Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The nanny was so offended by a request for a doctor’s note that she quit?!? Honestly she was going to leave you high and dry at some point… if you didn’t give her the right bonus, if you didn’t give her enough PTO, whatever. Good riddance.

OP even assuming the nanny quit all because of your request for a doctors note (what a dumb reason to quit a job), * you * are not “ruining” your friend’s life. There’s no reason this nanny can’t continue working for your friend (after all, you’re the big bad villain here, right?). That’s on the nanny, though she and other posters here want you to think it’s your fault. BS.

It’s also not your fault your friend doesn’t have parents/in laws/backup sitters.

Your friend is stressed and overwhelmed. Give her time to get her childcare lined up (daycare sounds way better than a mercurial nanny) and you guys will probably be able to patch things up. And if not, that’s ok - life goes on.

Lots of lessons to learn here, but all I see is an entitled nanny trying to get out of a nanny share by putting the blame on you.

the nanny gave FOUR weeks notice which was way more grace than OP gave her.

Fair point. Most nanny employers make do with two weeks - or sometimes no notice. I absolutely believe there are grounds for immediate resignation, such as if the nanny's physical or mental health is at stake. But doctor's notes are pretty routine - my local hospital includes one with every patient discharge. It just doesn't seem like something to quit your job over!

I agree with other PPs who say maybe she wasn't happy. Satisfied employees who are paid well don't resign over something like this, and in such dramatic fashion. And then to leave the friend - who did nothing wrong! - high and dry. Sounds like the nanny knew she could get a better gig somewhere else.

OP you are super lucky to have in laws to fill in. Your friend should go the daycare route if they don't have backups.

Sure, because it's just so easy to find a daycare spot at a random time of year in less than a month

Yeah she’ll have to have interim care while she selects a daycare with availability. My point was that if her ability to work is dependent on having childcare, a daycare will be preferable over a nanny for several reasons. Even the most reliable, dependable nanny will need time off, and realistically some of that time off will be without notice, whereas a daycare (typically) can cover an employee’s absence without closing. A big benefit to a nanny over a daycare used to be taking care of sick kids (whereas most daycares will require a doctors note/no fever/etc), but that is shifting post-pandemic where nannies understandably don’t want to watch sick kids. Additionally most daycares can’t just kick out kids on a whim - there is a process, notice, etc. Seems preferable than giving that power to a nanny who can up and quit on you, where you have no family or back ups to fill in.

Welp, none of this was an issue before OP opened her big mouth.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The nanny was so offended by a request for a doctor’s note that she quit?!? Honestly she was going to leave you high and dry at some point… if you didn’t give her the right bonus, if you didn’t give her enough PTO, whatever. Good riddance.

OP even assuming the nanny quit all because of your request for a doctors note (what a dumb reason to quit a job), * you * are not “ruining” your friend’s life. There’s no reason this nanny can’t continue working for your friend (after all, you’re the big bad villain here, right?). That’s on the nanny, though she and other posters here want you to think it’s your fault. BS.

It’s also not your fault your friend doesn’t have parents/in laws/backup sitters.

Your friend is stressed and overwhelmed. Give her time to get her childcare lined up (daycare sounds way better than a mercurial nanny) and you guys will probably be able to patch things up. And if not, that’s ok - life goes on.

Lots of lessons to learn here, but all I see is an entitled nanny trying to get out of a nanny share by putting the blame on you.

the nanny gave FOUR weeks notice which was way more grace than OP gave her.

Fair point. Most nanny employers make do with two weeks - or sometimes no notice. I absolutely believe there are grounds for immediate resignation, such as if the nanny's physical or mental health is at stake. But doctor's notes are pretty routine - my local hospital includes one with every patient discharge. It just doesn't seem like something to quit your job over!

I agree with other PPs who say maybe she wasn't happy. Satisfied employees who are paid well don't resign over something like this, and in such dramatic fashion. And then to leave the friend - who did nothing wrong! - high and dry. Sounds like the nanny knew she could get a better gig somewhere else.

OP you are super lucky to have in laws to fill in. Your friend should go the daycare route if they don't have backups.

Sure, because it's just so easy to find a daycare spot at a random time of year in less than a month

Yeah she’ll have to have interim care while she selects a daycare with availability. My point was that if her ability to work is dependent on having childcare, a daycare will be preferable over a nanny for several reasons. Even the most reliable, dependable nanny will need time off, and realistically some of that time off will be without notice, whereas a daycare (typically) can cover an employee’s absence without closing. A big benefit to a nanny over a daycare used to be taking care of sick kids (whereas most daycares will require a doctors note/no fever/etc), but that is shifting post-pandemic where nannies understandably don’t want to watch sick kids. Additionally most daycares can’t just kick out kids on a whim - there is a process, notice, etc. Seems preferable than giving that power to a nanny who can up and quit on you, where you have no family or back ups to fill in.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The nanny was so offended by a request for a doctor’s note that she quit?!? Honestly she was going to leave you high and dry at some point… if you didn’t give her the right bonus, if you didn’t give her enough PTO, whatever. Good riddance.

OP even assuming the nanny quit all because of your request for a doctors note (what a dumb reason to quit a job), * you * are not “ruining” your friend’s life. There’s no reason this nanny can’t continue working for your friend (after all, you’re the big bad villain here, right?). That’s on the nanny, though she and other posters here want you to think it’s your fault. BS.

It’s also not your fault your friend doesn’t have parents/in laws/backup sitters.

Your friend is stressed and overwhelmed. Give her time to get her childcare lined up (daycare sounds way better than a mercurial nanny) and you guys will probably be able to patch things up. And if not, that’s ok - life goes on.

Lots of lessons to learn here, but all I see is an entitled nanny trying to get out of a nanny share by putting the blame on you.

the nanny gave FOUR weeks notice which was way more grace than OP gave her.

Fair point. Most nanny employers make do with two weeks - or sometimes no notice. I absolutely believe there are grounds for immediate resignation, such as if the nanny's physical or mental health is at stake. But doctor's notes are pretty routine - my local hospital includes one with every patient discharge. It just doesn't seem like something to quit your job over!

I agree with other PPs who say maybe she wasn't happy. Satisfied employees who are paid well don't resign over something like this, and in such dramatic fashion. And then to leave the friend - who did nothing wrong! - high and dry. Sounds like the nanny knew she could get a better gig somewhere else.

OP you are super lucky to have in laws to fill in. Your friend should go the daycare route if they don't have backups.

Sure, because it's just so easy to find a daycare spot at a random time of year in less than a month

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The nanny was so offended by a request for a doctor’s note that she quit?!? Honestly she was going to leave you high and dry at some point… if you didn’t give her the right bonus, if you didn’t give her enough PTO, whatever. Good riddance.

OP even assuming the nanny quit all because of your request for a doctors note (what a dumb reason to quit a job), * you * are not “ruining” your friend’s life. There’s no reason this nanny can’t continue working for your friend (after all, you’re the big bad villain here, right?). That’s on the nanny, though she and other posters here want you to think it’s your fault. BS.

It’s also not your fault your friend doesn’t have parents/in laws/backup sitters.

Your friend is stressed and overwhelmed. Give her time to get her childcare lined up (daycare sounds way better than a mercurial nanny) and you guys will probably be able to patch things up. And if not, that’s ok - life goes on.

Lots of lessons to learn here, but all I see is an entitled nanny trying to get out of a nanny share by putting the blame on you.

the nanny gave FOUR weeks notice which was way more grace than OP gave her.

Fair point. Most nanny employers make do with two weeks - or sometimes no notice. I absolutely believe there are grounds for immediate resignation, such as if the nanny's physical or mental health is at stake. But doctor's notes are pretty routine - my local hospital includes one with every patient discharge. It just doesn't seem like something to quit your job over!

I agree with other PPs who say maybe she wasn't happy. Satisfied employees who are paid well don't resign over something like this, and in such dramatic fashion. And then to leave the friend - who did nothing wrong! - high and dry. Sounds like the nanny knew she could get a better gig somewhere else.

OP you are super lucky to have in laws to fill in. Your friend should go the daycare route if they don't have backups.

Anonymous wrote:The nanny was so offended by a request for a doctor’s note that she quit?!? Honestly she was going to leave you high and dry at some point… if you didn’t give her the right bonus, if you didn’t give her enough PTO, whatever. Good riddance.

OP even assuming the nanny quit all because of your request for a doctors note (what a dumb reason to quit a job), * you * are not “ruining” your friend’s life. There’s no reason this nanny can’t continue working for your friend (after all, you’re the big bad villain here, right?). That’s on the nanny, though she and other posters here want you to think it’s your fault. BS.

It’s also not your fault your friend doesn’t have parents/in laws/backup sitters.

Your friend is stressed and overwhelmed. Give her time to get her childcare lined up (daycare sounds way better than a mercurial nanny) and you guys will probably be able to patch things up. And if not, that’s ok - life goes on.

Lots of lessons to learn here, but all I see is an entitled nanny trying to get out of a nanny share by putting the blame on you.

the nanny gave FOUR weeks notice which was way more grace than OP gave her.

A Drs. note?
What the hell? I have been sick for a few days but NOT sick enough to drive into an appointment, they would laugh and I don't want to pay $20 copay to say what?
Sally has a red sore throat and is coughing up flem at an unbelievable rate and is lethargic adn needs rest?

Either trust me or not. But if you don't, the nanny is right, you should NOT trust her to watch your kids.

The nanny was so offended by a request for a doctor’s note that she quit?!? Honestly she was going to leave you high and dry at some point… if you didn’t give her the right bonus, if you didn’t give her enough PTO, whatever. Good riddance.

OP even assuming the nanny quit all because of your request for a doctors note (what a dumb reason to quit a job), * you * are not “ruining” your friend’s life. There’s no reason this nanny can’t continue working for your friend (after all, you’re the big bad villain here, right?). That’s on the nanny, though she and other posters here want you to think it’s your fault. BS.

It’s also not your fault your friend doesn’t have parents/in laws/backup sitters.

Your friend is stressed and overwhelmed. Give her time to get her childcare lined up (daycare sounds way better than a mercurial nanny) and you guys will probably be able to patch things up. And if not, that’s ok - life goes on.

Lots of lessons to learn here, but all I see is an entitled nanny trying to get out of a nanny share by putting the blame on you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have never had a job where a note was requested. I am an adult and know how to manage my own illnesses and when to seek medical care. I def do not need my employer to tell me when to see a doctor. I would hate to work for you.

I do wonder what kind of business OP runs where she can’t trust her employees to not steal from her. If she can’t trust them to be sick, she can’t trust them with clients, inventory, cash, etc.

I'm curious about that too. OP has a general disdain and suspicion about her company's employees that spills over into other parts of her life. I've run a small business for a decade and a half and while every minute hasn't been smooth sailing with the people who work with me, most are very pleasant and trustworthy. I'm going out on a limb assuming OP doesn't pay well and is likely a prickly boss.

Adding to the situation are two very young children who saw each other daily and will no longer get to do so. They could have been longtime friends had OP not completely blown the relationship with the other parents. This situation is sad all the way around.

Oh please! It is perfectly normal to need a Dr note for a 3 day absence at many jobs. Both my parents needed a Dr. note for sick leave more than 2 days or any time it was a day before or after a holiday weekend. They both had professional, but union negotiated contract jobs. Lots of small businesses have employees who are not reliable and will definitely lie and take advantage of sick leave - have you ever worked fast food or retail?

If you offered the nanny a sincere apology that you were stressed and just following the protocol you use for your business without thinking - and she still resigned - then this wasn’t about the sick leave at all. She was looking for a reason to leave. Whether it’s due to your history of overbearing behavior or not, you’ll never know.

You and your friend are first time moms, barely a year into parenting. Your favorite daycare worker will quit abruptly and not say goodbye to your child. A kid in preschool will kick or push your child repeatedly and their parent will brush off your concerns and you will struggle to be nice to that parent for the rest of the school year. A person you thought was your friend will fail to tell you her husband volunteered to coach kindergarten soccer until it’s too late to switch to his team and your kid is on a different team from his friends. You’ll meet a mom friend that quickly becomes very close to you and your family - and then one of your kids will decide they hate the other mom’s kids and you won’t sit together at PTA meetings anymore.

My point is that:
1. This is the first of many more awkward social situations you will encounter because of your kid. Same for your friend. If she truly values your friendship beyond the convenience of a nanny share, she’ll come back once the stress of a lack of childcare subsides.
2. You need to find an identity and friends that are not tied to your kid or your husband - or even your neighbors. If you put all your eggs in one basket, you are one mean girls fight or broken window / fence dispute away from having no friends.

I'm sorry to hear that you have experienced this. Give yourself some GRACE, You are a first time parent, this is your first time having a nanny. You weren't aware that you were offending her, or I'm sure you wouldn't have done it. Everyone makes mistakes. Learn from them and Grow. Hang in there you will find one.

I wish there was a way I could share a list of available nannies with you as I carry a list. We nannies work together to help each other find jobs.

As for nanny shares, they are very hard on the family and the Nanny. We have to listen to two sets of rules, get used to two babies with different sleeping patterns, sometime feed the babies, deal with cultural differences (the nanny, and each family could all three be different), Vacation accommodations, sick children, not to mention teething at different times or simultaneously, and sometimes heavy children, etc

The nanny is doing twice the amount of work for less pay per child. And the work is hard.

The only person who wins is the families finances, they pay less.

Sometimes someone does something that makes me realize that we have fundamental differences that are too great to sustain a true friendship. I would absolutely feel that way in this case . . . if my friend was so oblivious to how this would turn out and so entitled that she didn't see the need to ask me as the nanny's co-boss before acting unilaterally, I'd probably end or pull back on the friendship too. Friendships are built on trust, and how can I trust someone with bad judgment who doesn't respect/think of me?

OP, are you one of those people with a history of relationships blowing up? My MIL's husband is constantly getting fired or kicked out of churches (I know, how often does that happen?!), and it's always someone else's fault. He's currently gotten MIL estranged from her siblings. It's really painful to listen to her explanations of why this "unfair" thing happened to him when obviously he is the common denominator. He has poor judgment, he's fairly self-centered, and he has a victim mentality. He's definitely not someone I would trust with something important to me, like managing my child's care.

I'm not saying these are all of your issues because I think you are more capable than this guy. But I do wonder if you have not developed your capacity for empathy very deeply. You come across as someone who has developed a very thick skin in order to get ahead, but it's coming back to bite you with employees who may fear you but don't respect you. And when things go south, you blame others or circumstances rather than looking inward. These are all things you can work on, if you are willing. But as to the immediate issue with your friend, I think that you need to apologize sincerely and acknowledge the error in acting unilaterally and how terrible it is that you have forced her to find new childcare arrangements. Anything less will get you written off as clueless, entitled, etc.

Your friend’s literal livelihood is in jeopardy (childcare is not easy to find with 4 weeks’ notice) because your handling of the situation. She is probably trying to keep her job right now, so she’s not going to be trying to make up with you at the moment.

You were absolutely in the wrong. How is it that you trust your nanny with your child but yet you do not trust her word as to being sick? You either trust her or you don’t.

I am a professional and have never been questioned\asked to provide proof when out sick. I would be offended.

As for the friendship, if you are as close as you say then why wouldn’t you have discussed it with them. You could have said” hey, barb, do you think we should ask Mary for a drs slip before we pay her for a sick day.” Barb could have said good idea or “ no, this is her first time and we don’t have any reason to question her. Let’s not worry about it.”

Why you immediately questioned your nanny’s integrity, and also did not discuss with your friend, is something you should reflect on. Hopefully you have learned from this so just move on.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have never had a job where a note was requested. I am an adult and know how to manage my own illnesses and when to seek medical care. I def do not need my employer to tell me when to see a doctor. I would hate to work for you.

I do wonder what kind of business OP runs where she can’t trust her employees to not steal from her. If she can’t trust them to be sick, she can’t trust them with clients, inventory, cash, etc.

I'm curious about that too. OP has a general disdain and suspicion about her company's employees that spills over into other parts of her life. I've run a small business for a decade and a half and while every minute hasn't been smooth sailing with the people who work with me, most are very pleasant and trustworthy. I'm going out on a limb assuming OP doesn't pay well and is likely a prickly boss.

Adding to the situation are two very young children who saw each other daily and will no longer get to do so. They could have been longtime friends had OP not completely blown the relationship with the other parents. This situation is sad all the way around.

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read the comments so sorry if I'm reiterating what others have said, but I was a full time nanny for 15 years and am now an MB. Here's my thoughts:
-Nanny shares are not fun for nannies. You have 2 families requirements and expectations to juggle (this is a perfect example) and 4 bosses instead of 2. Typically, the only reason a nanny does a share is for the increased pay rate. If I was with a family almost a year and never took off then got sick and they asked for a doctors note to "prove" it, I would also be inclined to resign. If they don't trust me to be truthful about an illness, what would happen if their kid got hurt on my watch? I had a child get a minor fracture under my care when she tripped in her living room and landed awkwardly on her arm. The family never questioned me and I was a wonderful employee to them for 6 years. I'd imagine a family that asked me to prove the validity of my need for sick days would have ruined my career over that trip and fall. I wouldn't feel safe working for them.

-Does your nanny have health insurance as a benefit? If not, did you just assume she has coverage? There was a period when I was nannying after I aged out of my parents coverage and before I was married where I didn't have health insurance. I was very sick once and had to go to urgent care and the bill was almost a week of my pay and that was the only time in my life I was late on rent that month. It was extremely stressful for me.

All of these points are excellent.

I am willing to bet that if OP is requiring sick notes of her nanny without consulting the other family, and requiring sick notes of employees, that she is also doing other offensive or unreasonable or out of bounds things, and may not even be aware.