Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe people still drink regularly given the all the science linking it to cancer and other poor health outcomes.

If you find it challenging to skip the booze for a month, then you have a problem.

The science is all over the place. Most studies link a glass of wine a day to good health outcomes in terms of heart disease. Fifty percent of Americans will die from heart disease, so a a drink a day is probably more beneficial than abstaining for most people.

NO, the science IS NOT all over the place! You are either a liar or you don't bother actually following scientific advances. There is not a single responsible medical professional - except maybe one who has alcohol use disorder - who would tell you it's okay to drink habitually.

Even one drink a day is bad for your body - any of the old science linking alcohol use to health benefits is entirely outweighed by recent studies establishing beyond doubt that alcohol is very unhealthy for the human body. Period.

People who defend regular alcohol use in the face of the known science have alcohol problems, or loved ones with alcohol problems, and are living in total denial.

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-of-alcohol-consumption-is-safe-for-our-health

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/13/well/mind/alcohol-health-effects.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/03/31/moderate-drinking-alcohol-wine-risks/

https://time.com/6248439/no-safe-amount-of-alcohol/

Drinkers are just like smokers - excuses excuses, tackle your addiction or at least STFU about it and stop recruiting new users.

The studies actually are all over the place. The ones you posted are based on a recent large scale study. That study started with the premise that light to moderate alcohol drinkers have better heart outcomes than those who abstain entirely. But its conclusion was that their better outcomes were not from drinking alcohol, but because of their other lifestyle choices. That was just one study, but it still found that light to moderate alcohol drinkers are healthier than abstainers.

Here is what the American College of Cardiology has to say on the matter:

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2021/05/05/19/14/alcohol-in-moderation-may-help-the-heart-by-calming-stress-signals-in-the-brain

So yes, the studies are all over the place, with the vast majority saying that light to moderate alcohol consumption is healthier than abstaining. Even the recent study that your articles and the WHO used to say that no amount of alcohol is good for you conceded that light to moderate drinkers have better heart health than those who abstain.

While alcoholism is a serious problem for some, many people get great health benefits from drinking light amounts. Don’t conflate the two very different experiences.

You can probably find many studies to support alcohol not being a problem. But anyone who isn’t an alcoholic knows it’s a toxin and no drinking is better than any amount of drinking.

It’s people like you who drive me to drink. Totally black and white thinking.

Lol true.

I think all these people are children of alcoholics and have so much trauma around alcohol they can’t see it in any light except it’s “toxic “.

It’s sad actually

May your children never have to learn the lessons of being children of an addict.

That doesn’t give you permission to tell every human that has a few drinks every week they are alcoholics.

Own your own sh!t.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe people still drink regularly given the all the science linking it to cancer and other poor health outcomes.

If you find it challenging to skip the booze for a month, then you have a problem.

The science is all over the place. Most studies link a glass of wine a day to good health outcomes in terms of heart disease. Fifty percent of Americans will die from heart disease, so a a drink a day is probably more beneficial than abstaining for most people.

NO, the science IS NOT all over the place! You are either a liar or you don't bother actually following scientific advances. There is not a single responsible medical professional - except maybe one who has alcohol use disorder - who would tell you it's okay to drink habitually.

Even one drink a day is bad for your body - any of the old science linking alcohol use to health benefits is entirely outweighed by recent studies establishing beyond doubt that alcohol is very unhealthy for the human body. Period.

People who defend regular alcohol use in the face of the known science have alcohol problems, or loved ones with alcohol problems, and are living in total denial.

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-of-alcohol-consumption-is-safe-for-our-health

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/13/well/mind/alcohol-health-effects.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/03/31/moderate-drinking-alcohol-wine-risks/

https://time.com/6248439/no-safe-amount-of-alcohol/

Drinkers are just like smokers - excuses excuses, tackle your addiction or at least STFU about it and stop recruiting new users.

The studies actually are all over the place. The ones you posted are based on a recent large scale study. That study started with the premise that light to moderate alcohol drinkers have better heart outcomes than those who abstain entirely. But its conclusion was that their better outcomes were not from drinking alcohol, but because of their other lifestyle choices. That was just one study, but it still found that light to moderate alcohol drinkers are healthier than abstainers.

Here is what the American College of Cardiology has to say on the matter:

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2021/05/05/19/14/alcohol-in-moderation-may-help-the-heart-by-calming-stress-signals-in-the-brain

So yes, the studies are all over the place, with the vast majority saying that light to moderate alcohol consumption is healthier than abstaining. Even the recent study that your articles and the WHO used to say that no amount of alcohol is good for you conceded that light to moderate drinkers have better heart health than those who abstain.

While alcoholism is a serious problem for some, many people get great health benefits from drinking light amounts. Don’t conflate the two very different experiences.

You can probably find many studies to support alcohol not being a problem. But anyone who isn’t an alcoholic knows it’s a toxin and no drinking is better than any amount of drinking.

It’s people like you who drive me to drink. Totally black and white thinking.

Lol true.

I think all these people are children of alcoholics and have so much trauma around alcohol they can’t see it in any light except it’s “toxic “.

It’s sad actually

May your children never have to learn the lessons of being children of an addict.

You know what’s really annoying and sad? Being so self absorbed that you cannot entertain that other people have different opinions and experiences than you do.

I’m really sorry that you are somehow familiar with what it is like to be the child of an addict.

I know what it’s like to be the child of a narcissist. My narcissistic parent is a teetotaler. No drinking, no smoking, no anything. The lack of an addiction didn’t save me from the emotional scars of being raised by a narcissist.

But I don’t assume that every teetotaler is a narcissist. I appreciate that the realm of human experience is broad. I also appreciate that many, many people can partake in drinking and maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol. Just because you know an out of control alcoholic doesn’t mean that other people don’t know when to stop. If your parent were morbidly obese because of food addiction, would that mean that other people should never eat sweets? That’s nonsense.

It’s not all about you.

The derisive, condescending tone sounds very much like a narc, PP you might want to do some introspection re: your own thought/communication patterns.

NP, I’m curious, what in the comment that you were commenting on (which I tried to italicize) sounded narcissistic in its thought and communication pattern? I don’t see it at all and am genuinely curious how you were able to get narcissism out of that comment. I just don’t see it. Please explain!

[i]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe people still drink regularly given the all the science linking it to cancer and other poor health outcomes.

If you find it challenging to skip the booze for a month, then you have a problem.

The science is all over the place. Most studies link a glass of wine a day to good health outcomes in terms of heart disease. Fifty percent of Americans will die from heart disease, so a a drink a day is probably more beneficial than abstaining for most people.

NO, the science IS NOT all over the place! You are either a liar or you don't bother actually following scientific advances. There is not a single responsible medical professional - except maybe one who has alcohol use disorder - who would tell you it's okay to drink habitually.

Even one drink a day is bad for your body - any of the old science linking alcohol use to health benefits is entirely outweighed by recent studies establishing beyond doubt that alcohol is very unhealthy for the human body. Period.

People who defend regular alcohol use in the face of the known science have alcohol problems, or loved ones with alcohol problems, and are living in total denial.

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-of-alcohol-consumption-is-safe-for-our-health

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/13/well/mind/alcohol-health-effects.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/03/31/moderate-drinking-alcohol-wine-risks/

https://time.com/6248439/no-safe-amount-of-alcohol/

Drinkers are just like smokers - excuses excuses, tackle your addiction or at least STFU about it and stop recruiting new users.

The studies actually are all over the place. The ones you posted are based on a recent large scale study. That study started with the premise that light to moderate alcohol drinkers have better heart outcomes than those who abstain entirely. But its conclusion was that their better outcomes were not from drinking alcohol, but because of their other lifestyle choices. That was just one study, but it still found that light to moderate alcohol drinkers are healthier than abstainers.

Here is what the American College of Cardiology has to say on the matter:

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2021/05/05/19/14/alcohol-in-moderation-may-help-the-heart-by-calming-stress-signals-in-the-brain

So yes, the studies are all over the place, with the vast majority saying that light to moderate alcohol consumption is healthier than abstaining. Even the recent study that your articles and the WHO used to say that no amount of alcohol is good for you conceded that light to moderate drinkers have better heart health than those who abstain.

While alcoholism is a serious problem for some, many people get great health benefits from drinking light amounts. Don’t conflate the two very different experiences.

You can probably find many studies to support alcohol not being a problem. But anyone who isn’t an alcoholic knows it’s a toxin and no drinking is better than any amount of drinking.

It’s people like you who drive me to drink. Totally black and white thinking.

Lol true.

I think all these people are children of alcoholics and have so much trauma around alcohol they can’t see it in any light except it’s “toxic “.

It’s sad actually

May your children never have to learn the lessons of being children of an addict.

You know what’s really annoying and sad? Being so self absorbed that you cannot entertain that other people have different opinions and experiences than you do.

I’m really sorry that you are somehow familiar with what it is like to be the child of an addict.

I know what it’s like to be the child of a narcissist. My narcissistic parent is a teetotaler. No drinking, no smoking, no anything. The lack of an addiction didn’t save me from the emotional scars of being raised by a narcissist.

But I don’t assume that every teetotaler is a narcissist. I appreciate that the realm of human experience is broad. I also appreciate that many, many people can partake in drinking and maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol. Just because you know an out of control alcoholic doesn’t mean that other people don’t know when to stop. If your parent were morbidly obese because of food addiction, would that mean that other people should never eat sweets? That’s nonsense.

It’s not all about you.

The derisive, condescending tone sounds very much like a narc, PP you might want to do some introspection re: your own thought/communication patterns.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here — I came from a heavy drinking family and culture. Several close relatives and family friends owned and managed bars while I was growing up. Consequently, i spent a lot of time in bars even as a child. I saw people who didn’t have a problem, and people who said they didn’t have a problem. I’m not opposed to drinking. I’m just fascinated by the concept of dry January (be it alcohol or cannabis or … shopping). I’m Catholic so abstaining from something is not a foreign concept to me, so adding dry January sometimes seems like a repetitive concept. I rarely drink to the point that some friends/neighbors (not all) in the DMV make a point to say something that I’m having a drink. It’s weird because I don’t think of myself as a non-drinker but I guess it’s all relative when I have a drink maybe 4x a year and friends have a drink or more every week.

Again the thing that struck me was how many people (my age and younger) in the conversation said that dry January would be a struggle. I would not have beeen surprised if they were boomers or older. Although I shouldn’t have been surprised since COVID closures didn’t negatively affect ABC stores and takeout alcohol restrictions were relaxed.

That’s because actual alcoholics account for something like 80% of alcohol sales. Liquor stores weren’t closed specifically because we didn’t need our ERs full of withdrawing alcoholics. It wasn’t because of the wine moms. I can’t believe how many people still don’t understand this.

Hon, a significant minority of Wine Moms actually have alcohol use disorder. see especially 4, 9 and 10. Preening around in your Golden Goose shoes doesn't mean you're not an alcoholic

https://www.medscape.com/answers/285913-41535/what-are-the-dsm-5-criteria-for-%20alcohol-use-disorder?form=fpf

Sorry but no matter how much you wish it was true, and how jealous you are of their expensive sneakers, these are not the people who get the DTs and go to the ER when they can’t get ahold of alcohol. If wine moms were the only people who consumed alcohol the liquor stores would’ve been closed during Covid along with everything else. You’re welcome for the public health lesson!

One of us worked in ER / ICU during the height of the pandemic and the other one did not. One of us — okay, it’s me — is a clinician with years of schooling and so doesn’t fall for the red herring that an essential diagnostic criterion for AUD is delerium tremens.

Yes, package stores stayed open per DOH to avert widespread acute withdrawals for those at risk for cardiac consequences of unsupervised withdrawal

Doesn’t mean a lot of Wine Moms in my orbit aren’t clearly dependent on their substance and meet criteria for alcohol use disorder.

You’re welcome, Caitlin

Anonymous wrote:I have alcohol use disorder and so I don’t drink at all any more, but I’m glad to see taking a break from drinking normalized, and other aspects of the sober curious movement like a wider variety of non alcoholic drinks, especially ones that are not sickly sweet mocktails. I don’t judge those that do dry January or those that don’t.

I would add that if someone is doing dry january, don’t press them for answers as to why they’re doing it. Some people who do it may not be big drinkers and it’s the equivalent of a juice cleanse for them. Some people who do it are concerned that they’ve got a problem. None of your business which journey they’re on unless they choose to share. Alcohol problems aren’t the alcoholic /not alcoholic binary that’s often pitched to us, and some people you know who appear to be just moderate drinkers are probably struggling more than you realize even if they don’t fall within the definition of alcoholic.

I have alcohol use disorder and so I don’t drink at all any more, but I’m glad to see taking a break from drinking normalized, and other aspects of the sober curious movement like a wider variety of non alcoholic drinks, especially ones that are not sickly sweet mocktails. I don’t judge those that do dry January or those that don’t.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe people still drink regularly given the all the science linking it to cancer and other poor health outcomes.

If you find it challenging to skip the booze for a month, then you have a problem.

The science is all over the place. Most studies link a glass of wine a day to good health outcomes in terms of heart disease. Fifty percent of Americans will die from heart disease, so a a drink a day is probably more beneficial than abstaining for most people.

NO, the science IS NOT all over the place! You are either a liar or you don't bother actually following scientific advances. There is not a single responsible medical professional - except maybe one who has alcohol use disorder - who would tell you it's okay to drink habitually.

Even one drink a day is bad for your body - any of the old science linking alcohol use to health benefits is entirely outweighed by recent studies establishing beyond doubt that alcohol is very unhealthy for the human body. Period.

People who defend regular alcohol use in the face of the known science have alcohol problems, or loved ones with alcohol problems, and are living in total denial.

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-of-alcohol-consumption-is-safe-for-our-health

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/13/well/mind/alcohol-health-effects.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/03/31/moderate-drinking-alcohol-wine-risks/

https://time.com/6248439/no-safe-amount-of-alcohol/

Drinkers are just like smokers - excuses excuses, tackle your addiction or at least STFU about it and stop recruiting new users.

The studies actually are all over the place. The ones you posted are based on a recent large scale study. That study started with the premise that light to moderate alcohol drinkers have better heart outcomes than those who abstain entirely. But its conclusion was that their better outcomes were not from drinking alcohol, but because of their other lifestyle choices. That was just one study, but it still found that light to moderate alcohol drinkers are healthier than abstainers.

Here is what the American College of Cardiology has to say on the matter:

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2021/05/05/19/14/alcohol-in-moderation-may-help-the-heart-by-calming-stress-signals-in-the-brain

So yes, the studies are all over the place, with the vast majority saying that light to moderate alcohol consumption is healthier than abstaining. Even the recent study that your articles and the WHO used to say that no amount of alcohol is good for you conceded that light to moderate drinkers have better heart health than those who abstain.

While alcoholism is a serious problem for some, many people get great health benefits from drinking light amounts. Don’t conflate the two very different experiences.

You can probably find many studies to support alcohol not being a problem. But anyone who isn’t an alcoholic knows it’s a toxin and no drinking is better than any amount of drinking.

It’s people like you who drive me to drink. Totally black and white thinking.

Lol true.

I think all these people are children of alcoholics and have so much trauma around alcohol they can’t see it in any light except it’s “toxic “.

It’s sad actually

May your children never have to learn the lessons of being children of an addict.

You know what’s really annoying and sad? Being so self absorbed that you cannot entertain that other people have different opinions and experiences than you do.

I’m really sorry that you are somehow familiar with what it is like to be the child of an addict.

I know what it’s like to be the child of a narcissist. My narcissistic parent is a teetotaler. No drinking, no smoking, no anything. The lack of an addiction didn’t save me from the emotional scars of being raised by a narcissist.

But I don’t assume that every teetotaler is a narcissist. I appreciate that the realm of human experience is broad. I also appreciate that many, many people can partake in drinking and maintain a healthy relationship with alcohol. Just because you know an out of control alcoholic doesn’t mean that other people don’t know when to stop. If your parent were morbidly obese because of food addiction, would that mean that other people should never eat sweets? That’s nonsense.

It’s not all about you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here — I came from a heavy drinking family and culture. Several close relatives and family friends owned and managed bars while I was growing up. Consequently, i spent a lot of time in bars even as a child. I saw people who didn’t have a problem, and people who said they didn’t have a problem. I’m not opposed to drinking. I’m just fascinated by the concept of dry January (be it alcohol or cannabis or … shopping). I’m Catholic so abstaining from something is not a foreign concept to me, so adding dry January sometimes seems like a repetitive concept. I rarely drink to the point that some friends/neighbors (not all) in the DMV make a point to say something that I’m having a drink. It’s weird because I don’t think of myself as a non-drinker but I guess it’s all relative when I have a drink maybe 4x a year and friends have a drink or more every week.

Again the thing that struck me was how many people (my age and younger) in the conversation said that dry January would be a struggle. I would not have beeen surprised if they were boomers or older. Although I shouldn’t have been surprised since COVID closures didn’t negatively affect ABC stores and takeout alcohol restrictions were relaxed.

That’s because actual alcoholics account for something like 80% of alcohol sales. Liquor stores weren’t closed specifically because we didn’t need our ERs full of withdrawing alcoholics. It wasn’t because of the wine moms. I can’t believe how many people still don’t understand this.

What the demographics of those alcoholics? How do you know 80% of the people buying alcohol are alcoholics?

Are you suggesting that non-alcoholics just buy drinks at restaurants and not for home consumption?

There is abundant research on this. Feel free to google.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here — I came from a heavy drinking family and culture. Several close relatives and family friends owned and managed bars while I was growing up. Consequently, i spent a lot of time in bars even as a child. I saw people who didn’t have a problem, and people who said they didn’t have a problem. I’m not opposed to drinking. I’m just fascinated by the concept of dry January (be it alcohol or cannabis or … shopping). I’m Catholic so abstaining from something is not a foreign concept to me, so adding dry January sometimes seems like a repetitive concept. I rarely drink to the point that some friends/neighbors (not all) in the DMV make a point to say something that I’m having a drink. It’s weird because I don’t think of myself as a non-drinker but I guess it’s all relative when I have a drink maybe 4x a year and friends have a drink or more every week.

Again the thing that struck me was how many people (my age and younger) in the conversation said that dry January would be a struggle. I would not have beeen surprised if they were boomers or older. Although I shouldn’t have been surprised since COVID closures didn’t negatively affect ABC stores and takeout alcohol restrictions were relaxed.

That’s because actual alcoholics account for something like 80% of alcohol sales. Liquor stores weren’t closed specifically because we didn’t need our ERs full of withdrawing alcoholics. It wasn’t because of the wine moms. I can’t believe how many people still don’t understand this.

Hon, a significant minority of Wine Moms actually have alcohol use disorder. see especially 4, 9 and 10. Preening around in your Golden Goose shoes doesn't mean you're not an alcoholic

https://www.medscape.com/answers/285913-41535/what-are-the-dsm-5-criteria-for-%20alcohol-use-disorder?form=fpf

Sorry but no matter how much you wish it was true, and how jealous you are of their expensive sneakers, these are not the people who get the DTs and go to the ER when they can’t get ahold of alcohol. If wine moms were the only people who consumed alcohol the liquor stores would’ve been closed during Covid along with everything else. You’re welcome for the public health lesson!

I think people find dry January difficult for the same reasons that a lot of people struggle with any lifestyle change, whether it's cleaning up your diet, exercising more, or getting more sleep. Everyone's willpower is different. Alcohol is also addictive and present in nearly every aspect of our society which adds to the difficulty for some. Some "non-alcoholics" might be functioning alcohol abusers and not realize it.

I randomly did a dry 2 months last summer. I started getting to the point where I questioned whether I was drinking too much (alcoholism runs in my family), and overall I wasn't feeling great physically so I decided to cut alcohol to see if that helped. It wasn't difficult for me to stop drinking, but those first 2 weeks of breaking the habit required conscious effort of changing my evening routine to avoid mindlessly pouring a glass of wine after dinner. After those first two weeks, it didn't feel like an effort. My sleep improved so I felt a bit more energetic during the day, but that was the only noticeable improvement. I did resume drinking but it's been very infrequent, although it did pick up during the holidays. I'm also drinking a lot less on the occasions I have a drink (stopping at 1 glass of wine instead of having 3, for example). I will likely do dry January for another reset after the holidays as part of my overall efforts to refocus on my health.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I like doing dry Jan. I find the holidays sooo easy to overindulge. Parties, seeing friends for dinner, having more elaborate (and unhealthy) meals, getting to sleep in etc are all really easy excuses to have more than I should. I like using January as a reset. Have fun during Dec but get back on track for the new year.

I definitely find it hard, but it’s certainly a mix of going back to reality (work), in shtty weather, and refocusing on taking care of myself.

I bought whiskey tasting tix for dh and I as a present and that’s at the end of Feb. so we may do dry Jan+feb until then, see how it goes.

That's not everyone. I have two young kids and didn't go to many holiday parties and I definitely never slept in. My Dec was busy and a lot of work and I'm ready to relax and unwind a bit!

Ok? I said that’s why *i* like doing dry Jan, not sure why you felt the need to comment. Sorry you didn’t get to sleep in I guess.

It seems regular in-take of alcohol and other substances (that is, things needed to relax including things like food) point to a bigger mental health issue that needs to be addressed. Not everyone is an alcoholic, but plenty of people have a problem with it than they realize or admit.

Anonymous wrote:I like doing dry Jan. I find the holidays sooo easy to overindulge. Parties, seeing friends for dinner, having more elaborate (and unhealthy) meals, getting to sleep in etc are all really easy excuses to have more than I should. I like using January as a reset. Have fun during Dec but get back on track for the new year.

I definitely find it hard, but it’s certainly a mix of going back to reality (work), in shtty weather, and refocusing on taking care of myself.

I bought whiskey tasting tix for dh and I as a present and that’s at the end of Feb. so we may do dry Jan+feb until then, see how it goes.

That's not everyone. I have two young kids and didn't go to many holiday parties and I definitely never slept in. My Dec was busy and a lot of work and I'm ready to relax and unwind a bit!

I don't do dry January. I have a drink if I want one. I'm careful because there is alcoholism in my family. If it starts to taste too good, I back off for a while.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe people still drink regularly given the all the science linking it to cancer and other poor health outcomes.

If you find it challenging to skip the booze for a month, then you have a problem.

The science is all over the place. Most studies link a glass of wine a day to good health outcomes in terms of heart disease. Fifty percent of Americans will die from heart disease, so a a drink a day is probably more beneficial than abstaining for most people.

NO, the science IS NOT all over the place! You are either a liar or you don't bother actually following scientific advances. There is not a single responsible medical professional - except maybe one who has alcohol use disorder - who would tell you it's okay to drink habitually.

Even one drink a day is bad for your body - any of the old science linking alcohol use to health benefits is entirely outweighed by recent studies establishing beyond doubt that alcohol is very unhealthy for the human body. Period.

People who defend regular alcohol use in the face of the known science have alcohol problems, or loved ones with alcohol problems, and are living in total denial.

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/04-01-2023-no-level-of-alcohol-consumption-is-safe-for-our-health

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/13/well/mind/alcohol-health-effects.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/03/31/moderate-drinking-alcohol-wine-risks/

https://time.com/6248439/no-safe-amount-of-alcohol/

Drinkers are just like smokers - excuses excuses, tackle your addiction or at least STFU about it and stop recruiting new users.

The studies actually are all over the place. The ones you posted are based on a recent large scale study. That study started with the premise that light to moderate alcohol drinkers have better heart outcomes than those who abstain entirely. But its conclusion was that their better outcomes were not from drinking alcohol, but because of their other lifestyle choices. That was just one study, but it still found that light to moderate alcohol drinkers are healthier than abstainers.

Here is what the American College of Cardiology has to say on the matter:

https://www.acc.org/about-acc/press-releases/2021/05/05/19/14/alcohol-in-moderation-may-help-the-heart-by-calming-stress-signals-in-the-brain

So yes, the studies are all over the place, with the vast majority saying that light to moderate alcohol consumption is healthier than abstaining. Even the recent study that your articles and the WHO used to say that no amount of alcohol is good for you conceded that light to moderate drinkers have better heart health than those who abstain.

While alcoholism is a serious problem for some, many people get great health benefits from drinking light amounts. Don’t conflate the two very different experiences.

You can probably find many studies to support alcohol not being a problem. But anyone who isn’t an alcoholic knows it’s a toxin and no drinking is better than any amount of drinking.

It’s people like you who drive me to drink. Totally black and white thinking.

Lol true.

I think all these people are children of alcoholics and have so much trauma around alcohol they can’t see it in any light except it’s “toxic “.

It’s sad actually

May your children never have to learn the lessons of being children of an addict.