Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To me, when I hear a grievance from someone I like, if it’s something I haven’t experienced, my response tends to be “you don’t have to struggle alone, let’s put our heads together and brainstorm a solution!” I don’t think of it as “giving advice,” bc even that sounds patronizing or condescending. If it’s something I experienced, I’ll likely be like, “omg I knowwwww. But we tried _____ and that’s sort of working for us??”

Op - notice that you have enough eq to preface with ‘omg i knowww’

Maybe the issue isn’t advice giving its lack of validation and empathy and the humility to be in that place with that person

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm from the UK and I've found that one real barrier to making friends here (or rather to having deeper friendships) has been this one - what seems to be cultural - difference around sharing parenting challenges. In the UK it's tacitly understood for the most part that if you share something that's hard about parenting, unless you specifically ask, you're not looking for advice but more so solidarity or to laugh about it or just to share and feel less alone or incompetent. Among the moms at my kids school I find almost universally that if i share something that's hard, they give me advice. For me personally it's a real barrier to friendships bc a. I often don't need or want advice per se and b. it sort of stops any kind of bonding or even really conversation in its tracks.
Is this an american cultural thing where if someone shares something hard it's assumed they want input or is my school different in some way? would love to find a tribe that I can laugh about my kids imitating youtubers rather than hear a 15 minute diatribe on how someone else is crushing it with not letting this happen.

Americans are generally an impatient lot and are more likely to have a “quit your complaining or do something about it” mindset. And rightfully so.

No one likes a complainer.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Y’all who are socially challenged: friendship is an emotional connections. When you respond with empathy, that’s an emotional response. When you respond by problem solving, you’re just making talk. If it’s received well, there might be some gratitude, which is a positive connection, but it’s small compared to being understood.

Some people spend their lives in circles of problem-solvers. Others form strong bonds with core friends. All are fine, but don’t look at the strong bond people and wonder “why am I not included.” Those people aren’t solving problems, nor do they want to in their limited free time. They want zero-battery friendships.

Lol most people I’ve met do both. You can be empathetic and then try to find a solution for your friend’s problem. They’re not mutually exclusive.

Anonymous wrote:Y’all who are socially challenged: friendship is an emotional connections. When you respond with empathy, that’s an emotional response. When you respond by problem solving, you’re just making talk. If it’s received well, there might be some gratitude, which is a positive connection, but it’s small compared to being understood.

Some people spend their lives in circles of problem-solvers. Others form strong bonds with core friends. All are fine, but don’t look at the strong bond people and wonder “why am I not included.” Those people aren’t solving problems, nor do they want to in their limited free time. They want zero-battery friendships.

Anonymous wrote:I'm from the UK and I've found that one real barrier to making friends here (or rather to having deeper friendships) has been this one - what seems to be cultural - difference around sharing parenting challenges. In the UK it's tacitly understood for the most part that if you share something that's hard about parenting, unless you specifically ask, you're not looking for advice but more so solidarity or to laugh about it or just to share and feel less alone or incompetent. Among the moms at my kids school I find almost universally that if i share something that's hard, they give me advice. For me personally it's a real barrier to friendships bc a. I often don't need or want advice per se and b. it sort of stops any kind of bonding or even really conversation in its tracks.
Is this an american cultural thing where if someone shares something hard it's assumed they want input or is my school different in some way? would love to find a tribe that I can laugh about my kids imitating youtubers rather than hear a 15 minute diatribe on how someone else is crushing it with not letting this happen.

Anonymous wrote:It must be specific to the type of women you are engaging with. I’ve never had this experience.

Anonymous wrote:I'm from the UK and I've found that one real barrier to making friends here (or rather to having deeper friendships) has been this one - what seems to be cultural - difference around sharing parenting challenges. In the UK it's tacitly understood for the most part that if you share something that's hard about parenting, unless you specifically ask, you're not looking for advice but more so solidarity or to laugh about it or just to share and feel less alone or incompetent. Among the moms at my kids school I find almost universally that if i share something that's hard, they give me advice. For me personally it's a real barrier to friendships bc a. I often don't need or want advice per se and b. it sort of stops any kind of bonding or even really conversation in its tracks.
Is this an american cultural thing where if someone shares something hard it's assumed they want input or is my school different in some way? would love to find a tribe that I can laugh about my kids imitating youtubers rather than hear a 15 minute diatribe on how someone else is crushing it with not letting this happen.

Anonymous wrote:To me, when I hear a grievance from someone I like, if it’s something I haven’t experienced, my response tends to be “you don’t have to struggle alone, let’s put our heads together and brainstorm a solution!” I don’t think of it as “giving advice,” bc even that sounds patronizing or condescending. If it’s something I experienced, I’ll likely be like, “omg I knowwwww. But we tried _____ and that’s sort of working for us??”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I offer potential solutions to a friend who is complaining about a problem, I am not trying to sound smart or show off. I am brainstorming and trying to help because I care. If it were someone I didn’t care about complaining, I’d simply say “well that sucks (for you)”.

If your worldview is such that people offering to help are being know it alls, good riddance. It’s a different story if people are just talking over you to sound off their knowledge but that doesn’t seem to be the case with the OP.

If they didn't ask for this "brainstorming" then it is actually rude.

One thing I've noticed is that people who jump right to "offering solutions" often skip over a really important step -- asking questions to better understand the situation. Like I'll say "man I'm so tired -- DD was up half the night and wound up sleeping in our bed." The compulsive advice givers will jump straight to trying to offer up solutions to fix our sleep issues. But people who are not know-it-alls will say "whoa that sounds super hard I'm sorry. What was up?" And then they'll listen to me talk about it (if I want to -- I might say "oh nothing we figured it out I'm just tired) and ask follow up questions ("oh I had no idea she'd recently started new meds -- did you already talk to the ped about it?") and then maybe after all that if they have some insight they might offer it. But often what people discover in the process of just listening and answering questions is that other people have a good handle on their own issues and aren't really grasping for advice or guidance (especially not from people who are just friends and not like experts in anything). In listening and being interested they'll offer me what I actually want which is emotional support. What I don't need is for a friend who just learned of an issue I am intimately familiar with offering 47 ideas for how to fix it based on her instinctual first impressions. If it's a real issue odds are good I've already thought of those ideas already -- it's my actual life and not a hypothetical exercise for me.

Now if a friend comes to you and says "can you brainstorm ideas for how to address this issue with me" then by all means. But assuming that any time someone complains about anything they want you to jump in with a bunch of ideas for them is incredibly self-centered. It's not about you. They are just complaining. If you don't want to hear it then change the subject.

So would you say Mom A is right in the following exchange?

Mom A: My son has been waking up at 4am every night and I am exhausted!!!

Mom B: That’s rough! I’m so sorry to hear that. Does he take a nap?

Mom A: *Looks annoyed*. Of course not. He stopped napping months ago.

Mom B: I see. I went through a phase with my oldest son waking up early in the morning too. I noticed that when I gave him a later dinner that is protein rich he would sleep better

Mom A: Are you kidding me? My son is well fed. I didn’t ask for your advice! Can’t you just listen without offering advice!!! You Americans are such rude know it all’s!!!

op - it's more like:

me: my kids are obsessed with watching randos on youtube play roblox and I'm always trying to extract them from this weird vortex.

British mum: omg i know - mine watch this man who fishes specifically for bizarre obscure and very ugly fish and they are OBSESSED.

Moms at my school: we dont allow lots of youtube. I have a million safety controls. I only allow 5 minutes a day of youtube. youtube will rot their brain and make them into weird shut in incels. my kids watch actual tv.

It’s so weird that my 65 year old midwestern mother is hanging out at your east coast private school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I offer potential solutions to a friend who is complaining about a problem, I am not trying to sound smart or show off. I am brainstorming and trying to help because I care. If it were someone I didn’t care about complaining, I’d simply say “well that sucks (for you)”.

If your worldview is such that people offering to help are being know it alls, good riddance. It’s a different story if people are just talking over you to sound off their knowledge but that doesn’t seem to be the case with the OP.

If they didn't ask for this "brainstorming" then it is actually rude.

One thing I've noticed is that people who jump right to "offering solutions" often skip over a really important step -- asking questions to better understand the situation. Like I'll say "man I'm so tired -- DD was up half the night and wound up sleeping in our bed." The compulsive advice givers will jump straight to trying to offer up solutions to fix our sleep issues. But people who are not know-it-alls will say "whoa that sounds super hard I'm sorry. What was up?" And then they'll listen to me talk about it (if I want to -- I might say "oh nothing we figured it out I'm just tired) and ask follow up questions ("oh I had no idea she'd recently started new meds -- did you already talk to the ped about it?") and then maybe after all that if they have some insight they might offer it. But often what people discover in the process of just listening and answering questions is that other people have a good handle on their own issues and aren't really grasping for advice or guidance (especially not from people who are just friends and not like experts in anything). In listening and being interested they'll offer me what I actually want which is emotional support. What I don't need is for a friend who just learned of an issue I am intimately familiar with offering 47 ideas for how to fix it based on her instinctual first impressions. If it's a real issue odds are good I've already thought of those ideas already -- it's my actual life and not a hypothetical exercise for me.

Now if a friend comes to you and says "can you brainstorm ideas for how to address this issue with me" then by all means. But assuming that any time someone complains about anything they want you to jump in with a bunch of ideas for them is incredibly self-centered. It's not about you. They are just complaining. If you don't want to hear it then change the subject.

So would you say Mom A is right in the following exchange?

Mom A: My son has been waking up at 4am every night and I am exhausted!!!

Mom B: That’s rough! I’m so sorry to hear that. Does he take a nap?

Mom A: *Looks annoyed*. Of course not. He stopped napping months ago.

Mom B: I see. I went through a phase with my oldest son waking up early in the morning too. I noticed that when I gave him a later dinner that is protein rich he would sleep better

Mom A: Are you kidding me? My son is well fed. I didn’t ask for your advice! Can’t you just listen without offering advice!!! You Americans are such rude know it all’s!!!

Yes! You need to ask more questions before you give advice!
Let’s say that the reason the child is up at 4am is because they are ill or they are distressed because their dog or their grandmother died.
Maybe Mom A was trying to prelude into talking about her own mother’s death or her child’s possible cancer diagnosis, and Mom B can’t stop talking about protein rich dinners.

Dp. Now I know not to engage. Because if I ask too many questions you pp will take me as pushy.

I will just nod and say I'm sorry and be quiet.