Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Bought your house in reliance on Wilson access" is not a property right. Even if it was, I want it taken away for the good of the rest of us. Move if you want. I want those kids in Ward 1 or 4 schools, or if (when, right PP!?!) you move away, to have your replacements put their kids there.

You realize this same mentality applies to kids at Lafayette, right? You want "those kids" gone but you think your feeder rights are sacrosanct.

Exactly - for some reason it was easy for some to suggest that eotp kids don't belong (despite their neighborhoods having long been zoned for Deal and Wilson - which, by the way IS in ward 4), but the idea of Lafayette families giving up Wilson is unthinkable.... Um, and I never said it was a "property right" (however that matters).

What's ok for 16th street heights, crestwood, etc, ought to be ok for those families in Chevy Chase DC too.

Hold on there. It was PP at 14:31 who suggested the Lafayette kids be moved but that families who bought EOTP would keep their rights to Deal/Wilson. How is that any more fair than the other way around?

Because the PP at 14:31 brought that up specifically because it would shift a big enough cohort of high-SES kids at once to create a viable high-achieving second DCPS feeder pattern. Just kicking out the grandfathered kids in the Gold Coast and erasing Shepherd feeder rights would be a much smaller cohort and would not move the needle in the same way -- and that's not why DCUM always reverts to kicking out "those kids." If you want to talk about fairness at least compare apples to oranges. 14:31 was trying to come up with a politically disastrous idea that would theoretically result in an additional good school for kids to attend. The "get rid of all those EOTP kids" people are not at all interested in improving outcomes for "those kids."

If that was what 14:31 was saying, he/she should not have made the fairness argument in the first sentence and negated later in the post. Make the argument about moving a large co-hort but don’t pretend it is fair. At least be honest.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. there are 1700 kids at Wilson. My high school had 2500. Just expand the building...

Very hard to do at this site, unless Wilson wants to give up its track and field.

It would be better to reopen Western High School at the Duke Ellington site instead of expanding Wilson further. Move Ellington to a more central location near a Metro stop, as its students come from around the city. A new WOTP high school could move right into the building with very little reconfiguration.

That ship has sailed.

One solution to the over crowding at Wilson is to stop Oyster Adams middle school from feeding to Wilson. This school is in Kalorama/Dupont. Can they feed go to Mcfarland?

Adams is a drop in the bucket of kids going to Wilson- like 10 kids the year DS finished there. Most went to Walls, DE or privates. Roosevelt makes more sense anyway with its international program option, but the reality is simply that kids will choose private or move rather than attending a non-Wilson option, which would wreck one of the best performing middle schools in the city in order to prevent 15 kids from attending Wilson. Yay!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what are the actual Wilson numbers?
Current numbers and number projected/estimated in 3 and 5 years?
Does anyone know?

DCPS doesn't do projections. They'd rather not know.

I'm only joking a little. There doesn't seem to be a lot of interest in surfacing problems before they reach crisis level.

Perhaps Mayor Bow-Wow can replicate her "Alice Deal for All"platitude by promising "Woodrow Wilson for All." Then simply rename the schools as Woodrow Wilson HS (x campus), etc. Presto! Problem solved.

Please stop referring to her as a dog. It is utterly disrespectful to call a woman, a black woman especially, a dog. We are better than this.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Bought your house in reliance on Wilson access" is not a property right. Even if it was, I want it taken away for the good of the rest of us. Move if you want. I want those kids in Ward 1 or 4 schools, or if (when, right PP!?!) you move away, to have your replacements put their kids there.

You realize this same mentality applies to kids at Lafayette, right? You want "those kids" gone but you think your feeder rights are sacrosanct.

Exactly - for some reason it was easy for some to suggest that eotp kids don't belong (despite their neighborhoods having long been zoned for Deal and Wilson - which, by the way IS in ward 4), but the idea of Lafayette families giving up Wilson is unthinkable.... Um, and I never said it was a "property right" (however that matters).

What's ok for 16th street heights, crestwood, etc, ought to be ok for those families in Chevy Chase DC too.

Hold on there. It was PP at 14:31 who suggested the Lafayette kids be moved but that families who bought EOTP would keep their rights to Deal/Wilson. How is that any more fair than the other way around?

Because the PP at 14:31 brought that up specifically because it would shift a big enough cohort of high-SES kids at once to create a viable high-achieving second DCPS feeder pattern. Just kicking out the grandfathered kids in the Gold Coast and erasing Shepherd feeder rights would be a much smaller cohort and would not move the needle in the same way -- and that's not why DCUM always reverts to kicking out "those kids." If you want to talk about fairness at least compare apples to oranges. 14:31 was trying to come up with a politically disastrous idea that would theoretically result in an additional good school for kids to attend. The "get rid of all those EOTP kids" people are not at all interested in improving outcomes for "those kids."

Anonymous wrote:What about using Fillmore as a PK-only building and taking PK out of all the overcrowded elementary schools? Just offer preference to all the families IB for schools that are losing their PK. Those schools can then turn one PK classroom into an art room, or use other space for art (I just heard Lafayette has a "peace room" whatever that is so don't tell me there's no room) or DCPS can make Ellington share some of its space and bus the kids who currently go to Fillmore there.

A different idea--what if Ellington expanded downwards and took middle schoolers (or even just 8th grade)? It would help with the issue that they allegedly can't find enough talented high schoolers in DC, would take some kids out of Deal and Hardy, and would better fill up its nice new building. The kids could have different schedules and other ways to keep middle and high schoolers separate. And just like BASIS and Latin have an advantage by starting at 5th when other schools start at 6th, Ellington could have an advantage if it started at 8th instead of 9th.

The elementary schools in Ward 3 are not overcrowded - they are large and some people may not like that but they are not overcrowded.

And with the shift of Eaton to Hardy there should be enough middle school seats WOTP for the foreseeable future too.

The problem has always been Wilson - Deal alone is now sending enough students to completely fill Wilson.

You should easily be able to replicate the SES mix at Deal and Wilson by bundling Mt Pleasant, Crestwood, 16th Street Heights, Brightwood, Shepherd Park & Colonial Village into Coolidge or Roosevelt.

I don't think some of the people in these discussions realize how diverse Deal and Wilson are today - sometimes it feels like these Upper NW parents think Deal and Wilson look Sidwell when the reality is far from that.

BTW it is 3.4 miles from Lafayette to Coolidge and 1.5 miles from Lafayette to Wilson - but remember much of the Lafayette district is east of the actual school so there addresses within Lafayette's boundaries that are probably more like 2.5 miles from Coolidge and 2 miles from Wilson. I doubt too many students from Lafayette are walking to Wilson or even taking the bus so going across the park isn't really such a burden.

It is not logistically hard to overnight change the student mix at Coolidge to one that should be palatable for those parents, assuming those parents are ok with the current mix at Wilson which is only 34% white.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Bought your house in reliance on Wilson access" is not a property right. Even if it was, I want it taken away for the good of the rest of us. Move if you want. I want those kids in Ward 1 or 4 schools, or if (when, right PP!?!) you move away, to have your replacements put their kids there.

You realize this same mentality applies to kids at Lafayette, right? You want "those kids" gone but you think your feeder rights are sacrosanct.

Exactly - for some reason it was easy for some to suggest that eotp kids don't belong (despite their neighborhoods having long been zoned for Deal and Wilson - which, by the way IS in ward 4), but the idea of Lafayette families giving up Wilson is unthinkable.... Um, and I never said it was a "property right" (however that matters).

What's ok for 16th street heights, crestwood, etc, ought to be ok for those families in Chevy Chase DC too.

Hold on there. It was PP at 14:31 who suggested the Lafayette kids be moved but that families who bought EOTP would keep their rights to Deal/Wilson. How is that any more fair than the other way around?

What about using Fillmore as a PK-only building and taking PK out of all the overcrowded elementary schools? Just offer preference to all the families IB for schools that are losing their PK. Those schools can then turn one PK classroom into an art room, or use other space for art (I just heard Lafayette has a "peace room" whatever that is so don't tell me there's no room) or DCPS can make Ellington share some of its space and bus the kids who currently go to Fillmore there.

A different idea--what if Ellington expanded downwards and took middle schoolers (or even just 8th grade)? It would help with the issue that they allegedly can't find enough talented high schoolers in DC, would take some kids out of Deal and Hardy, and would better fill up its nice new building. The kids could have different schedules and other ways to keep middle and high schoolers separate. And just like BASIS and Latin have an advantage by starting at 5th when other schools start at 6th, Ellington could have an advantage if it started at 8th instead of 9th.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution isn't just to cut out the east of the park neighborhoods (it's not fair to them - they bought their houses in reliance on the Deal/Wilson right, just like you). And besides, they are a very small portion of the deal/Wilson enrollment.
The only way to create a second (or third) "good" DCPS neighborhood hs option is to split the current wealthy white deal/Wilson population more equally with another feeder pattern. For example, rezone half of Wilson (upper ward 4), including Lafayette, into Coolidge. That will become a high performing high school from day 1. The rich white kids from WOTP won't suffer, and the less advantaged eotp families will finally have a decent chance.
Then, leave the NW neighborhoods south of there, that also traditionally fed into Wilson, at Wilson, and make Roosevelt a magnet/specialty foreign language school that is attractive to the whole city, including students from Adams, Bancroft and Oyster.
Building nice buildings is not enough, and arbitrarily removing families' right to attend Wilson and Deal is unfair unless you give them an equally good option. For this you need socioeconomic and racial diversity to increase the good options for more families.

There is not enough space at Coolidge for Lafayette.

One option would be to send Shepherd there instead. I'd rather see both schools go on to Coolidge together. It's true that New North will be close to capacity quickly if as many kids go there as currently go to grades 6-8 at the feeder ECs. But there is still a ton of room in the high school space that could be turned into an 8th grade wing or used for the self-contained special ed classes or other functions.

Once the middle and high school get close to capacity, take one of the schools that feeds into Coolidge and renovate it into a standalone middle school, adjusting the other elementary boundaries accordingly. This would be part of a wholesale boundary evaluation of the Coolidge and Roosevelt feeder zones, including possibly giving Height its own boundary or using it for a different purpose depending on what the needs are at the time. By that point, the leases on Paul, Cap City, and Friendship Online (which has a building next to Brightwood EC) will also be coming up, allowing DCPS more options in the neighborhood.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what are the actual Wilson numbers?
Current numbers and number projected/estimated in 3 and 5 years?
Does anyone know?

DCPS doesn't do projections. They'd rather not know.

I'm only joking a little. There doesn't seem to be a lot of interest in surfacing problems before they reach crisis level.

Perhaps Mayor Bow-Wow can replicate her "Alice Deal for All"platitude by promising "Woodrow Wilson for All." Then simply rename the schools as Woodrow Wilson HS (x campus), etc. Presto! Problem solved.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution isn't just to cut out the east of the park neighborhoods (it's not fair to them - they bought their houses in reliance on the Deal/Wilson right, just like you). And besides, they are a very small portion of the deal/Wilson enrollment.
The only way to create a second (or third) "good" DCPS neighborhood hs option is to split the current wealthy white deal/Wilson population more equally with another feeder pattern. For example, rezone half of Wilson (upper ward 4), including Lafayette, into Coolidge. That will become a high performing high school from day 1. The rich white kids from WOTP won't suffer, and the less advantaged eotp families will finally have a decent chance.
Then, leave the NW neighborhoods south of there, that also traditionally fed into Wilson, at Wilson, and make Roosevelt a magnet/specialty foreign language school that is attractive to the whole city, including students from Adams, Bancroft and Oyster.
Building nice buildings is not enough, and arbitrarily removing families' right to attend Wilson and Deal is unfair unless you give them an equally good option. For this you need socioeconomic and racial diversity to increase the good options for more families.

There is not enough space at Coolidge for Lafayette.

A decent chance at what? Does sending "less advantaged kids" to school with rich white kids improve outcomes academically for those "less advantaged kids". I thought not, the DC school voucher evaluation showed that.

The schools that took vouchers did not have any appreciable number of rich white kids, so your premise is faulty.

Um, I'm not sticking up for Lafayette.

Basically - set up the zoning based on proximity and capacity. Overfilled Wilson and underfilled Coolidge and Roosevelt are part of one system.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Step 1 - Stop Grandfathered families that are not currently enrolled in Deal / Wilson from enrolling. [Crestwood / 16th St Heights]

Step 2 - Cut option for Bancroft to Deal and move it only to MacFarland

Step 3 - Move Oyster Adams feeder to MacFarland

Easy

Step 3 is my favorite, and would make Step 2 a good idea because there would be a strong Spanish continuation for the kids on that track.

Geographically it makes sense. Politically, DCPS does not give an F.

Don't you mean Oyster Adams to Rossevelt High? Oyster Adams has is a Middle School and McFarland is a Middle School.

I'd suggest sending both Oyster and Bancroft to MacFarland and Roosevelt. Make Adams the grade 2-5 campus and Oyster can have PK-1. This would allow more kids to have a DCPS bilingual education and more of the IB kids could have PK near their homes, which would be popular.

In addition to the steps listed above, I would add a district-wide rule that when people get an OOB spot in the lottery, they only have rights to attend that school through the terminal grade. No right to its destination school. So if you get into Janney OOB, you have no right to Deal or Wilson unless you live IB for it or you get a spot in those schools via the lottery. This would help the Wilson feeder pattern, but would also help other DCPS elementary schools where the most motivated parents leave each year in hope of getting a path they feel good about through 12th grade.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Bought your house in reliance on Wilson access" is not a property right. Even if it was, I want it taken away for the good of the rest of us. Move if you want. I want those kids in Ward 1 or 4 schools, or if (when, right PP!?!) you move away, to have your replacements put their kids there.

You realize this same mentality applies to kids at Lafayette, right? You want "those kids" gone but you think your feeder rights are sacrosanct.

Exactly - for some reason it was easy for some to suggest that eotp kids don't belong (despite their neighborhoods having long been zoned for Deal and Wilson - which, by the way IS in ward 4), but the idea of Lafayette families giving up Wilson is unthinkable.... Um, and I never said it was a "property right" (however that matters).

What's ok for 16th street heights, crestwood, etc, ought to be ok for those families in Chevy Chase DC too.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The solution isn't just to cut out the east of the park neighborhoods (it's not fair to them - they bought their houses in reliance on the Deal/Wilson right, just like you). And besides, they are a very small portion of the deal/Wilson enrollment.
The only way to create a second (or third) "good" DCPS neighborhood hs option is to split the current wealthy white deal/Wilson population more equally with another feeder pattern. For example, rezone half of Wilson (upper ward 4), including Lafayette, into Coolidge. That will become a high performing high school from day 1. The rich white kids from WOTP won't suffer, and the less advantaged eotp families will finally have a decent chance.
Then, leave the NW neighborhoods south of there, that also traditionally fed into Wilson, at Wilson, and make Roosevelt a magnet/specialty foreign language school that is attractive to the whole city, including students from Adams, Bancroft and Oyster.
Building nice buildings is not enough, and arbitrarily removing families' right to attend Wilson and Deal is unfair unless you give them an equally good option. For this you need socioeconomic and racial diversity to increase the good options for more families.

There is not enough space at Coolidge for Lafayette.

A decent chance at what? Does sending "less advantaged kids" to school with rich white kids improve outcomes academically for those "less advantaged kids". I thought not, the DC school voucher evaluation showed that.

Do you mean this report? https://www.urban.org/sites/default/files/publication/96686/the_effect_of_the_dc_school_voucher_program_on_college_enrollment_1.pdf
I think the conclusions are narrower than you suggest - it is only evaluating the benefit of the voucher, not enrollment specifically in economically and racially diverse schools, akin to Wilson. Perhaps kids in the study used these vouchers to enroll in small parochial schools in poor neighborhoods, for example. I'm guessing they were not all able to enroll in the pricier DC privates.

Anonymous wrote:"Bought your house in reliance on Wilson access" is not a property right. Even if it was, I want it taken away for the good of the rest of us. Move if you want. I want those kids in Ward 1 or 4 schools, or if (when, right PP!?!) you move away, to have your replacements put their kids there.

You realize this same mentality applies to kids at Lafayette, right? You want "those kids" gone but you think your feeder rights are sacrosanct.