Anonymous
10/30/2025 12:02
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I teach STEM at one of the notoriously hard universities mentioned in this thread, and I can confidently say that Harvard's struggles with underprepared students are not only Harvard's struggles. Rather, this has affected all universities and all of my colleagues universally feel the struggle. As a result, we have had to redesign our courses, and we have become more lenient, whether that is a philosophy we want to adopt or not. Mostly, we feel it is our responsibility to help students succeed as best we can, and if that means changing previously difficult content to make it more manageable to the majority of the class, that is what we have to do.
And before the people of DCUM jump to the conclusion that this watering down is all due to DEI, or URM, or FGLI, I have faced similar struggles with students who are advantaged in every way and who come in with glowing grades, awards, and national merit recognitions, etc. I honestly believe that some factor has hurt attention spans almost universally among our young people. As the parent of a high schooler, what I observe among my college students has influenced the way I parent, and I am really invested in reducing distractions, and encouraging my teen to take on challenges that involve deep work and which do not guarantee success.
I agree that this generation has been harmed by factors outside academic policies, but we are witnessing a breakdown caused by a confluence of several events. COVID gave the impetus for test optional policies that were already being pushed for DEI purposes, and combined with COVID school shutdowns, which exacerbated grade inflation at the high school level (also DEI), we ended up with very little way to distinguish which students have had their attention spans completely rotted by social media and which (like your teen, God willing) have not. Academia seems to have reacted to this by lowering academic standards for everyone. Your argument is that this was all inevitable and unavoidable. I disagree — it was not inevitable that elite universities admit less qualified students. In fact, most schools have rescinded their test optional policies, indicating the failure of that experiment, whether they explicitly say so or not. But those policies were always a *choice,* and one that was criticized by many at the time. Universities have the ability to make distinctions between high schools that have rigorous grading policies and those that do not. Or simply demand that students live up to the standards of the university or leave. But that would lead to politically incorrect results, so they water down academic standards for everyone instead. It’s “too hard” to try to lift up those who need assistance, so we drag down the excellent students, instead. This is clearly a net negative for society and the academic reputation of these institutions. It sounds like there are at least some at Harvard that have not resigned themselves to the idea that this is all inevitable and would like to fight back. I wish them luck.
I don’t see where I said this was inevitable and unavoidable. I certainly hope to avoid it in the future as much as possible but I think it will take a huge societal effort. I personally don’t know a single faculty member who doesn’t want to return to higher standards and it was probably due to faculty input that our university returned to test required. This is a start, but it is not going to solve the problem. The anti-DEI people don’t seem to believe me when I say that I have plenty of white and Asian non- first-gen students who are unable to perform up to standards from a decade ago. If I were to give F’s to half of these students, including yours, you parents would probably find that unfair, no? Instead I have doubled my office hour times, given additional support, tried to clarify my lectures, etc. to reflect the current reality. But I certainly hope that we can raise the standards for future generations. In my opinion, a good start for parents to start would be limiting kids’ time on brain rotting and addictive activities. At the college level, I would be in favor of returning to longer entrance exams that reward extended focus. I also like the idea of publishing class medians along with grades, or fixing number of A’s on a curve. There are downsides to this approach, and it penalizes classes where everyone is doing very well, but it may be a necessary evil to help fight inflation.
This is a quote from your post. You state that lowering standards is something that you “have to do.” You can disagree with the word “inevitable” but your entire post was justifying the result as something you had no control over, which you now say is false. Which I agree with, by the way. It was a choice.
“As a result, we have had to redesign our courses, and we have become more lenient, whether that is a philosophy we want to adopt or not. Mostly, we feel it is our responsibility to help students succeed as best we can, and if that means changing previously difficult content to make it more manageable to the majority of the class, that is what we have to do.”
Anonymous
10/29/2025 18:01
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
Completely false. Idiots like you don't know anything before speaking. Only like 10% math major. Copium too much.
10% of a class sounds quite large.
But huge?
Also, that ~10% is math concentration and statistics concentration combined.
10% is very very large. It's a big department at Harvard and one they're known for. And tough.
So now is "very very", and "big", not huge any more? Moron!
guess what - directed studies at Yale is also not the biggest. you're missing the entire point which is that there are majors and programs at these schools that are very very hard. applied math at harvard. directed studies at yale. etc can some students float though in other, easier majors. of course. but people who know, know.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 17:16
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:That’s fine. I think this is a good thing as more people realize that Harvard and other Ivies have a mix of high and low ability students, and that there are many high ability students at other schools who didn’t get into these “elite” schools because they didn’t fit the “insitutional priorities.” These Ivy + schools will stop being thought of as the “best of the best” and just become one of many other decent schools. maybe that will decrease the insane competition to get into them. I say this as someone with two Ivy degrees. It’s just a school, going or not going is not going to determine the course of one’s life.
The idea of best of the best does not mean every one is equally strong. It never was that way, and Harvard never wanted it that way.
They are best of the best because there were always some from Harvard turned out to be elite. SCOTUS, POTUS, Facebook, Microsoft, senator, congressman, etc. Even if 99% of the incoming class turned out to be mediocre, that's fine.
They wouldn't know who would turn out to be the elite. But they know their way works.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 16:16
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:That’s fine. I think this is a good thing as more people realize that Harvard and other Ivies have a mix of high and low ability students, and that there are many high ability students at other schools who didn’t get into these “elite” schools because they didn’t fit the “insitutional priorities.” These Ivy + schools will stop being thought of as the “best of the best” and just become one of many other decent schools. maybe that will decrease the insane competition to get into them. I say this as someone with two Ivy degrees. It’s just a school, going or not going is not going to determine the course of one’s life.
This is the realistic view. The idea that Harvard holds only the best of the best hasn’t…really ever been true. It’s historically held the richest of the richest, but I hope people here can understand why that may not necessarily (and doesn’t) mean the most intellectual. I wish we’d actually embrace our liberal arts model for its uniqueness and stop obsessing over Princeton or Harvard or whatnot. In general, there’s some-conservative-150 liberal arts colleges and universities that can provide you a stellar education with excessive resources to succeed. The smartest people are distributed all around, and you can find successful peers at many institutions.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 16:09
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
That’s fine. I think this is a good thing as more people realize that Harvard and other Ivies have a mix of high and low ability students, and that there are many high ability students at other schools who didn’t get into these “elite” schools because they didn’t fit the “insitutional priorities.” These Ivy + schools will stop being thought of as the “best of the best” and just become one of many other decent schools. maybe that will decrease the insane competition to get into them. I say this as someone with two Ivy degrees. It’s just a school, going or not going is not going to determine the course of one’s life.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 10:39
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:I’m really surprised these are the responses of parents with college aged kids. My kid works like a bull and their work is harder than when I was in college (I graduated as a physics major from Yale; they’re a computer science major at Princeton). Kids are expected to do 12x more in coursework and in getting internships, professional clubs, etc.
The problem is not that EVERYONE is incapable of previous standards. There are still very hardworking, focused, and capable kids at the elite schools, but within the same schools, the bottom has really fallen, and it's really a struggle apply the same grade standards to an entire class. Faculty complain about this broadly. Your kid likely isn't aware because they are not dealing with it and are only aware of their own performance.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 08:41
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
Completely false. Idiots like you don't know anything before speaking. Only like 10% math major. Copium too much.
10% of a class sounds quite large.
But huge?
Also, that ~10% is math concentration and statistics concentration combined.
10% is very very large. It's a big department at Harvard and one they're known for. And tough.
So now is "very very", and "big", not huge any more? Moron!
Anonymous
10/29/2025 08:34
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
Completely false. Idiots like you don't know anything before speaking. Only like 10% math major. Copium too much.
10% of a class sounds quite large.
But huge?
Also, that ~10% is math concentration and statistics concentration combined.
At Harvard? What are you talking about. Applied Math is a major and Statistics in another. They're both popular majors. Econ is such bigger, Applied Math is considered harder. Students will sometimes start as Applied Math and end up graduating in Econ. Combining Applied Math and Stats makes no sense.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 08:27
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
Completely false. Idiots like you don't know anything before speaking. Only like 10% math major. Copium too much.
10% of a class sounds quite large.
But huge?
Also, that ~10% is math concentration and statistics concentration combined.
10% is very very large. It's a big department at Harvard and one they're known for. And tough.
Anonymous
10/29/2025 08:26
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
I assume they just mean that half of JHU undergrads (presumably excluding the engineering school) have registered their interest in going to med school afterwards. That's completely plausible.
sure but she's responding to a poster who said Bio at JHU is tough. And Bio is a classic pre-med major. So WTF is she talking about?
Anonymous
10/28/2025 23:39
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
I assume they just mean that half of JHU undergrads (presumably excluding the engineering school) have registered their interest in going to med school afterwards. That's completely plausible.
70% incoming JHU students interested in premed track. The premed students are from a number of majors, public health, biology, BME, neuroscience, psychology, chemistry, chemE, etc. BME and chemE are from engineering school.
Anonymous
10/28/2025 22:49
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
Completely false. Idiots like you don't know anything before speaking. Only like 10% math major. Copium too much.
10% of a class sounds quite large.
But huge?
Also, that ~10% is math concentration and statistics concentration combined.
Anonymous
10/28/2025 22:37
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
I assume they just mean that half of JHU undergrads (presumably excluding the engineering school) have registered their interest in going to med school afterwards. That's completely plausible.
Anonymous
10/28/2025 22:30
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:kids can pick easier and harder paths at almost any schools. Directed Studies at Yale is no cakewalk. Nor is Math at Harvard, Econ at Chicago, bio at JHU, Phil a Williams, etc
30% Chicago is econ. Half of JHU is premed. Kids study math at Harvard? Not many. MIT is another story.
math is a huge dept at harvard
no such thing as "premed" at JHU
Completely false. Idiots like you don't know anything before speaking. Only like 10% math major. Copium too much.
10% of a class sounds quite large.
Anonymous
10/28/2025 22:28
Subject: Harvard Report on Impacts of Grade Inflation
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Harvard admissions doesn't pick the brightest students in the first place so of course, professors are upset. Why doesn't Harvard stop looking for woke candidates like SJW, URM, plus legacies and athletes? It's a shame how low that school is going. Who has come out of there recently?
What's SJW?
Social Justice Warrior