Anonymous
09/04/2024 13:08
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Retired major general writes scathing takedown of Trump and his desecration of ANC.
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
This is a very bias anti Republican pro liberal person not just some general
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/stevenlepper_well-yes-there-was-that-activity-6979915947956436992-8Dli?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android
So you disagree with the retired major general that this was a blatant act of desecration? He’s not wrong just because he’s not a right wing loon, because I’d like to point out that McCain’s son is a right winger and he agrees that this was a step too far.
So you should be wondering: how many other potential Trump voters might be horrified by your party’s cheapening of the deaths of our war dead? This issue will have many washing their hands of the GOP.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:56
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Retired major general writes scathing takedown of Trump and his desecration of ANC.
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
This is a very bias anti Republican pro liberal person not just some general
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/stevenlepper_well-yes-there-was-that-activity-6979915947956436992-8Dli?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android
anti-R? I thought all military people were conservatives?
Have you ever heard of #nevertrumpers? Many of them were life long Rs, unlike Trump who used to be a Dem.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:54
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:It was always designed to be political.
Of course it was. Why else would Trump bring his campaign staff and a phalanx of photographers and vieographers? To make a slick commercial, that's why. He can never do anything that seems caring without recoding it for the world to see.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:52
Subject: Re:Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I'm just joining now...
But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them.
Highly skeptical that you're "just joining now" (in fact, I think some of you are trolls and are sockpuppeting). I have a question for YOU: what is so special about this group of Gold Star families? Why should they be singled out for attention and not any other group of families of war dead?
OK, well, I guess you can ask Jeff to verify I haven't posted on this thread before if it matters to you.
I am not sure why you are answering a question with a question. My husband has served in combat under multiple administrations, and if he had been killed in combat, God forbid, I don't know if I would have been receptive to outreach from the CIC at the time - but I would certainly prefer it be proffered than not proffered. It is impossible to predict how families will react, which is why notification is such a tremendous duty, but it is the right thing to do to offer full ceremony, ritual and regard to Gold Star families. If it is rebuffed, it's rebuffed-but it seems a simple thing to do. I am wondering why it hasn't been done? It certainly is causing further division and pain.
I'm the PP you are responding to. I answered a question with a question because I STILL don't understand what is so special about this specific group of Gold Star families--given the enormity of loss represented at ANC. But I will try to answer your questions on the assumption that they are sincere. You asked: "But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them."
I can't speak for the Biden administration, but I'm assuming they're not reaching out to the families because it would be a damned if you do/damned if you don't situation. Since the incident occurred, it has become highly politicized and is a frequent line of attack against the Biden administration. Some of the relatives were openly hostile to Biden and criticized him publicly 3 years ago after Biden met with the families at Dover when the caskets were brought back. A subset of the families spoke at the recent RNC and, working with the Trump Campaign, have released a statement and videos which criticize Biden and Harris. The relatives are not looking for "comfort" from the Biden administration as you suggest. Some of them hold Biden personally culpable for their loved ones' deaths. You can be sure that if Biden met with them, even if privately, he would not be graciously received and every word of the interaction would be used against him. They've already made up their minds about what happened and who's at fault and there's nothing Biden or Harris can do or say to change that. Finally, Biden/Harris are not "just ignoring them"--the WH has said that B/H were not invited (https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/biden-harris-werent-invited-arlington-abbey-gate-trump-rcna169154).
Biden did meet with them though. Not all the families but I’m sure all would have been invited. They were unhappy with the meeting (they accused him of looking at his watch). But it most certainly happened.
Yes, he met with those of them that would meet with him (some refused) at Dover three years ago when the caskets came in and he was, as you say, criticized for looking at his watch, among other things. The issue is that some PPs are saying that Biden should have met with the families again in 2024, on the 3rd year anniversary.
I think the families' "issue" (besides their fallen children) is the sense that this administration has brushed their children's deaths under a rug. When they say the administration needs to "say their names" it is similar to BLM or any other anguished cry that a person in a position of political authority acknowledge a situation or events. Equally obvious is that the Biden (and now future Harris administration) would like as little attention paid to the withdrawal and Abbey Gate as possible. Let's talk about what we are really talking about, on both sides of this 'ceremonial observance' controversy.
But Biden does “say their names” and is very caring of our troops. This has been evident for decades.
This is not a “both sides” issue.
Trump, as usual, took our country to a new low by breaking decorum and politicizing ANC. He’s a psychopath and doesn’t care about anyone but himself.
We are talking about this specific incident, a massacre during the withdrawal from Afghanistan. There is disagreement about how his administration has responded to critique of that, and to the families of the fallen during that incident. Not his attitude overall to the military.
And you don't think that some of the families who are in the tank for Trump, had it in for Biden from the outset and have been fomenting that "disagreement" for almost 3 years now?
Like, from before their kids died? You think they have just seized their kids death as an opportunity to 'take on Biden'. Like, a silver lining? Weird. No, I think they hated the sloppy withdrawal, blame Biden as Commander in Chief for their children's death when they were literally preparing a homecoming, and want to call attention to his mishandling of the withdrawal at every opportunity. I think any parent would behave this way. You may not agree that Biden is at fault, but since they feel that way, their behavior is very understandable.
When troops are drawn down to a scant 2,500 and 5,000 taliban fighters were released by Trump, how exactly is there going to be a clean withdrawal? Please name a similar instance where this "clean withdrawal" has occurred.
2,500 is enough to provide security for a measured withdrawal. if it wasn't thought to be enough, Biden could have put more troops in. My husband withdrew from Afghanistan quite a few times, and was back what felt like the next week because the plan changed. The military is flexible like that. This withdrawal was botched and both American servicemembers and Afghans died in the chaos. The buck stops with the administration overseeing it
Do you actually read the information out there? No, Biden could not have put more troops in. Trump agreed with withdraw troops and he explicitly agreed that the US would not deploy any more troops to Afghanistan. So, he forced the Afghan government to release 5K Taliban soldiers. Then he cut our forces down to 2500. So, he deliberately outnumbered the US troops. He had them release twice as many soldiers as he left on the ground. And that didn't include any Taliban that were not imprisoned. So the troops left were outnumbered at least 4:1. Then Trump agreed to a deadline of May 1, which was 3.5 months after Biden was inaugurated. And he left no plans for the withdrawal. So, Biden had 3.5 months to establish and implement a planned withdrawal. Trump had 11 months from February 2020 until January 2021 and he deliberately made no plans for the withdrawal, throwing an entirely chaotic and weak situation for Biden to pick up in the last week of January. He also announced the withdrawal so that the Taliban could go from city to city and plan to assault any remaining American civilians or US troops left in each city. But he made no plans to withdraw civilians, so military personnel had to stay in each city to round up civilians and get them out before the deadline. While still securing each city and guarding their route to safety.
As for the military changing, it is easier to change plans when there are 13K forces in the region. It is much harder to change plans when every soldier that is withdrawn cannot return by international agreement. So, once a plan is made, it could not be walked back or changed, regardless of how flexible the staff was. That was what Trump promised.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:50
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
For the people defending Trump here...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/09/04/trump-misled-gold-star-families-troop-deaths-afghanistan/
Trump has a basis for citing 18 months without a death from hostile action in Afghanistan. The period of relative quiet began with his deal with the Taliban. A case could be made that the seeds of the collapse of the Afghan government — and the chaotic withdrawal of Americans that accompanied it — stemmed from the same deal.
But Trump errs in suggesting — as in the TikTok with the Gold Star families gathered in Arlington — that those 18 months took place entirely during his presidency. He earns Two Pinocchios.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/09/04/trump-misled-gold-star-families-troop-deaths-afghanistan/
Trump has a basis for citing 18 months without a death from hostile action in Afghanistan. The period of relative quiet began with his deal with the Taliban. A case could be made that the seeds of the collapse of the Afghan government — and the chaotic withdrawal of Americans that accompanied it — stemmed from the same deal.
But Trump errs in suggesting — as in the TikTok with the Gold Star families gathered in Arlington — that those 18 months took place entirely during his presidency. He earns Two Pinocchios.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:47
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Retired major general writes scathing takedown of Trump and his desecration of ANC.
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
This is a very bias anti Republican pro liberal person not just some general
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/stevenlepper_well-yes-there-was-that-activity-6979915947956436992-8Dli?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android
Yes. He’s very smart. Thank you for confirming
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:41
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Retired major general writes scathing takedown of Trump and his desecration of ANC.
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
This is a very bias anti Republican pro liberal person not just some general
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/stevenlepper_well-yes-there-was-that-activity-6979915947956436992-8Dli?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:32
Subject: Re:Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I'm just joining now...
But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them.
Highly skeptical that you're "just joining now" (in fact, I think some of you are trolls and are sockpuppeting). I have a question for YOU: what is so special about this group of Gold Star families? Why should they be singled out for attention and not any other group of families of war dead?
OK, well, I guess you can ask Jeff to verify I haven't posted on this thread before if it matters to you.
I am not sure why you are answering a question with a question. My husband has served in combat under multiple administrations, and if he had been killed in combat, God forbid, I don't know if I would have been receptive to outreach from the CIC at the time - but I would certainly prefer it be proffered than not proffered. It is impossible to predict how families will react, which is why notification is such a tremendous duty, but it is the right thing to do to offer full ceremony, ritual and regard to Gold Star families. If it is rebuffed, it's rebuffed-but it seems a simple thing to do. I am wondering why it hasn't been done? It certainly is causing further division and pain.
I'm the PP you are responding to. I answered a question with a question because I STILL don't understand what is so special about this specific group of Gold Star families--given the enormity of loss represented at ANC. But I will try to answer your questions on the assumption that they are sincere. You asked: "But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them."
I can't speak for the Biden administration, but I'm assuming they're not reaching out to the families because it would be a damned if you do/damned if you don't situation. Since the incident occurred, it has become highly politicized and is a frequent line of attack against the Biden administration. Some of the relatives were openly hostile to Biden and criticized him publicly 3 years ago after Biden met with the families at Dover when the caskets were brought back. A subset of the families spoke at the recent RNC and, working with the Trump Campaign, have released a statement and videos which criticize Biden and Harris. The relatives are not looking for "comfort" from the Biden administration as you suggest. Some of them hold Biden personally culpable for their loved ones' deaths. You can be sure that if Biden met with them, even if privately, he would not be graciously received and every word of the interaction would be used against him. They've already made up their minds about what happened and who's at fault and there's nothing Biden or Harris can do or say to change that. Finally, Biden/Harris are not "just ignoring them"--the WH has said that B/H were not invited (https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/biden-harris-werent-invited-arlington-abbey-gate-trump-rcna169154).
Biden did meet with them though. Not all the families but I’m sure all would have been invited. They were unhappy with the meeting (they accused him of looking at his watch). But it most certainly happened.
Yes, he met with those of them that would meet with him (some refused) at Dover three years ago when the caskets came in and he was, as you say, criticized for looking at his watch, among other things. The issue is that some PPs are saying that Biden should have met with the families again in 2024, on the 3rd year anniversary.
I think the families' "issue" (besides their fallen children) is the sense that this administration has brushed their children's deaths under a rug. When they say the administration needs to "say their names" it is similar to BLM or any other anguished cry that a person in a position of political authority acknowledge a situation or events. Equally obvious is that the Biden (and now future Harris administration) would like as little attention paid to the withdrawal and Abbey Gate as possible. Let's talk about what we are really talking about, on both sides of this 'ceremonial observance' controversy.
But Biden does “say their names” and is very caring of our troops. This has been evident for decades.
This is not a “both sides” issue.
Trump, as usual, took our country to a new low by breaking decorum and politicizing ANC. He’s a psychopath and doesn’t care about anyone but himself.
We are talking about this specific incident, a massacre during the withdrawal from Afghanistan. There is disagreement about how his administration has responded to critique of that, and to the families of the fallen during that incident. Not his attitude overall to the military.
And you don't think that some of the families who are in the tank for Trump, had it in for Biden from the outset and have been fomenting that "disagreement" for almost 3 years now?
Like, from before their kids died? You think they have just seized their kids death as an opportunity to 'take on Biden'. Like, a silver lining? Weird. No, I think they hated the sloppy withdrawal, blame Biden as Commander in Chief for their children's death when they were literally preparing a homecoming, and want to call attention to his mishandling of the withdrawal at every opportunity. I think any parent would behave this way. You may not agree that Biden is at fault, but since they feel that way, their behavior is very understandable.
When troops are drawn down to a scant 2,500 and 5,000 taliban fighters were released by Trump, how exactly is there going to be a clean withdrawal? Please name a similar instance where this "clean withdrawal" has occurred.
2,500 is enough to provide security for a measured withdrawal. if it wasn't thought to be enough, Biden could have put more troops in. My husband withdrew from Afghanistan quite a few times, and was back what felt like the next week because the plan changed. The military is flexible like that. This withdrawal was botched and both American servicemembers and Afghans died in the chaos. The buck stops with the administration overseeing it
Anonymous
09/04/2024 12:23
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:It was always designed to be political. That was the only point. To try and help Trump connect back up to military during the campaign. The same Families in the photos - they had family members on stage at the Republican Convention in June.
The problem is that no one thought to check if political events could be held at Arlington. They cannot. Stupid to even think that they could be, but no one thinks Trump is bright. Typical Trump though - when informed of the rules they ignored them and assaulted a Cemetary staff member assigned to escort Trump’s group. What fun. Thumbs up for photos everyone.
Neither Biden nor Harris were present. It was an illegal political event at Arlington. There are gravestones in the pictures of soldiers who were not involved at all. Thumbs up. Big smiles.
Biden was present when the coffins were flown into Dover. Trump went to Dover 4 times in 4 years. The first time he was yelled at by the father of the deceased who was killed while on a stupid mission in Yemen. It was one that Obama had rejected as too risky. But, Trump was newly elected and wanted to kill someone. So - while at a dinner, which included Bannon and Jared K, Trump decided it would be fun to go forward with the mission Obama rejected. About 30 died including 10 women and kids. In addition to the one US soldier killed 4 were wounded. Trump didn’t go back to Dover for 2 years.
And no Trumper ever talks about this, or Trump's glaring disrespect for veterans and those killed in combat.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 10:02
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
It was always designed to be political. That was the only point. To try and help Trump connect back up to military during the campaign. The same Families in the photos - they had family members on stage at the Republican Convention in June.
The problem is that no one thought to check if political events could be held at Arlington. They cannot. Stupid to even think that they could be, but no one thinks Trump is bright. Typical Trump though - when informed of the rules they ignored them and assaulted a Cemetary staff member assigned to escort Trump’s group. What fun. Thumbs up for photos everyone.
Neither Biden nor Harris were present. It was an illegal political event at Arlington. There are gravestones in the pictures of soldiers who were not involved at all. Thumbs up. Big smiles.
Biden was present when the coffins were flown into Dover. Trump went to Dover 4 times in 4 years. The first time he was yelled at by the father of the deceased who was killed while on a stupid mission in Yemen. It was one that Obama had rejected as too risky. But, Trump was newly elected and wanted to kill someone. So - while at a dinner, which included Bannon and Jared K, Trump decided it would be fun to go forward with the mission Obama rejected. About 30 died including 10 women and kids. In addition to the one US soldier killed 4 were wounded. Trump didn’t go back to Dover for 2 years.
The problem is that no one thought to check if political events could be held at Arlington. They cannot. Stupid to even think that they could be, but no one thinks Trump is bright. Typical Trump though - when informed of the rules they ignored them and assaulted a Cemetary staff member assigned to escort Trump’s group. What fun. Thumbs up for photos everyone.
Neither Biden nor Harris were present. It was an illegal political event at Arlington. There are gravestones in the pictures of soldiers who were not involved at all. Thumbs up. Big smiles.
Biden was present when the coffins were flown into Dover. Trump went to Dover 4 times in 4 years. The first time he was yelled at by the father of the deceased who was killed while on a stupid mission in Yemen. It was one that Obama had rejected as too risky. But, Trump was newly elected and wanted to kill someone. So - while at a dinner, which included Bannon and Jared K, Trump decided it would be fun to go forward with the mission Obama rejected. About 30 died including 10 women and kids. In addition to the one US soldier killed 4 were wounded. Trump didn’t go back to Dover for 2 years.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 09:30
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Retired major general writes scathing takedown of Trump and his desecration of ANC.
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
"The men and women who rest at Arlington fought for ideals far greater than any political campaign. Instead of reminding us that their sacrifices should unite us as a nation, Trump chose to further divide our country by using their memory as a tool in his ongoing political battles."
Anonymous
09/04/2024 08:59
Subject: Re:Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I'm just joining now...
But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them.
Highly skeptical that you're "just joining now" (in fact, I think some of you are trolls and are sockpuppeting). I have a question for YOU: what is so special about this group of Gold Star families? Why should they be singled out for attention and not any other group of families of war dead?
OK, well, I guess you can ask Jeff to verify I haven't posted on this thread before if it matters to you.
I am not sure why you are answering a question with a question. My husband has served in combat under multiple administrations, and if he had been killed in combat, God forbid, I don't know if I would have been receptive to outreach from the CIC at the time - but I would certainly prefer it be proffered than not proffered. It is impossible to predict how families will react, which is why notification is such a tremendous duty, but it is the right thing to do to offer full ceremony, ritual and regard to Gold Star families. If it is rebuffed, it's rebuffed-but it seems a simple thing to do. I am wondering why it hasn't been done? It certainly is causing further division and pain.
I'm the PP you are responding to. I answered a question with a question because I STILL don't understand what is so special about this specific group of Gold Star families--given the enormity of loss represented at ANC. But I will try to answer your questions on the assumption that they are sincere. You asked: "But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them."
I can't speak for the Biden administration, but I'm assuming they're not reaching out to the families because it would be a damned if you do/damned if you don't situation. Since the incident occurred, it has become highly politicized and is a frequent line of attack against the Biden administration. Some of the relatives were openly hostile to Biden and criticized him publicly 3 years ago after Biden met with the families at Dover when the caskets were brought back. A subset of the families spoke at the recent RNC and, working with the Trump Campaign, have released a statement and videos which criticize Biden and Harris. The relatives are not looking for "comfort" from the Biden administration as you suggest. Some of them hold Biden personally culpable for their loved ones' deaths. You can be sure that if Biden met with them, even if privately, he would not be graciously received and every word of the interaction would be used against him. They've already made up their minds about what happened and who's at fault and there's nothing Biden or Harris can do or say to change that. Finally, Biden/Harris are not "just ignoring them"--the WH has said that B/H were not invited (https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/biden-harris-werent-invited-arlington-abbey-gate-trump-rcna169154).
Biden did meet with them though. Not all the families but I’m sure all would have been invited. They were unhappy with the meeting (they accused him of looking at his watch). But it most certainly happened.
Yes, he met with those of them that would meet with him (some refused) at Dover three years ago when the caskets came in and he was, as you say, criticized for looking at his watch, among other things. The issue is that some PPs are saying that Biden should have met with the families again in 2024, on the 3rd year anniversary.
I think the families' "issue" (besides their fallen children) is the sense that this administration has brushed their children's deaths under a rug. When they say the administration needs to "say their names" it is similar to BLM or any other anguished cry that a person in a position of political authority acknowledge a situation or events. Equally obvious is that the Biden (and now future Harris administration) would like as little attention paid to the withdrawal and Abbey Gate as possible. Let's talk about what we are really talking about, on both sides of this 'ceremonial observance' controversy.
But Biden does “say their names” and is very caring of our troops. This has been evident for decades.
This is not a “both sides” issue.
Trump, as usual, took our country to a new low by breaking decorum and politicizing ANC. He’s a psychopath and doesn’t care about anyone but himself.
We are talking about this specific incident, a massacre during the withdrawal from Afghanistan. There is disagreement about how his administration has responded to critique of that, and to the families of the fallen during that incident. Not his attitude overall to the military.
And you don't think that some of the families who are in the tank for Trump, had it in for Biden from the outset and have been fomenting that "disagreement" for almost 3 years now?
Like, from before their kids died? You think they have just seized their kids death as an opportunity to 'take on Biden'. Like, a silver lining? Weird. No, I think they hated the sloppy withdrawal, blame Biden as Commander in Chief for their children's death when they were literally preparing a homecoming, and want to call attention to his mishandling of the withdrawal at every opportunity. I think any parent would behave this way. You may not agree that Biden is at fault, but since they feel that way, their behavior is very understandable.
When troops are drawn down to a scant 2,500 and 5,000 taliban fighters were released by Trump, how exactly is there going to be a clean withdrawal? Please name a similar instance where this "clean withdrawal" has occurred.
Exactly. Trump pretty much sabotaged Afghanistan for the US.
Anonymous
09/04/2024 07:27
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Retired major general writes scathing takedown of Trump and his desecration of ANC.
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4859273-sen-vance-should-we-go-to-hell-too/
Anonymous
09/03/2024 20:45
Subject: Re:Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I'm just joining now...
But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them.
Highly skeptical that you're "just joining now" (in fact, I think some of you are trolls and are sockpuppeting). I have a question for YOU: what is so special about this group of Gold Star families? Why should they be singled out for attention and not any other group of families of war dead?
OK, well, I guess you can ask Jeff to verify I haven't posted on this thread before if it matters to you.
I am not sure why you are answering a question with a question. My husband has served in combat under multiple administrations, and if he had been killed in combat, God forbid, I don't know if I would have been receptive to outreach from the CIC at the time - but I would certainly prefer it be proffered than not proffered. It is impossible to predict how families will react, which is why notification is such a tremendous duty, but it is the right thing to do to offer full ceremony, ritual and regard to Gold Star families. If it is rebuffed, it's rebuffed-but it seems a simple thing to do. I am wondering why it hasn't been done? It certainly is causing further division and pain.
I'm the PP you are responding to. I answered a question with a question because I STILL don't understand what is so special about this specific group of Gold Star families--given the enormity of loss represented at ANC. But I will try to answer your questions on the assumption that they are sincere. You asked: "But why haven't the Biden/Harris Admin reached out more to the Gold Star Families of the Afghanistan withdrawal? Yes, I'm sure they would face ire--but it could be private meetings. The anguish of these families ... it seems a simple thing to 'do the right thing' and acknowledge and offer comfort, even if rejected. I don't really understand why they are just ignoring them."
I can't speak for the Biden administration, but I'm assuming they're not reaching out to the families because it would be a damned if you do/damned if you don't situation. Since the incident occurred, it has become highly politicized and is a frequent line of attack against the Biden administration. Some of the relatives were openly hostile to Biden and criticized him publicly 3 years ago after Biden met with the families at Dover when the caskets were brought back. A subset of the families spoke at the recent RNC and, working with the Trump Campaign, have released a statement and videos which criticize Biden and Harris. The relatives are not looking for "comfort" from the Biden administration as you suggest. Some of them hold Biden personally culpable for their loved ones' deaths. You can be sure that if Biden met with them, even if privately, he would not be graciously received and every word of the interaction would be used against him. They've already made up their minds about what happened and who's at fault and there's nothing Biden or Harris can do or say to change that. Finally, Biden/Harris are not "just ignoring them"--the WH has said that B/H were not invited (https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/biden-harris-werent-invited-arlington-abbey-gate-trump-rcna169154).
Biden did meet with them though. Not all the families but I’m sure all would have been invited. They were unhappy with the meeting (they accused him of looking at his watch). But it most certainly happened.
Yes, he met with those of them that would meet with him (some refused) at Dover three years ago when the caskets came in and he was, as you say, criticized for looking at his watch, among other things. The issue is that some PPs are saying that Biden should have met with the families again in 2024, on the 3rd year anniversary.
I think the families' "issue" (besides their fallen children) is the sense that this administration has brushed their children's deaths under a rug. When they say the administration needs to "say their names" it is similar to BLM or any other anguished cry that a person in a position of political authority acknowledge a situation or events. Equally obvious is that the Biden (and now future Harris administration) would like as little attention paid to the withdrawal and Abbey Gate as possible. Let's talk about what we are really talking about, on both sides of this 'ceremonial observance' controversy.
But Biden does “say their names” and is very caring of our troops. This has been evident for decades.
This is not a “both sides” issue.
Trump, as usual, took our country to a new low by breaking decorum and politicizing ANC. He’s a psychopath and doesn’t care about anyone but himself.
We are talking about this specific incident, a massacre during the withdrawal from Afghanistan. There is disagreement about how his administration has responded to critique of that, and to the families of the fallen during that incident. Not his attitude overall to the military.
And you don't think that some of the families who are in the tank for Trump, had it in for Biden from the outset and have been fomenting that "disagreement" for almost 3 years now?
Like, from before their kids died? You think they have just seized their kids death as an opportunity to 'take on Biden'. Like, a silver lining? Weird. No, I think they hated the sloppy withdrawal, blame Biden as Commander in Chief for their children's death when they were literally preparing a homecoming, and want to call attention to his mishandling of the withdrawal at every opportunity. I think any parent would behave this way. You may not agree that Biden is at fault, but since they feel that way, their behavior is very understandable.
When troops are drawn down to a scant 2,500 and 5,000 taliban fighters were released by Trump, how exactly is there going to be a clean withdrawal? Please name a similar instance where this "clean withdrawal" has occurred.
Anonymous
09/03/2024 20:43
Subject: Trump Campaign verbally and physically assaults Arlington Memorial staff, illegally uses site for campaigning
Anonymous wrote:Is Trump the only US President to surrender to the forces of another country when he surrendered to the Taliban?
The US did something similar in Vietnam but after the US was out.
Some would call it treason.