What does AP boyfriend say about it? Is he complaining or surprised your exH is friendly towards him. Does he say thing like, Tom and I were such good friends. Yes, I did totally betray that friendship by banging his wife behind his back, leading to the breakup of his marriage and now he has to share custody of his kids while knowing I'm still in the picture, replacing him as dad when he doesn't have the kids. But he doesn't have to be a dick about it?.

ExH is actually treating this guy a lot better than he deserves and a lot better than I'd treat him. He's lucky he still has his teeth.

Anonymous wrote:Poster above...in time he may soften, he may not. You have no control over him just as he had none over you when you went outside the marriage. Maybe this is unconsciously what he wants to communicate...who knows? You got a lot of what you wanted op. His approval and recognition of your partner may be a remnant he will not grant. And you have to live with that..let it go, give him a break.

Well said.

Poster above...in time he may soften, he may not. You have no control over him just as he had none over you when you went outside the marriage. Maybe this is unconsciously what he wants to communicate...who knows? You got a lot of what you wanted op. His approval and recognition of your partner may be a remnant he will not grant. And you have to live with that..let it go, give him a break.

It was a deep narcissistic injury for your former husband, I would imagine. It does not mean he wants to reconcile (not that you suggested that) and it does not negate that you are both happier apart.. I would think of the image of two tracks side by side...he is happier and accepts this new reality and he was profoundly injured and betrayed and has no desire to make things comfortable for your new partner. These two things co-exist. He's entitled to behave however he sees fit.

Millions and millions of potential guys in this country for you to date and you go back to your AP after a long, multi-year break?

No wonder your ex-DH is pissed. You just poured salt into a wound that had been healing for years. It’s pretty pathetic that you went back to this guy.

OP - are you in therapy? If so, what does your therapist say?

^The kids always figure it out eventually. Cheaters try and rationalize and spin the narrative, but that only makes it worse when the cheating and continued deceit is discovered. OP, yiu are risking your relationships with your kids by keeping your AP in your life.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thank you for the responses.

I would not say I parade in his face as the only time I have ever brought him up is regarding something logistical with no other way to explain something. But I hear you.

The 3 times they have been in same place - one was coincidence and other 2 were at kid sport events on my time with the kids.

This is probably more between him and my SO than him and me as we do have a good working relationship.

I can accept that exh will just never acknowledge or be cordial and it is something we have to deal with. And it is something I accept as my responsibility as I decided to be in a relationship with him.

I won't go as far to say AP should not go to things if my exh may be there. Which, honestly right now are few and far between because it is an LDR.

You have a good working relationship because of your kids, not because he likes you or forgives you. Good on him. When your kids are grown he will ghost you more or less. -another child of parents in this situation

PP, how has the ghosting been for you as a child? I have been very cordial to my unfaithful ex, but really intend to largely ghost him after DC2 graduates from HS and ex is no longer legally obligated to pay child support. I will continue to be cordial at graduations, weddings, etc. but don’t see a reason to be in contact otherwise. I have slowly been diminishing our contact as the kids got older and more independent (and after some verbal abuse of me in front of the kids) so the transition doesn’t seem abrupt. But, I worry whether the ruptured relationship will affect the kids. I’d like to think not, and that honest disconnection is better than a fake front.

I am the PP whose FIL did what OP did (and also had similar expectations of his ex wife). From DHs point of view as an adult, the ghosting was better.

Essentially my DHs adulthood had been a gradually deepening understanding of how badly his father acted and how hurtful his behavior was.

How did your DH’s understanding deepen? Did he always know about the affair but didn’t realize the full significance until experiencing his own adult relationships and children? Or did he not learn the full details until more of an adult?

PP here. He learned about the affair when he was 13 (not from his parents, who had glossed over the truth, but from other kids who knew about it and teased him). So he always knew something. But his mom tried to take the high ground (sounds like OPs ex in many respects) and didn't want to talk about it much. However, she was significantly depressed and ended up checked out quite a bit. Meanwhile DHs dad was actively feeding the "more involved parent, marriage was dead anyhow" line. As DH aged and had his own marriage and kids, DH realized just how vulnerable he had been as a teen dealing with it all, and how much his father's version of events was self-serving and wrong. When our oldest was 13 in particular, it kind of shook my DH up because he realized the extent of what he was put through.

DH thinks that FIL eventually came to regret the affair. But DH had moved across the country from him by then and only saw him every few years by then, so it was just a guess.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

Listen when you hurt other people they don't have to like you, they don't have to hang out with you and be your bestie. When your spouse and your friend have an affair that's hurtful behavior. They no longer have to like you or what to hang around you. When n other people see how you treat those closest to you they make decisions about the kind of relationship they want to have with you. Generally, people don't want to be close to people who practice hurtful behavior. These are things ost of us learn at 5 years old.

This. OP, are you friendly with couples who conspire to betray you? Because that's what this is. It isn't the kind of thing that leads to friendship. When you chose an affair, you chose to give up any real friendship with your ex.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

No one said anything of the kind. We are saying it's stupid to expect the ex-husband--who was betrayed by his wife and his friend--to be welcoming or warm beyond the basic level of civility that is required to co-parent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

OP, I don’t think you should burn at the stake. But I do think you just adjust your expectations and not get too offended if some relatives hold a monthly “stakeout” from your distrust and betrayal.

Truly that is not easy to reconcile. Part of the penance, sadly.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

No burning at the stake or whipping. However, a modicum of decency and acknowledgement of their role ‘f’ing up your like would be a start.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

Listen when you hurt other people they don't have to like you, they don't have to hang out with you and be your bestie. When your spouse and your friend have an affair that's hurtful behavior. They no longer have to like you or what to hang around you. When n other people see how you treat those closest to you they make decisions about the kind of relationship they want to have with you. Generally, people don't want to be close to people who practice hurtful behavior. These are things ost of us learn at 5 years old.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

This forum doesn’t have any practical advice for you, OP except to minimize contact between exH and former friend of exH/AP/now LTR guy. But, just make sure you know, everyone thinks you are now and will remain a bad person.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op and the AP are morally bankrupt and without good judgement or character. It doesn’t matter what OP and the AP think of each other. They hold each other in high regard because no one else does. The children won’t remember anything except the cheating.

Can she ever be forgiven for bad judgement? For her affair? Can her ex husband move on or is she permanently, forever “morally bankrupt” from his pov? What if she is objectively good in many other ways?

Forever a sh@t person. This was a marriage (2 marriages!) with kids not a fleeting high school romance.

She’d be a POS in my eyes forever if I were her SIL or exH.

I suspect that people like this don’t cheat but are horrible in equally or more problematic ways. It’s almost like being faithful is their one virtue so they raise to the highest virtue. Guaranteed that some “forever sh@t people” have been of great service and value to you in life. Guarantee that you have been a great source of pain to some people, or will be before your die.

That said, I don’t know why OP is struggling with the very basic idea that the ex doesn’t want to hang out with a friend who slept with his wife. OP, if someone stole 500k from you, you would never ever want to hang out with them. It’s like that!

People that are manipulative liars and morally corrupt definitely lie in other facets of their lives too. This type of behavior isn’t confined to just cheating. It is bad character.

.

Sometimes. But also super judgmental people are often deflecting from their own moral failings in other areas. When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme. From a social point of view, I would prefer the person with the Nobel peace prize who cheated on his wife, than some person living there normal, selfish life or worse, who hasn’t.

Many of the older men in my family have cheated, and I suspect some of the women. I would not write them off entirely for what went on in their marriages. Yet I don’t think I could forgive my husband for sleeping with my friend. And I would never want to hang out with my friend who slept with my husband.

“When I hear this extremely harsh language directed at spouses who have cheated specifically, it really makes me wonder about the other areas of the life of the person who is being so extreme.”

Interesting comment on assessment of moral measure. Interesting that many of the comments view the cheating/sexual betrayal as “an ultimate moral failure.” Reminds me of The Scarlet Letter and Hester Prynn and how little progress society has made from our puritanical roots. I suspect these commentators would like to see this woman burned at the stake or emblazoned with a permanent scarlet A, if they could. Yes?

Anonymous wrote:I hope you realize your AP is now cheating on you in your LDR. I guarantee it.

Even if he is not cheating this relationship is not going anywhere. She claims that he is “the one”
But also complains that he doesn’t know how to handle his exW in a another thread.