Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FSU may have engaged the services of an investment banker (JP Morgan Chase) and a private equity (PE firm Sixth Street) firm to raise money as well as to have access to sufficient capital to first make a settlement offer and to have a sufficient show of capital to fund an expensive court battle (which is a great & often effective settlement strategy).

Agree with the first part but there is no way there will be investor money to fund this lawsuit. They will fund a settlement. The outcome is not good. You could not get anyone to fund -- except alums and even they don't have that kind of cash.

Agree, but a show of force is often enough to get folks to the table and engage on a reasonable level regarding a settlement.

A show of force? If FSU offers 1.2 billion it will be considered. If they want to borrow it or sell their rights to Wall Street for the money nobody cares. Still might not be agreed to.

Some of us deal in the real world where business decisions typically involve some degree of bargaining and compromise while others may choose a hard-headed fight to the death type approach.

sigh. You are playing checkers. Chess is the game. What do the ACC schools that can't go anywhere want? It is not money. Duke and BC are loaded. What they want is a power conference. In other words they do not want the dollars -- they want the conference. So go ahead and sue us. You can't move until the litigation is over and appeals are over. No conference would touch you. Best case you sue and three years later you can move because you won. But three years from now there may be no slots. You will be screwed. The ACC schools that can't get anywhere else are not going to be reasonable. Why would they. They have you over a barrel. You can't give them what they want. The ACC has to either expand or get taken by the SEC and Big10.

BC and Duke should be smart enough to know that the ACC is no longer a power conference. There are only two of those - the Big and SEC. It is the ACC playing checkers. They are looking to add Cal and Stanford because of academics. The Big who talks a good game of valuing academics just added Oregon and WAS over these schools. The Big 12 even passed on them. So the ACC is looking to add sloppy thirds all because the President's of these schools are enamored with their academics. The fact that they are even considering them shows the majority of these schools are not concerned about being in a power conference. It is also clear that they are not remotely concerned about FSU or any one else leaving.

Like the Big 12 wasn’t concerned about Texas and Oklahoma, and the PAC-12 wasn’t concerned about USC and UCLA.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even if Stanford University offered to join the Big Ten Conference at a 50% payout forever, there is no value to the Big Ten Conference. Stanford's football value is in its rivalry relationship with Notre Dame.

Maybe Stanford could try being an independent for a year or two rather than dropping its football program, but there just do not appear to be any other economically viable options for Stanford football. And Cal football is in a worse position than Stanford football.

Stanford because they are Stanford would not take anything less than a full payout. Anything less damages the overall brand.

Do you realize that not even the University of Washington and the University of Oregon will be receiving full share payouts during their first 6 or 7 years in the Big Ten Conference ? And Washington & Oregon are much more valuable football brands than is Stanford.

I do and it is why you do not see Stanford begging to join.

ACC has no half share.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FSU may have engaged the services of an investment banker (JP Morgan Chase) and a private equity (PE firm Sixth Street) firm to raise money as well as to have access to sufficient capital to first make a settlement offer and to have a sufficient show of capital to fund an expensive court battle (which is a great & often effective settlement strategy).

Agree with the first part but there is no way there will be investor money to fund this lawsuit. They will fund a settlement. The outcome is not good. You could not get anyone to fund -- except alums and even they don't have that kind of cash.

Agree, but a show of force is often enough to get folks to the table and engage on a reasonable level regarding a settlement.

A show of force? If FSU offers 1.2 billion it will be considered. If they want to borrow it or sell their rights to Wall Street for the money nobody cares. Still might not be agreed to.

Some of us deal in the real world where business decisions typically involve some degree of bargaining and compromise while others may choose a hard-headed fight to the death type approach.

sigh. You are playing checkers. Chess is the game. What do the ACC schools that can't go anywhere want? It is not money. Duke and BC are loaded. What they want is a power conference. In other words they do not want the dollars -- they want the conference. So go ahead and sue us. You can't move until the litigation is over and appeals are over. No conference would touch you. Best case you sue and three years later you can move because you won. But three years from now there may be no slots. You will be screwed. The ACC schools that can't get anywhere else are not going to be reasonable. Why would they. They have you over a barrel. You can't give them what they want. The ACC has to either expand or get taken by the SEC and Big10.

BC and Duke should be smart enough to know that the ACC is no longer a power conference. There are only two of those - the Big and SEC. It is the ACC playing checkers. They are looking to add Cal and Stanford because of academics. The Big who talks a good game of valuing academics just added Oregon and WAS over these schools. The Big 12 even passed on them. So the ACC is looking to add sloppy thirds all because the President's of these schools are enamored with their academics. The fact that they are even considering them shows the majority of these schools are not concerned about being in a power conference. It is also clear that they are not remotely concerned about FSU or any one else leaving.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FSU may have engaged the services of an investment banker (JP Morgan Chase) and a private equity (PE firm Sixth Street) firm to raise money as well as to have access to sufficient capital to first make a settlement offer and to have a sufficient show of capital to fund an expensive court battle (which is a great & often effective settlement strategy).

Agree with the first part but there is no way there will be investor money to fund this lawsuit. They will fund a settlement. The outcome is not good. You could not get anyone to fund -- except alums and even they don't have that kind of cash.

Agree, but a show of force is often enough to get folks to the table and engage on a reasonable level regarding a settlement.

A show of force? If FSU offers 1.2 billion it will be considered. If they want to borrow it or sell their rights to Wall Street for the money nobody cares. Still might not be agreed to.

Some of us deal in the real world where business decisions typically involve some degree of bargaining and compromise while others may choose a hard-headed fight to the death type approach.

sigh. You are playing checkers. Chess is the game. What do the ACC schools that can't go anywhere want? It is not money. Duke and BC are loaded. What they want is a power conference. In other words they do not want the dollars -- they want the conference. So go ahead and sue us. You can't move until the litigation is over and appeals are over. No conference would touch you. Best case you sue and three years later you can move because you won. But three years from now there may be no slots. You will be screwed. The ACC schools that can't get anywhere else are not going to be reasonable. Why would they. They have you over a barrel. You can't give them what they want. The ACC has to either expand or get taken by the SEC and Big10.

BC and Duke should be smart enough to know that the ACC is no longer a power conference. There are only two of those - the Big and SEC. It is the ACC playing checkers. They are looking to add Cal and Stanford because of academics. The Big who talks a good game of valuing academics just added Oregon and WAS over these schools. The Big 12 even passed on them. So the ACC is looking to add sloppy thirds all because the President's of these schools are enamored with their academics. The fact that they are even considering them shows the majority of these schools are not concerned about being in a power conference. It is also clear that they are not remotely concerned about FSU or any one else leaving.

Here’s my take:

The Big Ten will eventually add Stanford and Berkeley partly because there are lots of Big Ten graduates in California. Those graduates will often outnumber the local partisans at games, just like what often happens at Northwestern. There are plenty of marquis teams in the Big Ten already. There is a need for more gimme games for the top teams going into a 10 game conference schedule. Stanford and Cal add huge prestige with mediocre competition, something that few other schools could present themselves to the conference. The heads of the Big Ten like top academic members more so than those of the SEC and Big 12.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FSU may have engaged the services of an investment banker (JP Morgan Chase) and a private equity (PE firm Sixth Street) firm to raise money as well as to have access to sufficient capital to first make a settlement offer and to have a sufficient show of capital to fund an expensive court battle (which is a great & often effective settlement strategy).

Agree with the first part but there is no way there will be investor money to fund this lawsuit. They will fund a settlement. The outcome is not good. You could not get anyone to fund -- except alums and even they don't have that kind of cash.

Agree, but a show of force is often enough to get folks to the table and engage on a reasonable level regarding a settlement.

A show of force? If FSU offers 1.2 billion it will be considered. If they want to borrow it or sell their rights to Wall Street for the money nobody cares. Still might not be agreed to.

Some of us deal in the real world where business decisions typically involve some degree of bargaining and compromise while others may choose a hard-headed fight to the death type approach.

sigh. You are playing checkers. Chess is the game. What do the ACC schools that can't go anywhere want? It is not money. Duke and BC are loaded. What they want is a power conference. In other words they do not want the dollars -- they want the conference. So go ahead and sue us. You can't move until the litigation is over and appeals are over. No conference would touch you. Best case you sue and three years later you can move because you won. But three years from now there may be no slots. You will be screwed. The ACC schools that can't get anywhere else are not going to be reasonable. Why would they. They have you over a barrel. You can't give them what they want. The ACC has to either expand or get taken by the SEC and Big10.

BC and Duke should be smart enough to know that the ACC is no longer a power conference. There are only two of those - the Big and SEC. It is the ACC playing checkers. They are looking to add Cal and Stanford because of academics. The Big who talks a good game of valuing academics just added Oregon and WAS over these schools. The Big 12 even passed on them. So the ACC is looking to add sloppy thirds all because the President's of these schools are enamored with their academics. The fact that they are even considering them shows the majority of these schools are not concerned about being in a power conference. It is also clear that they are not remotely concerned about FSU or any one else leaving.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FSU may have engaged the services of an investment banker (JP Morgan Chase) and a private equity (PE firm Sixth Street) firm to raise money as well as to have access to sufficient capital to first make a settlement offer and to have a sufficient show of capital to fund an expensive court battle (which is a great & often effective settlement strategy).

Agree with the first part but there is no way there will be investor money to fund this lawsuit. They will fund a settlement. The outcome is not good. You could not get anyone to fund -- except alums and even they don't have that kind of cash.

Agree, but a show of force is often enough to get folks to the table and engage on a reasonable level regarding a settlement.

A show of force? If FSU offers 1.2 billion it will be considered. If they want to borrow it or sell their rights to Wall Street for the money nobody cares. Still might not be agreed to.

Some of us deal in the real world where business decisions typically involve some degree of bargaining and compromise while others may choose a hard-headed fight to the death type approach.

sigh. You are playing checkers. Chess is the game. What do the ACC schools that can't go anywhere want? It is not money. Duke and BC are loaded. What they want is a power conference. In other words they do not want the dollars -- they want the conference. So go ahead and sue us. You can't move until the litigation is over and appeals are over. No conference would touch you. Best case you sue and three years later you can move because you won. But three years from now there may be no slots. You will be screwed. The ACC schools that can't get anywhere else are not going to be reasonable. Why would they. They have you over a barrel. You can't give them what they want. The ACC has to either expand or get taken by the SEC and Big10.

BC and Duke should be smart enough to know that the ACC is no longer a power conference. There are only two of those - the Big and SEC. It is the ACC playing checkers. They are looking to add Cal and Stanford because of academics. The Big who talks a good game of valuing academics just added Oregon and WAS over these schools. The Big 12 even passed on them. So the ACC is looking to add sloppy thirds all because the President's of these schools are enamored with their academics. The fact that they are even considering them shows the majority of these schools are not concerned about being in a power conference. It is also clear that they are not remotely concerned about FSU or any one else leaving.

Anonymous wrote:I think in this thread there is a lack of understanding about what is important to the high academic schools.

Stanford does not recruit against Cal. Much like ND their base is national.

And it is smart. Will they dip to a solid B student who as no chance of getting in otherwise but is solid as a student and a great receiver-- yes. A few recruits. Most of the rest are A students. They are going to Stanford because they are smart and because they are really good at football. There are maybe 5 kids that would be recruited by both Stanford and Alabama.

What is important to Stanford as a university is to play good games against good teams so that the rest of the student body has a break from learning to change the universe. National Title run? Great. But it is a adjunct to the school, the tail not the dog.

That is what they care about.

Duke and BC are somewhat similar even if lower ranked by USNWS. BC is not taking C students on their teams. It is what has killed them in basketball. Duke makes exceptions for basketball and only a little for football.

In football neither wants to compete for a national championship. If they got one, great. But that is not the goal. They want games against Clemson, Miami, FSU that they win or lose but that students and alums like. For BC it is ok to beat FSU only once in a while so the kids can storm the field.

Those schools want a top conference for the games.

These schools (and Wake most likely) have different motivations.

That is why this is difficult. If everyone wanted just football glory or money this would be easy. But there is more of an agenda here for a number of the schools.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FSU may have engaged the services of an investment banker (JP Morgan Chase) and a private equity (PE firm Sixth Street) firm to raise money as well as to have access to sufficient capital to first make a settlement offer and to have a sufficient show of capital to fund an expensive court battle (which is a great & often effective settlement strategy).

Agree with the first part but there is no way there will be investor money to fund this lawsuit. They will fund a settlement. The outcome is not good. You could not get anyone to fund -- except alums and even they don't have that kind of cash.

Agree, but a show of force is often enough to get folks to the table and engage on a reasonable level regarding a settlement.

A show of force? If FSU offers 1.2 billion it will be considered. If they want to borrow it or sell their rights to Wall Street for the money nobody cares. Still might not be agreed to.

Some of us deal in the real world where business decisions typically involve some degree of bargaining and compromise while others may choose a hard-headed fight to the death type approach.

sigh. You are playing checkers. Chess is the game. What do the ACC schools that can't go anywhere want? It is not money. Duke and BC are loaded. What they want is a power conference. In other words they do not want the dollars -- they want the conference. So go ahead and sue us. You can't move until the litigation is over and appeals are over. No conference would touch you. Best case you sue and three years later you can move because you won. But three years from now there may be no slots. You will be screwed. The ACC schools that can't get anywhere else are not going to be reasonable. Why would they. They have you over a barrel. You can't give them what they want. The ACC has to either expand or get taken by the SEC and Big10.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If ND, Cal, and Stanford joined the ACC -- the ND schedule

Stanford
Cal
Miami
BC
GTech
Clemson
Duke - for the win
Wake - for the win

Navy
USC

They would do this.

Every rival is 3 time zones away, except for each other. It doesn’t work. Why do you think the Big aren’t added Washington and Oregon. I expect the Big Ten to eventually include Stanford and Berkeley, simply to anppease its west coast participants.

Not that big of a deal and that is what we are moving to. either 2, 3, or 4 national conferences. I doubt 4. Most likely 2 SEC and Big10 but possibly ACC if they could do it right. The move to national conferences is happening. Indeed it is why an ACC/SEC merger is not far fetched.

An ACC/SEC is far-fetched because ESPN is not paying SEC money to Wake Forest, Duke, and Boston College.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even if Stanford University offered to join the Big Ten Conference at a 50% payout forever, there is no value to the Big Ten Conference. Stanford's football value is in its rivalry relationship with Notre Dame.

Maybe Stanford could try being an independent for a year or two rather than dropping its football program, but there just do not appear to be any other economically viable options for Stanford football. And Cal football is in a worse position than Stanford football.

Stanford because they are Stanford would not take anything less than a full payout. Anything less damages the overall brand.

Do you realize that not even the University of Washington and the University of Oregon will be receiving full share payouts during their first 6 or 7 years in the Big Ten Conference ? And Washington & Oregon are much more valuable football brands than is Stanford.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even if Stanford University offered to join the Big Ten Conference at a 50% payout forever, there is no value to the Big Ten Conference. Stanford's football value is in its rivalry relationship with Notre Dame.

Maybe Stanford could try being an independent for a year or two rather than dropping its football program, but there just do not appear to be any other economically viable options for Stanford football. And Cal football is in a worse position than Stanford football.

Stanford because they are Stanford would not take anything less than a full payout. Anything less damages the overall brand.