Anonymous wrote:So when SHOULD you get divorced? Never? Never any reason ever?

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Anonymous wrote:Don’t model for your children things you don’t expect them to tolerate.

Yes, but the point here is that some of the reasons people get divorced are actually things we DO expect kids to tolerate. Boredom is part of life. Long-term relationships with anyone require dealing with annoyances, reconciling different goals and needs, working through conflicts to remember what you liked about them in the first place.

Abuse is a hard line for me, and not just physical abuse-- verbal or emotional abuse, or abusive patterns of gaslighting and undermining that really mess with a person psychologically. You don't want to expose your kid to any of that.

But often people get divorced because they "grew apart" or "want different things" or one or both think they *might* be happier with someone else. And if you don't have kids or your kids are grown? Why not, to for it. But those are really not good reasons to throw out a family and force children into joint custody arrangements. Divorce also has an annoying ability to create continual conflict in families, because the second you split, the parents are now in competition with each other for time with kids, time without kids, resources, etc.

If there is not abuse, be a freaking grown up and figure out how to do what is best for the kids. Most divorced compromise the kids' well being. I'll allow that some small percent manage a cordial divorce with minimal impact on kids (live near each other, co-parent well, no custody or support arguments). Most don't.

I don’t think abuse is the only thing you should show your kids you’ll tolerate. I think high conflict marriage isn’t something we should show kids we’ll tolerate. A spouse freeloading off the other and expecting to be waited on. I’m happily married, but I’m not raising my daughter to believe she has to pick up a grown man’s socks.

Well there's nuance here. With better communication and problem-solving skills, a high-conflict relationship can be made more functional. Wouldn't it be better for kids if parents put the effort in to address their conflict, and resolve them at least well enough to keep the family together, then to say "ugh we fight all the time, I guess we have to split up." As though fighting all the time is something you have no control over.

Sure there might be relationships where the conflict is truly caused by just one person, and they absolutely will not change. But most of the time, it takes two to tango. Work on it.

Similar thing with freeloading. My DH sometimes freeloads. I call it out. We talk it through. He gets better. Our kids learn that you can speak up when you are in a relationship with someone who tries to take advantage of you or freeload off your hard work. They also learn that if your partner says "hey, this is not working for me, I don't like being expected to clean up after you," they can take that as the constructive criticism it is and do better.

Again, in some extreme cases you might have a person who can't talk it through and adjust, and in that case it might make more sense to divorce. But I'm also betting that the person who refuses to clean up after themselves AND is incapable of listening to a partner who asks them to try, is probably an abusive partner anyway.

So we're back to: unless there is abuse, your kids are probably better off if you can find a way to work it out, even if it doesn't perfectly maximize your individual happiness.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t model for your children things you don’t expect them to tolerate.

Yes, but the point here is that some of the reasons people get divorced are actually things we DO expect kids to tolerate. Boredom is part of life. Long-term relationships with anyone require dealing with annoyances, reconciling different goals and needs, working through conflicts to remember what you liked about them in the first place.

Abuse is a hard line for me, and not just physical abuse-- verbal or emotional abuse, or abusive patterns of gaslighting and undermining that really mess with a person psychologically. You don't want to expose your kid to any of that.

But often people get divorced because they "grew apart" or "want different things" or one or both think they *might* be happier with someone else. And if you don't have kids or your kids are grown? Why not, to for it. But those are really not good reasons to throw out a family and force children into joint custody arrangements. Divorce also has an annoying ability to create continual conflict in families, because the second you split, the parents are now in competition with each other for time with kids, time without kids, resources, etc.

If there is not abuse, be a freaking grown up and figure out how to do what is best for the kids. Most divorced compromise the kids' well being. I'll allow that some small percent manage a cordial divorce with minimal impact on kids (live near each other, co-parent well, no custody or support arguments). Most don't.

I don’t think abuse is the only thing you should show your kids you’ll tolerate. I think high conflict marriage isn’t something we should show kids we’ll tolerate. A spouse freeloading off the other and expecting to be waited on. I’m happily married, but I’m not raising my daughter to believe she has to pick up a grown man’s socks.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t model for your children things you don’t expect them to tolerate.

Yes, but the point here is that some of the reasons people get divorced are actually things we DO expect kids to tolerate. Boredom is part of life. Long-term relationships with anyone require dealing with annoyances, reconciling different goals and needs, working through conflicts to remember what you liked about them in the first place.

Abuse is a hard line for me, and not just physical abuse-- verbal or emotional abuse, or abusive patterns of gaslighting and undermining that really mess with a person psychologically. You don't want to expose your kid to any of that.

But often people get divorced because they "grew apart" or "want different things" or one or both think they *might* be happier with someone else. And if you don't have kids or your kids are grown? Why not, to for it. But those are really not good reasons to throw out a family and force children into joint custody arrangements. Divorce also has an annoying ability to create continual conflict in families, because the second you split, the parents are now in competition with each other for time with kids, time without kids, resources, etc.

If there is not abuse, be a freaking grown up and figure out how to do what is best for the kids. Most divorced compromise the kids' well being. I'll allow that some small percent manage a cordial divorce with minimal impact on kids (live near each other, co-parent well, no custody or support arguments). Most don't.

I don’t think abuse is the only thing you should show your kids you’ll tolerate. I think high conflict marriage isn’t something we should show kids we’ll tolerate. A spouse freeloading off the other and expecting to be waited on. I’m happily married, but I’m not raising my daughter to believe she has to pick up a grown man’s socks.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t model for your children things you don’t expect them to tolerate.

Yes, but the point here is that some of the reasons people get divorced are actually things we DO expect kids to tolerate. Boredom is part of life. Long-term relationships with anyone require dealing with annoyances, reconciling different goals and needs, working through conflicts to remember what you liked about them in the first place.

Abuse is a hard line for me, and not just physical abuse-- verbal or emotional abuse, or abusive patterns of gaslighting and undermining that really mess with a person psychologically. You don't want to expose your kid to any of that.

But often people get divorced because they "grew apart" or "want different things" or one or both think they *might* be happier with someone else. And if you don't have kids or your kids are grown? Why not, to for it. But those are really not good reasons to throw out a family and force children into joint custody arrangements. Divorce also has an annoying ability to create continual conflict in families, because the second you split, the parents are now in competition with each other for time with kids, time without kids, resources, etc.

If there is not abuse, be a freaking grown up and figure out how to do what is best for the kids. Most divorced compromise the kids' well being. I'll allow that some small percent manage a cordial divorce with minimal impact on kids (live near each other, co-parent well, no custody or support arguments). Most don't.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Only choose perfectly in the beginning. There is no excuse for if a partner becomes emotionally, verbally, or even physically abusive. There is no excuse if our partner cheats and gives you an STD. Remember that you should have prediced all of that. Never, ever divorce. Your (and I am only talking to mothers, not fathers, who are entitled to cheat) happiness means nothing where kids are involved.

Calm down. People are talking about the “I’m bored. We grew apart”- not abuse and adultery.

Anonymous wrote:You don't know why people divorced. People are embarrassed about being abused. They may not think it's your business. They may think it's in the best interest of their kids to not share what happened.

Anonymous wrote:I'm staying and I have no idea if it's the right choice or not. I don't know how everyone's so sure either way. I had one couple's therapist who thought we were great together and one was giving me domestic abuse hotlines. For right now I'm getting as much space as I can while still living together, and we'll see how it goes.

Anonymous wrote:Only choose perfectly in the beginning. There is no excuse for if a partner becomes emotionally, verbally, or even physically abusive. There is no excuse if our partner cheats and gives you an STD. Remember that you should have prediced all of that. Never, ever divorce. Your (and I am only talking to mothers, not fathers, who are entitled to cheat) happiness means nothing where kids are involved.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think a lot of people don't realize that there will be rough years and rough periods of time. As a kid and teen I was always sad my parents didn't have date nights and didn't hold hands, etc. As an adult I'm thrilled that they're married. They're such wonderful grandparents together and they get 2x the grandparent time that they'd get if they were divorced. They take my kids to dinner and on outings constantly which would be too much for just one of them to do. Now that they're retired, they enjoy spending time together so much more.

And most importantly to me, they help each other through health crises and accompany each other to doctor's appts. They manage their house together too.

+100

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t model for your children things you don’t expect them to tolerate.

Yes, but the point here is that some of the reasons people get divorced are actually things we DO expect kids to tolerate. Boredom is part of life. Long-term relationships with anyone require dealing with annoyances, reconciling different goals and needs, working through conflicts to remember what you liked about them in the first place.

Abuse is a hard line for me, and not just physical abuse-- verbal or emotional abuse, or abusive patterns of gaslighting and undermining that really mess with a person psychologically. You don't want to expose your kid to any of that.

But often people get divorced because they "grew apart" or "want different things" or one or both think they *might* be happier with someone else. And if you don't have kids or your kids are grown? Why not, to for it. But those are really not good reasons to throw out a family and force children into joint custody arrangements. Divorce also has an annoying ability to create continual conflict in families, because the second you split, the parents are now in competition with each other for time with kids, time without kids, resources, etc.

If there is not abuse, be a freaking grown up and figure out how to do what is best for the kids. Most divorced compromise the kids' well being. I'll allow that some small percent manage a cordial divorce with minimal impact on kids (live near each other, co-parent well, no custody or support arguments). Most don't.

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Anonymous wrote:Why didn’t you drive her OP?

Personally I think remarrying and having babies when you have young kids is pretty tacky so I’m with you there.

Same. So trashy.

Quick, everyone stop living your lives because two losers on DCUM think it's "tacky and trashy."

BTW tacky and trashy are words you use when you're uneducated and haven't read enough to learn other, more descriptive words.

That’s not it. I have many other words. But, that is not how words work. Tacky and trashy are absolutely perfect here so one need not expand. The most educated people know that words should be precise.

One could say selfish, unfair, shortsighted, small, limited, stifling, sad. All would work.

And don’t forget “stupid”

I think it's stupid and limited and small to stay in a situation that is horrible for your mental and physical health under the guise that you're some kind of a martyr for your kids. If you want to stay married, by all means, have at it. To call the choices of other people all the names you listed when you have absolutely no idea what they are going through is the epitome of trashy and tacky.

Live your life. It’s all about you and your happiness. Kids be damned. You’re #1.

Like I said, fakey fake martyrdom is so much more noble. You do you.

NP
wtf is fakey fake martyrdom?

Staying married to a cereal cheater "for kid's sake" for example. Staying married to an alcoholic or a gambler, because you don't want kids to be from "a broken home." Your home is already broken, dear. You just don't have the guts to leave. That's the only difference.