We have lived in the NY area, SF East Bay Area, DMV area and the north shore of Chicago. Except for the winter months Chicago was far and away the best for us. Very nice people, great public schools and very family oriented. Despite its recent problems Chicago is a great city especially in the summer. But the state has huge financial problems and that’s weighing on everyone.

Anonymous wrote:We moved our family from L.A. to MoCo, and immediately wished we could move back. We've been here for several years and still can't wait to go back. We've met plenty of people who also moved here from CA, and they also can't wait to move back. Before Covid, we spent every weekend out of state. Philly, NYC, Chicago, Toronto etc. Don't do it!

We're thinking of making the same move. Can you please say more about why you hate it?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It sounds like you are in PA, and I say this as a former peninsula resident.

We left and moved to a small university town and are all so much happier. The DMV seems so provincial when I read these boards. So many people are so narrow-minded but maybe that is part of being on a board where people can be anonymous. I remember all the drama and racism in PA about creating a Mandarin immersion track so it probably happens everywhere to a degree. PA was unique in the suicide problem though. Similar districts nearby did not have any during the same time periods and the district took for freaking ever to take responsibility for the stress on the kids or the railroad tracks. Even now teachers don't have to follow the rules about giving homework during finals exam week.

If you can go anywhere, what about San Diego? Or Lake Tahoe? Or Portland?

OP. Thinking back, the suicides must have really colored my impression of the district. It still haunts me to see suicide preveention pamphlets on the train. You are right that other districts seem to handle things better. Palo Alto so highly regarded… is this kind of thing lurking in every top-rated district? I had not considered Lake Tahoe. All three of those would be beautiful. I really, need to find a better way to evaluate schools that captures liveability and sanity, not just test scores. Congrats on finding your new home.

The suicides really bothered us too.

It is very difficult to compare schools across states. And there is no even playing field. There is on going math tutoring starting in elementary to put kids in the top math track and keep them ahead, there is $test prep and $private college counselors. When you see great school stats, you are mostly seeing an indicator of parental wealth. And PA has the most of that with very wealthy families with kids in public schools.

One of my children had a student teacher who had grown up in PA and was at Stanford, and she told me so much about what had happened during the suicide crisis years. The other districts like Los Gatos,Los Altos, etc didn't have suicides but they are still very high pressure districts.

This is really why people pay for the $$$ private schools in the area. They want the opportunities and choice of classes but without the other stuff.

I love DC and moved back here after living elsewhere for a few years, but you have a flexibility that I didn't have and it doesn't sound like you are particularly motivated by the things that make DC great (to me).

If I had your money, and priorities, I would never move to this area. It's hot, competitive, super career focused, and transient.

So much negativity about DC! I'm also a CA transplant -- lived here for 25 years -- and have been really happy here.

However, for what OP wants, I'd recommend San Luis Obispo. I went to college there and have a few friends who stayed in the area (and one who did early retirement to the area) to raise their families and they have been very happy with the lifestyle and the schools. It's not cheap but certainly more affordable than the Bay Area, good schools, wonderful outdoor recreation, close to beach, and being a college town there are lots of cultural activities. While I'm really happy in DC and we expect to retire here, if I was to move anywhere it would be to SLO.

For DC, I live in Arlington now but have previously lived in MD burbs and in northwest DC and I work in DC. I'm close to metro and do (pre-COVID) use it regularly. We're in a really walkable neighborhood which has been great for my kids as they became teens because they can have an independence I didn't get in a car-dependent LA suburb. So many free museums and other activities. Easy drive to the mountains but can also go to Rock Creek Park, Roosevelt Island, or other close-by natural areas when we want to be in nature. When I first moved here from LA what most struck me was how much more interested in the world people were -- I met people who traveled a lot, talked about a wide variety of topics, made time to volunteer. Definitely not the kind of people I was meeting in LA and I just felt like I fit here much more than there.

Now in Arlington, my neighbors are generally down to earth people who work for the government, non-profits or IT and I don't think my kids have felt too much pressure in their schools. However, I think it's a bit different for families with younger kids in our area. So I don't think someone moving in now with little kids has the same experience. We and most of our neighbors have lived her since pre-housing boom and the type of people who bought here when it was somewhat run-down houses for $200k are a lot different than the people moving into a neighborhood that became trendy and paying $1.2M+ for a flip. My kids have also been just ahead of the big wave of overcrowding in the schools so haven't borne the brunt of that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I grew up in the Bay Area, may have gone to the same school district you're currently living in right now. Moved to Fairfax county for work a few years ago. I can speak to the education - the school/culture/type of students are very similar, competitive, over-scheduled. Schools seem better funded in Virginia v California, more prevalent to find an immersion program or language, art, music in a public school. Both of my kids are quite analytical/STEM focused, they've had a harder time finding friends in early elementary because the selection of similarly minded children is smaller (I do like the political and career diversity - not everyone is an engineer). The rest is kind of a wash. Housing is more affordable in that you get more house for the same amount of $$. Yes, you have access to a great city and cultural attractions, but the weather is bad half the year, summer is REALLY bad. Traffic is similarly horrible. The selection of organic produce seems much worse (if that matters to you). Between the Bay Area and DC, I'd honestly pick based on 1) career and 2) family/friend connection. If I had the funds to semi-retire, I would look elsewhere like others have mentioned, the central coast or colorado.

OP. Not ashamed to be a California stereotype: yes, I would dearly miss good organic produce. This is extraordinarily helpful . Thanks very much!

OP, as a native Californian who grew up with an avocado tree in my backyard, I have never gotten over the horror of avocado prices out here!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Thanks for the quick reply. Just to clarify, we will not be in the workforce--this is an early at least semi-retirement. If you can call raising two daughters any kind of retirement ... Do you find the DC area stressful apart from work?

Did you get super wealthy after an ipo or something?

Ran a very profitable small business for 15 years and was fortunate in the stock market. Wife had a very successful medical practice. We certainly aren't billionaires but we could probably live more or less wherever fits us. I am grateful for that. I loved my job but it took the birth of my second child to realize the stress was slowly killing me (very nasty insomnia). I am healthy now but realize I only have so much time here to raise a family and enjoy the fruit of our hard work (and luck!) Giving our daughters a really good education to give them the options to choose what they love seems like a high priority. The schools in Fairy County certainly rank exceptionally well, but that can also mean exceptional pressure. We want what is best for them and the family.

Thanks!

If I could live literally anywhere in the US, I would NOT choose Fairfax County. Two of the top public school districts in the country are not far from San Francisco - Los Gatos and Palo Alto. Mountain View and Carmel aren't far behind them. If you want to be done with Northern California, move down south to San Marino. Or, even better, move to the beach and live in Carlsbad or Encinitas. Another awesome choice would be Rancho Palos Verdes.

Even if you really want to get out of CA, you would have SO many better choices than Fairfax County!

OP. Good points. Palo Alto is the school district that scares me. I'm still trying to figure how how to identify a school district that is rigorous but not crushing. I understand that perhaps the suicide issue in PA was somewhat anomalous, but I love these girls so much I can't help but feel concerned. RPV is spectacularly beautiful. That area north of San Diego deserves more attention. Thank you very much.

OP, I'm the PP and I grew up in California but lived in Fairfax County for 15 years. I also have two daughters so I completely understand where you are coming from.

This is just my two cents, but I went to a rigorous private school in CA and my girls are in a rigorous private school here and I think the biggest thing that kept me anchored and has kept them anchored (so far anyway, they aren't through high school) has been my parents and my husband's and my perspectives on school. Yes, many schools, public or private, are rigorous. Yes, it can be very easy for kids to get swept up in that kind of thinking. However, if you and your wife make sure that you don't create a crushing lifestyle for your kids with eight different extracurriculars and nonstop resume padding activities and you clearly define the place that school should occupy in your lives (i.e. it's not the most important thing you'll ever do and it's about the journey and not the destination) then I think that will help create a more pleasant environment for your girls wherever you land. I say this as someone who got into all of the 8 top 25 colleges I applied for (and I have zero hooks), went on to complete two graduate programs, also at the top schools of my choosing, and now have a job that is very satisfying, pays me very well, and gives me a ton of flexibility to also be a wife, mother, and friend. I think luck has been heavily on my side, but I tell you all of that to say that I will never be the type of person who makes my kids think that it's Harvard or bust from the crib on and my parents weren't either and I think that was what helped me and what I hope will help my daughters survive what can be a crushing academic experience.

Finally, I will say that I am a huge believer that no one school is magic, and that your kids can have a wonderful experience, get a great education, and end up following the path of their dreams from pretty much anywhere in the US. I would give about 5% consideration to the school pyramid you are buying into and 95% consideration to all the other factors.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DC is all about where you work and I wouldn't move there if I wasn't working in a professional job. Boulder CO is one of the classic places where people go to semi-retire with kids still at home. Other college towns might be good choices as well.

OP. Boulder is tempting. A colleague of mine suggested Chapel Hill as a nice college town. This will sound stupid but I need to get these stupid high school rankings out of my head because intellectually I know they don't measure what really matters to a child's happiness and development, but it's all I have to go on and so few places measure up to what DMV has there. Sigh.

OP, are you focused on Thomas Jefferson High School? If so, you need to rethink moving your family to live in a place like Fairfax County for the sole purpose of your kids maybe being interested in that kind of school and also maybe getting in...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Thanks for the quick reply. Just to clarify, we will not be in the workforce--this is an early at least semi-retirement. If you can call raising two daughters any kind of retirement ... Do you find the DC area stressful apart from work?

I have no idea why anyone would choose to live in DC if not for work. In your shoes I'd move to the Pacific Northwest.

We moved from DC to Seattle due to high cost of living and stressful jobs, and ran back as soon as we could. What a joke that place was. Now appreciate what DC has so much more, we love raising our kid in a diverse neighborhood where it doesn't rain for 9 months out of the year and people actually travel internationally.

Anonymous wrote:It sounds like you are in PA, and I say this as a former peninsula resident.

We left and moved to a small university town and are all so much happier. The DMV seems so provincial when I read these boards. So many people are so narrow-minded but maybe that is part of being on a board where people can be anonymous. I remember all the drama and racism in PA about creating a Mandarin immersion track so it probably happens everywhere to a degree. PA was unique in the suicide problem though. Similar districts nearby did not have any during the same time periods and the district took for freaking ever to take responsibility for the stress on the kids or the railroad tracks. Even now teachers don't have to follow the rules about giving homework during finals exam week.

If you can go anywhere, what about San Diego? Or Lake Tahoe? Or Portland?

OP. Thinking back, the suicides must have really colored my impression of the district. It still haunts me to see suicide preveention pamphlets on the train. You are right that other districts seem to handle things better. Palo Alto so highly regarded… is this kind of thing lurking in every top-rated district? I had not considered Lake Tahoe. All three of those would be beautiful. I really, need to find a better way to evaluate schools that captures liveability and sanity, not just test scores. Congrats on finding your new home.

Takoma Park has the crunchy-liberal Bay Area sensibility, but a bit more of a small-town feel. I think you’d like it.

What about heading a short distance north to Sonoma or Napa? Way more laid back, Beautiful area, good weather, tons of outdoor activities and no major culture shock of a cross country move.

Or just rent a house someone for 6-12 months before fully committing?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a native Seattleite raising kids in the close-in DC suburbs and trying desperately to get back to the West Coast. The DC area is hyper career focused—it’s the first question anyone asks you (“what do you do?”), even when you meet them through your kids. What makes the DC area even worse is the weather—all winter and summer, barely any spring and fall (basically the opposite of the Bay Area), so you have very small windows to get outside. Then, the outdoor options here are pretty paltry—we’ve done all the hiking, sailing, kayaking to be done in the area and are pretty bored of it all. (Pandemic isn’t helping with that of course.). The cultural opportunities are good, but honestly, the arts scene is no better than any other major city. Certainly, there are certain art forms that are strong here, and I wouldn’t deter you if you had a niche interest.

For me, personally, I am grateful for my 13 years in DC but am ready to move on.

OP. Thank you very much. Seattle (or perhaps the East Side) is high on our list. If I may ask, was your move for work? Would you choose to return to Seattle or somewhere in the Puget Sound area?

We are applying for jobs from Bellingham to Eugene and would be happy to land anywhere both of us could find satisfying jobs in our professions (not a small challenge given our niche specialties). I actually think we’d be happiest in Portland or Eugene, but only one of our two reasons likely applies to you: the amazon-ification of Seattle has corrupted the city’s culture quite a bit (in addition to driving real estate prices up in a way that I’m not convinced is sustainable. My other reason is that I think we’d do best with a short drive between us and our extended network in the Puget sound basin.

Given your parameters, I think the 405 corridor makes sense for you—less of the Amazon culture, very good schools. I might look up toward woodinville if I were you. Are the schools in Edmonds still good? That might be a good option for you as well.

OP. Thank you and good luck!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP. Fairfax County. You have to love autocorrect.

They are good. But Fairfax county is NOT DC in any way. So whatever pulls you towards DC might not be there in the actual place that you live in an hour or more away from the city. You might be able to find other similar or even better school districts in other areas.

+1. You won't get a "sense of place" as much in the suburbs as you would in DC itself. I'm speaking from experience--I'm the former CA resident who moved to DC. Before DC, we briefly lived in a somewhat bland MD suburb with highly ranked schools, and decided that was not what we wanted.

OP. Thank you. It sounds like you lived the experience we're contemplating. I was really hoping the excellent-sounding Metro could bride the gap somehow ...

PP here. It's been a 180 in our current DC neighborhood compared to the former MD suburb. We live in a SFH neighborhood on the edge of a large wooded area in DC, Rock Creek Park, where we frequently hike, jog, ride bikes, walk the dog. I remember flying out to interview here and thinking and green and lush it is compared to CA. And, we've found the people to be career-oriented but kind, and don't get the fake air we got in our former CA town (not NorCal).

Right now we're out of town in NYC, and neighbors have already emailed and texted to let us know they've collected a package for us. Our neighborhood is low crime, very international, very liberal, and extremely diverse (important to us as POC who did not want our kids to be the "lonely onlies" as they would have been in CA where we likely would have bought). We feel lucky to have landed here. We don't work for the government, either.

I mentioned before that the weather is terrible, but there are so many other pluses given the international, diverse climate (we are an immigrant/1st-gen family) and cultural amenities that we are here for the long haul. We do not live in a transient neighborhood, although we *may* move back to CA one day, as empty nesters.

Anonymous wrote:I grew up in the Bay Area, may have gone to the same school district you're currently living in right now. Moved to Fairfax county for work a few years ago. I can speak to the education - the school/culture/type of students are very similar, competitive, over-scheduled. Schools seem better funded in Virginia v California, more prevalent to find an immersion program or language, art, music in a public school. Both of my kids are quite analytical/STEM focused, they've had a harder time finding friends in early elementary because the selection of similarly minded children is smaller (I do like the political and career diversity - not everyone is an engineer). The rest is kind of a wash. Housing is more affordable in that you get more house for the same amount of $$. Yes, you have access to a great city and cultural attractions, but the weather is bad half the year, summer is REALLY bad. Traffic is similarly horrible. The selection of organic produce seems much worse (if that matters to you). Between the Bay Area and DC, I'd honestly pick based on 1) career and 2) family/friend connection. If I had the funds to semi-retire, I would look elsewhere like others have mentioned, the central coast or colorado.

OP. Not ashamed to be a California stereotype: yes, I would dearly miss good organic produce. This is extraordinarily helpful . Thanks very much!