Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why should Mom (or her Mom) be forced/guilted into/expected, etc to raise the kids.
Why not the Dad? Can court force dad to stick around? to be a 50% parent?
Dad likes to "pretend" he's a good dad to his out of town family and co-workers, but he's not

I think this is the point of OP's hypothetical. Why is one parent "allowed" to walk away and the other forced to carry the weight of parenting alone? Why aren't both forced to carry equal weight?

Because you can’t make someone do what they don’t want to do.

The best you can do is to make them pay child support and if they don’t push to have them put in jail.

Which usually gets them to pay up.

If they pay great if they don’t off to jail they go. Win, win if you ask me. That’s it though you can’t force someone to have a moral compass.

Anonymous wrote:Call the police and report him as a missing person when he doesn't show up.

I kid! its a fantasy i enjoy tho.

Hahaha! In reality none of us have time for that.

Call the police and report him as a missing person when he doesn't show up.

I kid! its a fantasy i enjoy tho.

Anonymous wrote:Can a family lawyer please weigh in here? I am so confused by this entire thread. I feel like the mom could just say to the court that she requests 50/50, which is the default. The judge isn't going to say, "welp, dad doesn't want any custody, so mom is ordered 100%." Right? Imagine if the genders were reversed and mom said she wanted nothing, and dad said he wanted 50/50. The judge would order 50/50, unless there were serious drug/abuse issues.

Dads don't abide by this. And what is the mom supposed to do when Dad doesn't show up? Just roll out of the house to go live your life and leave your kids unsupervised because it's "Dads time"? Fight and argue with the dad about how he needs to help more (maybe in ear shot of your kids?) and then send your kids with someone who doesn't want to be parenting and won't adequately take care of them?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can a family lawyer please weigh in here? I am so confused by this entire thread. I feel like the mom could just say to the court that she requests 50/50, which is the default. The judge isn't going to say, "welp, dad doesn't want any custody, so mom is ordered 100%." Right? Imagine if the genders were reversed and mom said she wanted nothing, and dad said he wanted 50/50. The judge would order 50/50, unless there were serious drug/abuse issues.

I am totally confused by how you think this could work. So you would get a court order that specifies 50/50, and child support calculated based on 50/50, but you would still have them 100% because there is no mechanism to make him take the kids. How does that help you? All it means is less money

Yes, that's true, it's one of many reasons why women enter retirement in financial poverty.

What usually happens is the court orders 50/50 and the neglectful parent just doesn't show up for their 50% or pawns it off on someone else -- new girlfriend, or their own family (mom or siblings) -- or leaves the kids un- or inappropriately supervised. Or, as commonly happens, the neglectful parent just doesn't show for their 50% -- calling the responsible spouse and making excuses about work or other events. There is no way to force someone to take custody who doesn't want to. What are you going to do as a responsible parent when the neglectful spouse says in front of the kids -- "i have to go away for work for a month, so I won't be able to take the kids"? -- you're just going to say OK.

If you document it, you have the option of going back to court for a custody change and more child support, but TBH, if the other parent doesn't have significant assets, you are going to spend more going to court than you will get in child support. And, TBH, court is always a roll of the dice. You could get a judge who thinks women who move for changes are being PITA. Or your irresponsible former spouse could suddenly decide to use the court case for harassment.

I knew all this, and made a calculated decision that our lives would be more stable to just accept the extra time nicely and take the hit to my career and salary. I also didn't want to exacerbate the relationship between my kids and their dad. At least they had a fun dad from time to time even though it was unpredictable. But, it's no joke what it cost me financially.

Anonymous wrote:Can a family lawyer please weigh in here? I am so confused by this entire thread. I feel like the mom could just say to the court that she requests 50/50, which is the default. The judge isn't going to say, "welp, dad doesn't want any custody, so mom is ordered 100%." Right? Imagine if the genders were reversed and mom said she wanted nothing, and dad said he wanted 50/50. The judge would order 50/50, unless there were serious drug/abuse issues.

I am totally confused by how you think this could work. So you would get a court order that specifies 50/50, and child support calculated based on 50/50, but you would still have them 100% because there is no mechanism to make him take the kids. How does that help you? All it means is less money

Op, I'm so sorry you are experiencing this. I experienced it too - an ex who basically abandoned the kids except when it is convenient for him to be a "fun" parent. He has not paid adequate child support. He contributes nothing to college. It sucks for me.

I love my kids, of course, but it definitely affected me and my career opportunities and my financial safety and future. I'm not happy about it. And it sucks that our society allows this.

You cannot make a parent parent. The best thing you can do is focus on your kids. If there are problems, use your health insurance to get into therapy. You should get some therapy too - you need someone to help you process how unfair this is and move past it to focus on doing what you can to focus on what is in your control.

Here is what I wish I had done more of -

Focus on expanding your network and having more playdates or activities for your kids - these can be reciprocal activities that offer you some relief. Many activities offer free or low cost options for parents who can't afford fees. Make sure you use your non-custody weekends to invest a little in your own friends.

Involve your kids more in the housework. I wish I had done this at a very young age - even a 2 year old can help with things, and that establishes a good foundation for the future. Don't make it a punishment for not having a Dad around - normalize as part of their education that is going to help them
become independent adults and successful in caring for a house/family in their own relationships. Realistically, if you are under financial pressure, as your kids get older, they can get jobs and help out with their "extras" (fancy clothes, extra currics, special events) while you stick to basics (housing, food, your own retirement, etc.)

Whatever your income level, try to make time to have fun with your kids. It's very important for their bond with you. Make sure to hug them and kiss them even when you are exhausted. Try to find things to laugh about with them.

I went thru some rough times with both kids in high school, but in the end they have turned out OK. They are good kids and both in college and on their way to becoming independent.

I have never spoken ill of their dad. It's a fine line to walk between not speaking ill of him and not gaslighting them so they can grow up with a healthy perception of what is appropriate in relationships. Over time, they have come to see him realistically, which is a bit sad for them.

I wish I could have seen this coming (his abandonment), but, honestly, I did not, and I don't think I could have. Over time it became clear to me that he is this way from untreated mental illness. I kind of think of it like he got hit by a bus and has TBI. It is not something he can really help until he has the insight to take meds and do therapy consistently, which is unlikely to happen. When I get angry about it, I try to remind myself that all that mental energy is better redirected to me and my own life with my kids.

How old are your kids OP? Where is your family? What are the main points of pressure? Maybe people can make suggestions to help.

Can a family lawyer please weigh in here? I am so confused by this entire thread. I feel like the mom could just say to the court that she requests 50/50, which is the default. The judge isn't going to say, "welp, dad doesn't want any custody, so mom is ordered 100%." Right? Imagine if the genders were reversed and mom said she wanted nothing, and dad said he wanted 50/50. The judge would order 50/50, unless there were serious drug/abuse issues.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The kids become wards of the state and enter into Foster Care

It would be better to get some help (mental, emotional, financial) rather than further messing up the lives of children.

This, give them to foster care and let someone adopt them who wants them.

Adoption is the best way to emotionally and psychologically damage a person for life. It's a disaster response.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Mom is not leaving her kids- she loves them. She's just on the verge of a mental breakdown and her functioning is dropping because she is extremely overwhelmed with now being a single mom of 3, working very full-time, and dealing with a deadbeat, which is frankly worse than a dead dad.
She can't keep up and while family is verbally supportive, no one is there to help.
And the dad's selfish carefree example is now the one that her preteen kids want to emulate.
I just see her spiraling downward from afar, and am appalled by the legal system that seems to have no consequences for a dad (parent) who simply abandons their family. She's lives in a very "no-fault" (ie no consequences) state. The assumption is that the responsible parent will handle everything (certainly gov't doesn't want to step in and assume any cost or responsibility)

Mom is gonna have to be bold and ask for help. For instance: play dates or rides with the kids' friends, help from neighbors, etc. I for one would be happy to host my 3rd grader's buddy once a week so you could get a break, or if you needed to stay late at work, etc.

My mom did this. We were in this exact same scenario as OP. My mom was depressed, I was parentified, and we were shuffled between good neighbors. The best thing my mom could have done was to stop arguing with reality, gotten counseling, and picked herself up to be the parent we needed. Life isn’t fair, but it’s really unfair to kids who didn’t ask for any of it. But, she didn’t do that and we all suffered, well into adulthood due to neglect.

Was your dad around at all? Any financial support? What was your relationship as a teen? And now as an adult? Do you blame him, have anger at him?

Or do you just blame your mom for not being enough? As an adult do you see that she was a human being left in a bad place? Multiple kids are always a challenge but doing it all by yourself is a lot.

Is your dad dead? Or you just don't hold him to any standard or responsibility? Did he pick himself up & be that parent you needed? Or was that mom's job solely?

I think it is awful you blame your mother. She was in a tough place. I also wonder why you dont blame the dad? It is always the moms put in this impossible situation and then blamed when everyone else would have also broken down under that amount of stress. You have no idea.

Anonymous wrote:This happened to my spouse. He was a neglected kid.

His dad played house with his new wife and only had the kids once in a while and barely paid for anything. He continues to have affairs and his wife looks the other way.

His mom had to spend a lot of time working and relying on her relatives to watch the kids. In her free time, she preferred dating men and not being around the kids to find her next spouse. She left them behind to take a job in another state when they were teens and they had to grow up with very little supervision. She married rich and retired but not until after kids were grown.

This was me at 16. My wealthy but horribly abusive father left to be with a 22 year old. My mother was an addict and wasn’t there mentally. Didn’t work and relied upon a meager stipend from my father. He outlawyered
her which wasn’t difficult to do given her mental state. He hid all sorts of assets with his cronies. He hated me and constantly beat me and referred to me as a fat dumb and lazy loser. I was a good athlete and won a national championship event in high school, so I went to college entirely on my own on athletic scholarship to one of the very best schools in the country. This infuriated my father as he wanted to see me fail. I was just glad to have him out of my life. His choice was Rolex watches for his girlfriend and vacation ms in Italy while his talented kids starved through college. It didn’t matter to him. I did well academically in professional school and this infuriated him. My mother was a project and could never handle adult life. My brother and I supported her and she died unhappy because she wanted to. She had guilt because she so badly failed in protecting her kids. I didn’t speak to my father for 30 years - my last words with him were of the nature that my brother and I were academic snobs - and found out he died through a decent guy who had a hunch we otherwise wouldn’t have known. He had a fancy memorial at one of his country clubs. No reason for my brother and me to attend.

This all sounds easy now. But cutting ties with a parent took more work than I imagined. It was doable as I had a lot of independence- really complete independence from age 18. With extreme poverty came fantastic independence and self reliance. Lots of fun. Never drank at all or did any drugs. Enough excitement rolling the dice in Division 1 athletics and a frantic struggle to do well in an honors program I barely belonged in.

I am grateful. Put two through Princeton - spoiled them but broke the cycle.

This happened to my spouse. He was a neglected kid.

His dad played house with his new wife and only had the kids once in a while and barely paid for anything. He continues to have affairs and his wife looks the other way.

His mom had to spend a lot of time working and relying on her relatives to watch the kids. In her free time, she preferred dating men and not being around the kids to find her next spouse. She left them behind to take a job in another state when they were teens and they had to grow up with very little supervision. She married rich and retired but not until after kids were grown.

Anonymous wrote:OP, is this a real situation or just a hypothetical to demonstrate how mothers often step up where dads don’t. Or even more generically while in some divorces there’s lots of fighting over custody for the kids, if in a divorce there is one parent that just wants to nope out, essentially there is no mechanism to hold them accountable to their parental obligations?

This is not true. I think adults have difficulties both genders. Their lives fall apart. Then the kids are caught in the middle of it. If the family is lucky, they live close to grandma or an uncle or aunt

OP, is this a real situation or just a hypothetical to demonstrate how mothers often step up where dads don’t. Or even more generically while in some divorces there’s lots of fighting over custody for the kids, if in a divorce there is one parent that just wants to nope out, essentially there is no mechanism to hold them accountable to their parental obligations?

Anonymous wrote:Her mom takes care of the kids of course.

This actually describes a large number of kids who are raised by grandparents--their parents were too immature or had too many problems to raise them. Usually there is only one kid though, not three.