Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well I do believe in more than just myself and what's face value. Whether I yr a God I believe in I don't know. I believe in the power of nature, destiny, faith, energy. I believe you can pray and change situations through power of prayer. But I don't know that I call it God. I don't go to Church and I most certainly don't have faith in organized religion AKA Roman Catholic Church. I also don't believe God really cares if I believe in God. I believe that faith is not to be discussed nor shared. It's a private thing altogether but it's soooooo much better to believe in something other than nothing. It's so obvious that there is something inexplicable that is with all of us. Just waking up each day and looking around you is proof there is power and mystery that exists we cannot fathom. That is what I believe. Some people call it God, Allah, Christ, Wicca, whatever that is it's the same. But I don't know it's really or just God as traditionally defined. And ironically, to talk about it for me, is to completely destroy the meaningfulness of that faith because it's so personal. I think we all should have something we believe in but not call it God.

Do you consider yourself a deist?

Also, we have to be fair and ask why you believe those things, especially regarding prayer.

Seems like pp is talking about their beliefs, in much the way that a follower of a particular religion would, e.g., "It's so obvious..." "Looking around you is proof..." etc. The difference is that pp is not a part of an established religion with its own set of rules for people to believe and follow. PP has set up their own rules/parameters, believes them and simply assumes that they are real.

Yes - I'm the OP. I don't believe in organized religion and organized traditions around religion. I believe that there is an entity of higher power - some call God. But that's a personal belief. Some choose not to believe in God but what I'm suggesting is that I think life is ultimately easier if you do believe in anything other than yourself cause you know, shit happens and how are you gonna get through that? I also refer to evidence to the natural world around us - there's so much mystery and magic all around us every moment of every day - that it's hard to believe that it's simply without grand design or just there. However, that belief and faith is different than what the Roman Catholic Church or any religious tradition ascribes to - sin, forgiveness, worship, all that to me is where it has to be personal not automatic or mandatory.

I guess we need to ask again: WHY do you believe this?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

You treat every decision in your life like a criminal trial? Are you serious?

yeah, I have to agree with this. Some people just seem to have a God "gene." They are susceptible to supernatural beliefs and I think that's normal. It goes all the way back to the beginning of humankind. On the other hand, some people are very fact-based on everything they do, like that pp.

Neither the laws nor the legal system of the United States don’t have any relevance to personal decisions about religious beliefs. The legal system doesn’t exist in the slightest to prove or disprove a person’s religious choice. Pp is making no sense.

No sorry you are wrong.

You use evidence, logic and facts to form all your beliefs. Except for one: the religion you believe in.

Name one other significant thing you believe based on the same criteria as your religion.

art, music, philosophy -- all matters of personal taste. Facts are good for the legal system, but that's about it. Indeed, a recent example for me I made a big purchase. The facts were really against it, but I went with my heart. Happy I did. See the college forum for example where some people say the Return on Investment for that school is awful dont do it. And others, with a different value system, say you'll get a good education there and isn't that what college is all about? Stop being so close minded. And p.s. --mI understand you, as I tend atheist myself.

art, music, philosophy -- all matters of personal taste.

Indeed, a recent example for me I made a big purchase. The facts were really against it, but I went with my heart.

Stop being so close minded. And p.s. --mI understand you, as I tend atheist myself

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

You treat every decision in your life like a criminal trial? Are you serious?

yeah, I have to agree with this. Some people just seem to have a God "gene." They are susceptible to supernatural beliefs and I think that's normal. It goes all the way back to the beginning of humankind. On the other hand, some people are very fact-based on everything they do, like that pp.

Neither the laws nor the legal system of the United States don’t have any relevance to personal decisions about religious beliefs. The legal system doesn’t exist in the slightest to prove or disprove a person’s religious choice. Pp is making no sense.

No sorry you are wrong.

You use evidence, logic and facts to form all your beliefs. Except for one: the religion you believe in.

Name one other significant thing you believe based on the same criteria as your religion.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

You treat every decision in your life like a criminal trial? Are you serious?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

You treat every decision in your life like a criminal trial? Are you serious?

yeah, I have to agree with this. Some people just seem to have a God "gene." They are susceptible to supernatural beliefs and I think that's normal. It goes all the way back to the beginning of humankind. On the other hand, some people are very fact-based on everything they do, like that pp.

Neither the laws nor the legal system of the United States don’t have any relevance to personal decisions about religious beliefs. The legal system doesn’t exist in the slightest to prove or disprove a person’s religious choice. Pp is making no sense.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

You treat every decision in your life like a criminal trial? Are you serious?

yeah, I have to agree with this. Some people just seem to have a God "gene." They are susceptible to supernatural beliefs and I think that's normal. It goes all the way back to the beginning of humankind. On the other hand, some people are very fact-based on everything they do, like that pp.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

You treat every decision in your life like a criminal trial? Are you serious?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Ahhh, no that is decidedly NOT it. And you don't make any other decisions on your beliefs that way - you medical beliefs, laws, guilt or innocence - you look at the facts and evidence and decide. It's not some inherent "truth" whether someone is innocent or guilty. There's a trial, and the jury decides, and when there is a preponderance of evidence those trials are often unanimous.

It's the same standard you apply in those cases, and in the case of religion, the same you apply to all the other gods and supernatural things you DON'T believe in.

Why not apply that same simple standard to your god?

Anonymous wrote:You don't need a reason to believe or not believe. If a person doesn't believe, then they just don't - it's not a choice. It's just the way your brain perceives reality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well I do believe in more than just myself and what's face value. Whether I yr a God I believe in I don't know. I believe in the power of nature, destiny, faith, energy. I believe you can pray and change situations through power of prayer. But I don't know that I call it God. I don't go to Church and I most certainly don't have faith in organized religion AKA Roman Catholic Church. I also don't believe God really cares if I believe in God. I believe that faith is not to be discussed nor shared. It's a private thing altogether but it's soooooo much better to believe in something other than nothing. It's so obvious that there is something inexplicable that is with all of us. Just waking up each day and looking around you is proof there is power and mystery that exists we cannot fathom. That is what I believe. Some people call it God, Allah, Christ, Wicca, whatever that is it's the same. But I don't know it's really or just God as traditionally defined. And ironically, to talk about it for me, is to completely destroy the meaningfulness of that faith because it's so personal. I think we all should have something we believe in but not call it God.

Do you consider yourself a deist?

Also, we have to be fair and ask why you believe those things, especially regarding prayer.

Seems like pp is talking about their beliefs, in much the way that a follower of a particular religion would, e.g., "It's so obvious..." "Looking around you is proof..." etc. The difference is that pp is not a part of an established religion with its own set of rules for people to believe and follow. PP has set up their own rules/parameters, believes them and simply assumes that they are real.

Yes - I'm the OP. I don't believe in organized religion and organized traditions around religion. I believe that there is an entity of higher power - some call God. But that's a personal belief. Some choose not to believe in God but what I'm suggesting is that I think life is ultimately easier if you do believe in anything other than yourself cause you know, shit happens and how are you gonna get through that? I also refer to evidence to the natural world around us - there's so much mystery and magic all around us every moment of every day - that it's hard to believe that it's simply without grand design or just there. However, that belief and faith is different than what the Roman Catholic Church or any religious tradition ascribes to - sin, forgiveness, worship, all that to me is where it has to be personal not automatic or mandatory.

I guess we need to ask again: WHY do you believe this?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well I do believe in more than just myself and what's face value. Whether I yr a God I believe in I don't know. I believe in the power of nature, destiny, faith, energy. I believe you can pray and change situations through power of prayer. But I don't know that I call it God. I don't go to Church and I most certainly don't have faith in organized religion AKA Roman Catholic Church. I also don't believe God really cares if I believe in God. I believe that faith is not to be discussed nor shared. It's a private thing altogether but it's soooooo much better to believe in something other than nothing. It's so obvious that there is something inexplicable that is with all of us. Just waking up each day and looking around you is proof there is power and mystery that exists we cannot fathom. That is what I believe. Some people call it God, Allah, Christ, Wicca, whatever that is it's the same. But I don't know it's really or just God as traditionally defined. And ironically, to talk about it for me, is to completely destroy the meaningfulness of that faith because it's so personal. I think we all should have something we believe in but not call it God.

Do you consider yourself a deist?

Also, we have to be fair and ask why you believe those things, especially regarding prayer.

Seems like pp is talking about their beliefs, in much the way that a follower of a particular religion would, e.g., "It's so obvious..." "Looking around you is proof..." etc. The difference is that pp is not a part of an established religion with its own set of rules for people to believe and follow. PP has set up their own rules/parameters, believes them and simply assumes that they are real.

Yes - I'm the OP. I don't believe in organized religion and organized traditions around religion. I believe that there is an entity of higher power - some call God. But that's a personal belief. Some choose not to believe in God but what I'm suggesting is that I think life is ultimately easier if you do believe in anything other than yourself cause you know, shit happens and how are you gonna get through that? I also refer to evidence to the natural world around us - there's so much mystery and magic all around us every moment of every day - that it's hard to believe that it's simply without grand design or just there. However, that belief and faith is different than what the Roman Catholic Church or any religious tradition ascribes to - sin, forgiveness, worship, all that to me is where it has to be personal not automatic or mandatory.

I guess we need to ask again: WHY do you believe this?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well I do believe in more than just myself and what's face value. Whether I yr a God I believe in I don't know. I believe in the power of nature, destiny, faith, energy. I believe you can pray and change situations through power of prayer. But I don't know that I call it God. I don't go to Church and I most certainly don't have faith in organized religion AKA Roman Catholic Church. I also don't believe God really cares if I believe in God. I believe that faith is not to be discussed nor shared. It's a private thing altogether but it's soooooo much better to believe in something other than nothing. It's so obvious that there is something inexplicable that is with all of us. Just waking up each day and looking around you is proof there is power and mystery that exists we cannot fathom. That is what I believe. Some people call it God, Allah, Christ, Wicca, whatever that is it's the same. But I don't know it's really or just God as traditionally defined. And ironically, to talk about it for me, is to completely destroy the meaningfulness of that faith because it's so personal. I think we all should have something we believe in but not call it God.

Do you consider yourself a deist?

Also, we have to be fair and ask why you believe those things, especially regarding prayer.

Seems like pp is talking about their beliefs, in much the way that a follower of a particular religion would, e.g., "It's so obvious..." "Looking around you is proof..." etc. The difference is that pp is not a part of an established religion with its own set of rules for people to believe and follow. PP has set up their own rules/parameters, believes them and simply assumes that they are real.

Yes - I'm the OP. I don't believe in organized religion and organized traditions around religion. I believe that there is an entity of higher power - some call God. But that's a personal belief. Some choose not to believe in God but what I'm suggesting is that I think life is ultimately easier if you do believe in anything other than yourself cause you know, shit happens and how are you gonna get through that? I also refer to evidence to the natural world around us - there's so much mystery and magic all around us every moment of every day - that it's hard to believe that it's simply without grand design or just there. However, that belief and faith is different than what the Roman Catholic Church or any religious tradition ascribes to - sin, forgiveness, worship, all that to me is where it has to be personal not automatic or mandatory.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well I do believe in more than just myself and what's face value. Whether I yr a God I believe in I don't know. I believe in the power of nature, destiny, faith, energy. I believe you can pray and change situations through power of prayer. But I don't know that I call it God. I don't go to Church and I most certainly don't have faith in organized religion AKA Roman Catholic Church. I also don't believe God really cares if I believe in God. I believe that faith is not to be discussed nor shared. It's a private thing altogether but it's soooooo much better to believe in something other than nothing. It's so obvious that there is something inexplicable that is with all of us. Just waking up each day and looking around you is proof there is power and mystery that exists we cannot fathom. That is what I believe. Some people call it God, Allah, Christ, Wicca, whatever that is it's the same. But I don't know it's really or just God as traditionally defined. And ironically, to talk about it for me, is to completely destroy the meaningfulness of that faith because it's so personal. I think we all should have something we believe in but not call it God.

Do you consider yourself a deist?

Also, we have to be fair and ask why you believe those things, especially regarding prayer.

Seems like pp is talking about their beliefs, in much the way that a follower of a particular religion would, e.g., "It's so obvious..." "Looking around you is proof..." etc. The difference is that pp is not a part of an established religion with its own set of rules for people to believe and follow. PP has set up their own rules/parameters, believes them and simply assumes that they are real.

Yes - I'm the OP. I don't believe in organized religion and organized traditions around religion. I believe that there is an entity of higher power - some call God. But that's a personal belief. Some choose not to believe in God but what I'm suggesting is that I think life is ultimately easier if you do believe in anything other than yourself cause you know, shit happens and how are you gonna get through that? I also refer to evidence to the natural world around us - there's so much mystery and magic all around us every moment of every day - that it's hard to believe that it's simply without grand design or just there. However, that belief and faith is different than what the Roman Catholic Church or any religious tradition ascribes to - sin, forgiveness, worship, all that to me is where it has to be personal not automatic or mandatory.