Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

It must be nice to not have prolapse and to act like the fact that your uterus, bladder, Or rectum are falling out of your body is NBD just because “some”
People are asymptomstic. Many are not and can have a whole range of other issues ranging from urinary leaking to an inability to fully evacuate stool. For most women with POP, discovering it is a horrifying experience. The Association of Pelvic Organ Prolapse says that childbirth is the leading POP cause and that half of women will get it in their lifetime. PT cannot reverse POP, though it can help with symptoms. But even surgery does not routinely fix all symptoms and it has a high failure/reoperation rate. The deconditioning and inability to do high impact exercise that often accompanies a POP diagnosis can also lead many women to experience health and mental health issues. There’s a reason it is called the silent epidemic. Don’t act like it’s just a few women who are impacted - it is millions.

APOPS stance is 50% prevalence is a comparatively accurate stat considering childbirth is the leading POP cause, menopause is the 2nd leading POP cause, and a multitude of lifestyle, behavioral, and comorbid conditions compound risk of POP. As of July 2019, there are approximately 3.9 billion women in the world. Considering 50% of these women will likely experience pelvic organ prolapse at some point in their lives, there is zero doubt pelvic organ prolapse is of pandemic prevalence

https://www.pelvicorganprolapsesupport.org/how-common-is-pelvic-organ-prolapse

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

It must be nice to not have prolapse and to act like the fact that your uterus, bladder, Or rectum are falling out of your body is NBD just because “some”
People are asymptomstic. Many are not and can have a whole range of other issues ranging from urinary leaking to an inability to fully evacuate stool. For most women with POP, discovering it is a horrifying experience. The Association of Pelvic Organ Prolapse says that childbirth is the leading POP cause and that half of women will get it in their lifetime. PT cannot reverse POP, though it can help with symptoms. But even surgery does not routinely fix all symptoms and it has a high failure/reoperation rate. The deconditioning and inability to do high impact exercise that often accompanies a POP diagnosis can also lead many women to experience health and mental health issues. There’s a reason it is called the silent epidemic. Don’t act like it’s just a few women who are impacted - it is millions.

APOPS stance is 50% prevalence is a comparatively accurate stat considering childbirth is the leading POP cause, menopause is the 2nd leading POP cause, and a multitude of lifestyle, behavioral, and comorbid conditions compound risk of POP. As of July 2019, there are approximately 3.9 billion women in the world. Considering 50% of these women will likely experience pelvic organ prolapse at some point in their lives, there is zero doubt pelvic organ prolapse is of pandemic prevalence

https://www.pelvicorganprolapsesupport.org/how-common-is-pelvic-organ-prolapse

Trust me. I've been there. It's devastating to get diagnosed with prolapse of every compartment, but that doesn't change the fact that most women who have given birth whether by CS or vaginal delivery have prolapse. It's just that they may not be aware and can go all the way through menopause until they experience symptoms. I'm so jealous and wish that were the case for me, but my suffering doesn't change the fact that most women are living blissfully unaware of their stage 1 prolapse.

I’m sorry for your experience. But where is your evidence that most women are blissfully unaware? Or is that some dismissive crap a doctor told you to make you feel like you were uniquely afflicted.

Thank you. Its a blindsiding experience because OBs generally don't warn or educate you about this. It wasn't mentioned in my birth class. Look up this paper in PubMed. "The distribution of pelvic organ support in a population of female subjects seen for routine gynecologic health care". There are other papers too studying prolapse in the general population.

I think for other women they might not realize their symptoms are prolapse related. They notice they need a bigger tampon or it slides down, but don't know why.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

It must be nice to not have prolapse and to act like the fact that your uterus, bladder, Or rectum are falling out of your body is NBD just because “some”
People are asymptomstic. Many are not and can have a whole range of other issues ranging from urinary leaking to an inability to fully evacuate stool. For most women with POP, discovering it is a horrifying experience. The Association of Pelvic Organ Prolapse says that childbirth is the leading POP cause and that half of women will get it in their lifetime. PT cannot reverse POP, though it can help with symptoms. But even surgery does not routinely fix all symptoms and it has a high failure/reoperation rate. The deconditioning and inability to do high impact exercise that often accompanies a POP diagnosis can also lead many women to experience health and mental health issues. There’s a reason it is called the silent epidemic. Don’t act like it’s just a few women who are impacted - it is millions.

APOPS stance is 50% prevalence is a comparatively accurate stat considering childbirth is the leading POP cause, menopause is the 2nd leading POP cause, and a multitude of lifestyle, behavioral, and comorbid conditions compound risk of POP. As of July 2019, there are approximately 3.9 billion women in the world. Considering 50% of these women will likely experience pelvic organ prolapse at some point in their lives, there is zero doubt pelvic organ prolapse is of pandemic prevalence

https://www.pelvicorganprolapsesupport.org/how-common-is-pelvic-organ-prolapse

Trust me. I've been there. It's devastating to get diagnosed with prolapse of every compartment, but that doesn't change the fact that most women who have given birth whether by CS or vaginal delivery have prolapse. It's just that they may not be aware and can go all the way through menopause until they experience symptoms. I'm so jealous and wish that were the case for me, but my suffering doesn't change the fact that most women are living blissfully unaware of their stage 1 prolapse.

I’m sorry for your experience. But where is your evidence that most women are blissfully unaware? Or is that some dismissive crap a doctor told you to make you feel like you were uniquely afflicted.

Thank you. Its a blindsiding experience because OBs generally don't warn or educate you about this. It wasn't mentioned in my birth class. Look up this paper in PubMed. "The distribution of pelvic organ support in a population of female subjects seen for routine gynecologic health care". There are other papers too studying prolapse in the general population.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

It must be nice to not have prolapse and to act like the fact that your uterus, bladder, Or rectum are falling out of your body is NBD just because “some”
People are asymptomstic. Many are not and can have a whole range of other issues ranging from urinary leaking to an inability to fully evacuate stool. For most women with POP, discovering it is a horrifying experience. The Association of Pelvic Organ Prolapse says that childbirth is the leading POP cause and that half of women will get it in their lifetime. PT cannot reverse POP, though it can help with symptoms. But even surgery does not routinely fix all symptoms and it has a high failure/reoperation rate. The deconditioning and inability to do high impact exercise that often accompanies a POP diagnosis can also lead many women to experience health and mental health issues. There’s a reason it is called the silent epidemic. Don’t act like it’s just a few women who are impacted - it is millions.

APOPS stance is 50% prevalence is a comparatively accurate stat considering childbirth is the leading POP cause, menopause is the 2nd leading POP cause, and a multitude of lifestyle, behavioral, and comorbid conditions compound risk of POP. As of July 2019, there are approximately 3.9 billion women in the world. Considering 50% of these women will likely experience pelvic organ prolapse at some point in their lives, there is zero doubt pelvic organ prolapse is of pandemic prevalence

https://www.pelvicorganprolapsesupport.org/how-common-is-pelvic-organ-prolapse

Trust me. I've been there. It's devastating to get diagnosed with prolapse of every compartment, but that doesn't change the fact that most women who have given birth whether by CS or vaginal delivery have prolapse. It's just that they may not be aware and can go all the way through menopause until they experience symptoms. I'm so jealous and wish that were the case for me, but my suffering doesn't change the fact that most women are living blissfully unaware of their stage 1 prolapse.

I’m sorry for your experience. But where is your evidence that most women are blissfully unaware? Or is that some dismissive crap a doctor told you to make you feel like you were uniquely afflicted.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

It must be nice to not have prolapse and to act like the fact that your uterus, bladder, Or rectum are falling out of your body is NBD just because “some”
People are asymptomstic. Many are not and can have a whole range of other issues ranging from urinary leaking to an inability to fully evacuate stool. For most women with POP, discovering it is a horrifying experience. The Association of Pelvic Organ Prolapse says that childbirth is the leading POP cause and that half of women will get it in their lifetime. PT cannot reverse POP, though it can help with symptoms. But even surgery does not routinely fix all symptoms and it has a high failure/reoperation rate. The deconditioning and inability to do high impact exercise that often accompanies a POP diagnosis can also lead many women to experience health and mental health issues. There’s a reason it is called the silent epidemic. Don’t act like it’s just a few women who are impacted - it is millions.

APOPS stance is 50% prevalence is a comparatively accurate stat considering childbirth is the leading POP cause, menopause is the 2nd leading POP cause, and a multitude of lifestyle, behavioral, and comorbid conditions compound risk of POP. As of July 2019, there are approximately 3.9 billion women in the world. Considering 50% of these women will likely experience pelvic organ prolapse at some point in their lives, there is zero doubt pelvic organ prolapse is of pandemic prevalence

https://www.pelvicorganprolapsesupport.org/how-common-is-pelvic-organ-prolapse

Trust me. I've been there. It's devastating to get diagnosed with prolapse of every compartment, but that doesn't change the fact that most women who have given birth whether by CS or vaginal delivery have prolapse. It's just that they may not be aware and can go all the way through menopause until they experience symptoms. I'm so jealous and wish that were the case for me, but my suffering doesn't change the fact that most women are living blissfully unaware of their stage 1 prolapse.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

It must be nice to not have prolapse and to act like the fact that your uterus, bladder, Or rectum are falling out of your body is NBD just because “some”
People are asymptomstic. Many are not and can have a whole range of other issues ranging from urinary leaking to an inability to fully evacuate stool. For most women with POP, discovering it is a horrifying experience. The Association of Pelvic Organ Prolapse says that childbirth is the leading POP cause and that half of women will get it in their lifetime. PT cannot reverse POP, though it can help with symptoms. But even surgery does not routinely fix all symptoms and it has a high failure/reoperation rate. The deconditioning and inability to do high impact exercise that often accompanies a POP diagnosis can also lead many women to experience health and mental health issues. There’s a reason it is called the silent epidemic. Don’t act like it’s just a few women who are impacted - it is millions.

APOPS stance is 50% prevalence is a comparatively accurate stat considering childbirth is the leading POP cause, menopause is the 2nd leading POP cause, and a multitude of lifestyle, behavioral, and comorbid conditions compound risk of POP. As of July 2019, there are approximately 3.9 billion women in the world. Considering 50% of these women will likely experience pelvic organ prolapse at some point in their lives, there is zero doubt pelvic organ prolapse is of pandemic prevalence

https://www.pelvicorganprolapsesupport.org/how-common-is-pelvic-organ-prolapse

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

PP here. I didn't say 3% have prolapse only that 3% need surgical intervention need prolapse. Haven't prolapse in itself isn't the end of the world as it can oftentimes be asymptomatic. It's having severe prolapse that impacts your quality of life, doesn't respond to PT, and requires surgery that's life altering.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

These are made up numbers. If 3.3 million Us women have prolapse that’s way more than 3 percent.

Anonymous wrote:NP. I've seen a lot of back and forth about CS vs vaginal birth on this board not just this thread. I'm not sure it's the correct debate. At the end of the day, vaginal delivery is the safest option for 97% women. They may have prolapse or pelvic floor dysfunction after, but of a mild version that time and PT will help. On the other hand, the 3% will suffer such severe pelvic floor injury that the risks of a CS may have been preferable. A very small segment of the population will need prolapse repair and those are the women with the severe injuries. I wish there were an algorithm to predict exactly who will fall into this unfortunate category, but there isn't. We can't CS 97 healthy women to save 3 women. I do wish though that people like the Pp wouldn't be so haughty and condescending. Just because you had a healthy normal vaginal delivery doesn't mean that everyone will. The suffering of these women with severe injuries is very real and it's not acceptable to talk about it because it makes you seem ungrateful for your child.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Actually pelvic organ prolapse and pelvic floor injuries are rarely, if ever, discussed in childbirth preparation courses and books. It is a dirty secret of women’s health and only in the last few years is it getting more attention. Many gynecologists also don’t even routinely look for it or know how to appropriately assess for prolapse (hint: in a standing position, not lithotomy).

I’m still waiting for your citation how dangerous C sections are. Also, are you talking scheduled C section or emergent C section done when the plan was for vaginal deliver and the mom is in labor. Those are two very different scenarios and comparing the mortality rates is like mixing apples and oranges.

Use PubMed, no one has to do your research for you. You can move your goalposts all you want for emergent vs schedule, the dead women are the ones who had c-sections. Especially the WOC.

I’m sorry your doctor didn’t discuss prolapse with you. It was on the list of complications on the informed consent form for both vaginal and c-section delivery, which I insisted my doctor review point by point (and suggest everyone else should too).