who don't need help getting even more screwed up than they were to begin with by the "help".

Back in elementary school were told by "experts" that DC would need an aide in the classroom, we had professional head shrinkers tell us DC would always have lifelong debilitating functional issues. Turns out they were just some temporary developmental quirks that DC has since grown out of and DC is in fact now thriving and flourishing, on the honor roll, lots of activities, and has lots of friends. Looking back, we thank the heavens we didn't heed the advice and medicate the crap out of poor DC as some wanted us to. I have a family member who went that route and their child now has worse problems as a side-effect of being heavily medicated than the original problems were - some of which result in permanent alteration of brain chemistry, and not in a good way. Psychology and psychiatrics are VERY far from being any kind of exact science or anywhere near as reliable as other areas of medicine.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For each child that gets labeled as "special needs", there comes along with it extra money for the district. It's a sick incentive to overdiagnose and overlabel children who are perfectly fine.

And, more insidiously, its a sick incentive to give children a pass on learning the basics "just because they didn't want to" by justifying it through some contrived diagnosis or label. It further propagates the dumbing down of our children.

I agree with your first point and disagree with your second. There are surely children who have legitimate special needs, and accomodating them is not an excuse to give them a pass on learning. It is quite the opposite. However, I do firmly believe that there is "overdiagnosis and overlabeling" of preschool-aged children, at least at our school, and likely at others too.

For every person like you who claims there is "overdiagnosis and overlabeling", there are many other parents who actually have SN children who cannot get the services/support/help they need for their kids. So which is it? You don't know what the he!! you are talking about...

Why do you think that both can't be happening at the same time? How do you know that the misdiagnosis of some children isn't drawing resources away from children who truly need them?

How do you know these kids are "misdiagnosed"? Are u their doctor? I have a SN child with an IEP who has a correct diagnosis (after many evaluations including a developmental pediatrician) and would not presume to know whether some other child is correctly or incorrectly diagnosed.

As for your scenerio, I think it's more common to have kids who are undiagnosed and who truly need help and are not getting it which is very unfortunate. For the most part, I don't think there is an avalanche of misdiagnosis and it certainly has not been my experience at our charter that they give out IEPs and 504s to kids who don't need it and the services/accommodations that they provide.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For each child that gets labeled as "special needs", there comes along with it extra money for the district. It's a sick incentive to overdiagnose and overlabel children who are perfectly fine.

And, more insidiously, its a sick incentive to give children a pass on learning the basics "just because they didn't want to" by justifying it through some contrived diagnosis or label. It further propagates the dumbing down of our children.

I agree with your first point and disagree with your second. There are surely children who have legitimate special needs, and accomodating them is not an excuse to give them a pass on learning. It is quite the opposite. However, I do firmly believe that there is "overdiagnosis and overlabeling" of preschool-aged children, at least at our school, and likely at others too.

For every person like you who claims there is "overdiagnosis and overlabeling", there are many other parents who actually have SN children who cannot get the services/support/help they need for their kids. So which is it? You don't know what the he!! you are talking about...

Why do you think that both can't be happening at the same time? How do you know that the misdiagnosis of some children isn't drawing resources away from children who truly need them?