Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 16:57     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:

Not OP, but THANK YOU for the informative, excellent advice! This is what this board should be for.

A few questions. Can the IB/lottery school refuse the gen ed placement? Can they make you chose between no supports and self-contained, or can you "bargain" for the level of services? Everything I have heard indicates that it's REALLY hard to get a 1:1 aid in a DCPS, so it seems really tough to get the level of needed service in general ed when the recommendation is 20+ hours.

Why are the inclusion classrooms limited to kids transitioning from Strong Start? There aren't any inclusion classrooms available through Early Stages placements?

thanks again!



Developing the IEP is a bargaining process/negotiation. Both parties (the parents and the school/Early Stages) must consent to the IEP for it to be put in place. So I think that in the OP's case, the parent can say, "I do not consent to any placement outside of a general education classroom", and the child will start in the gen ed classroom (with no required supports, although the school could provide some supports outside of the IEP, but they don't have much incentive to do that). But at some point (I'm not sure when) a DCPS can say that they cannot provide the child with an appropriate education in the general ed classroom, and offer a different placement (like a CES classroom). If the parent still refuses to consent, then the fight escalates and parents probably want to get an attorney or advocate. Alternatively, the school could decide that they can provide the child with an appropriate education in the general ed classroom, maybe with some supports. Then the school and the parent can write/rewrite the IEP to say something they can both live with. That's why I suggested that the OP call the school where the child has a slot and talk to the special ed coordinator (or whoever is the point person for special ed services at the school) and see if they can come up with a plan the school and the parents are willing to try out going into the 2018-19 school year. But if the parent demands a 1:1 aide in a general ed classroom, you are right, it is hard for DCPS to agree to that, especially if DCPS has a cheaper program (i.e., a special classroom) that they think would be appropriate for the child. You can see all the special classrooms DCPS can offer in this handbook: https://dcps.dc.gov/node/994272

The inclusion programs in that handbook (such as a seat in a general ed classroom with some support, or the "10:6" classrooms) are not limited to kids coming from Strong Start. Early Stages places kids in those programs. But kids coming from Strong Start were identified (before school age) as needing special education services and had an IFSP which outlined those services before they ever got involved with Early Stages. Those services (they are therapies, not accommodations or things like an aide) are provided to the child at home or at daycare/preschool. Those kids (with IFSPs) have a choice when they reach school age: agree to get all their services through the school system (DCPS or a charter) when the child starts PK3 or keep receiving services through Strong Start as memorialized in an extended IFSP. Once you sign that you want services through the school system, you have signed away your right to an extended IFSP, and you can never get one. (We learned that the hard way.)

So, if you selected the extended IFSP, your child can be in any preschool class (at a CBO, or at a private preschool or daycare) and they will still get their therapies for free. If you don't have an extended IFSP, you can still go to preschool at a CBO or a private preschool, but you won't get any therapies, and you may have to pay tuition. The world of CBO preschool is confusing to me, and apparently, also confusing to everyone at Early Stages and OSSE who I have spoken to. It's unclear which therapies, if any, the CBOs who specialize in inclusion programs will provide to a child who has an IEP but not an IFSP. But I did learn that if you have an extended IFSP, your child can continue to get free therapies in an inclusion preschool class at a CBO, and at least at some CBOs, there will be no tuition. HTH.
Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 13:44     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:PPs: Please list the good private preschiools for kids with language delays (severe enough to be mistaken for autism) that cost $10K a year. I've looked and the only one I found was LEAP at UMD, which the OP should definitely consider (call them now to begin the eval process, OP.) Please post if you know of others.

I went through this process with my own child and I wish there had been someone to explain it to me, without charging me for it like the advocates do. So that's what I'm trying to do below, please excuse the long post. I hope it helps the OP, or someone else.

27.5 hours a week of out-of-the-classroom instruction in DCPS will mean a self-contained (i.e., only special ed children in the class) classroom. Theoretically, determinations for classroom placement should be individualized for each child's needs. Generally, DCPS and charter schools with self contained classes usually push kids into those classrooms if they have more than 16 hours of out-of-classroom education in their IEP.

If you got a preschool slot in the lottery, you can go to that school, describe your son's needs/strengths, and tell them you'd like to re-write the IEP to place your child in a general ed classroom with whatever supports you and the school agree are appropriate. The school may go along with that, or they may balk and say that they cannot appropriately educate your child (based on what they know if him from his current IEP) and encourage you to take the CES placement Early Stages found for you. You won't know until you have met with the school's Special Education Coordinator. Call the school now to try to get a meeting with that person before school gets out for the summer.

If the school you've lotteried into balks and you feel strongly opposed to the Early Stages placement, I would either a) find an advocate and get ready to fight for a spot in the gen ed classroom at that school, or b) place your child in a different school which agrees to a general ed placement with whatever supports you think are needed. Generally, charters without self contained classrooms are going to be the most amenable to putting your child in their gen ed classroom with supports, because the only other option for them is suggesting a private placement. Check on myschooldc to see if any charters acceptable to you have a small waitlist, and add those schools to your list (you can do this without giving up the spot you already have gotten through the lottery. Call myschool dc if you have questions on how to do this.) You can call any school before you put them on your lottery list and ask if they have self contained classrooms for preschoolers with IEPs. Most don't. (We considered this option at Friendship Armstrong a year ago -- at that time they had a short PK waitlist, no self contained rooms, and a nice preschool program. There are likely other similar charters, but they may not be convenient to you.) Once you are offered a spot at such a charter, contact the Special Ed Coordinator to discuss your child, the IEP, and how they will meet his needs. At that meeting, express your preference for the general education classroom with whatever supports you think are necessary.

Note that Bridges is likely not going to be a good school for you for two reasons:
1) you have to get a seat in the general ed classroom through the lottery, and they already have a long waitlist for preschool gen ed seats, and
2) Bridges has self-contained preschool classrooms and will likely try to push your child into one of those.

Also note that most private preschools will not offer your child any supports, and by law, they don't have to. There are some private "general ed" preschools offer some supports for kids with certain levels of special needs. St. Columba's and NCRC come to mind. But they cost quite a bit more than $10/year, and NCRC isn't even full day. (And they don't offer speech therapy, so you'll have to pay for that out of pocket. And they are already full for next year anyway.) Various Community Based Organizations ("CBOs") in DC also have inclusion preschool programs, but it's hard to go that route without an extended IFSP through Strong Start. (I'm assuming that because Early Stages was evaluating your child for an IEP that you have already signed away your rights to an extended IFSP. You can call your Strong Start case manager to find out if you're not sure.) I can share info I have on various CBOs if you want, let me know if so.

Again, I'd love to hear about options other than LEAP for under $10K a year, because I haven't found them. The closest I found were part time coop preschools, mostly affiliated with synagogues, which offer no support and fill up quickly. (The ones we applied to are all full now, but it doesn't hurt to call coops convenient to you if you're OK with the part time/coop model, can do all your therapies privately, and your child will be OK without any support in the classroom.)

Also OP: please get your child evaluated by a developmental pediatrician, so you have a second professional opinion about their needs/strengths. Right now all you have is your own (unprofessional and likely biased) opinion, and Early Stages' opinion (which could arguably fall short of being "professional", but still . . . ) You need some guidance about your son's needs from a professional you can trust. If you can afford it, I'd recommend starting private speech therapy with someone the developmental pediatrician recommends asap. (Ask the Dev. Ped. for multiple recommendations.) Occupational therapy too, if your child has handwriting issues (I can't recall if it was the OP who said that, or another poster).

Good luck!



Not OP, but THANK YOU for the informative, excellent advice! This is what this board should be for.

A few questions. Can the IB/lottery school refuse the gen ed placement? Can they make you chose between no supports and self-contained, or can you "bargain" for the level of services? Everything I have heard indicates that it's REALLY hard to get a 1:1 aid in a DCPS, so it seems really tough to get the level of needed service in general ed when the recommendation is 20+ hours.

Why are the inclusion classrooms limited to kids transitioning from Strong Start? There aren't any inclusion classrooms available through Early Stages placements?

thanks again!

Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 13:30     Subject: Early Stages Autism Classification
If you consider it severe enough to look like ASD, child should be in LEAP or another specialized program and not a private preschool. I have listed several times the one we did but I wouldn't recommend them anymore as they've had a change of staff with the owner change and the old staff was what made it good. There are a lot of Catholic schools that are under $10K. Many of them have resource teachers.

You are correct most don't offer supports. You either get them through the public or go private.

At 3, in less you are doing LEAP or another specialized program, and there are very few in this area for language issues, you are better off keeping your child home and doing intensive speech therapy.
Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 13:25     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
PPs: Please list the good private preschiools for kids with language delays (severe enough to be mistaken for autism) that cost $10K a year. I've looked and the only one I found was LEAP at UMD, which the OP should definitely consider (call them now to begin the eval process, OP.) Please post if you know of others.

I went through this process with my own child and I wish there had been someone to explain it to me, without charging me for it like the advocates do. So that's what I'm trying to do below, please excuse the long post. I hope it helps the OP, or someone else.

27.5 hours a week of out-of-the-classroom instruction in DCPS will mean a self-contained (i.e., only special ed children in the class) classroom. Theoretically, determinations for classroom placement should be individualized for each child's needs. Generally, DCPS and charter schools with self contained classes usually push kids into those classrooms if they have more than 16 hours of out-of-classroom education in their IEP.

If you got a preschool slot in the lottery, you can go to that school, describe your son's needs/strengths, and tell them you'd like to re-write the IEP to place your child in a general ed classroom with whatever supports you and the school agree are appropriate. The school may go along with that, or they may balk and say that they cannot appropriately educate your child (based on what they know if him from his current IEP) and encourage you to take the CES placement Early Stages found for you. You won't know until you have met with the school's Special Education Coordinator. Call the school now to try to get a meeting with that person before school gets out for the summer.

If the school you've lotteried into balks and you feel strongly opposed to the Early Stages placement, I would either a) find an advocate and get ready to fight for a spot in the gen ed classroom at that school, or b) place your child in a different school which agrees to a general ed placement with whatever supports you think are needed. Generally, charters without self contained classrooms are going to be the most amenable to putting your child in their gen ed classroom with supports, because the only other option for them is suggesting a private placement. Check on myschooldc to see if any charters acceptable to you have a small waitlist, and add those schools to your list (you can do this without giving up the spot you already have gotten through the lottery. Call myschool dc if you have questions on how to do this.) You can call any school before you put them on your lottery list and ask if they have self contained classrooms for preschoolers with IEPs. Most don't. (We considered this option at Friendship Armstrong a year ago -- at that time they had a short PK waitlist, no self contained rooms, and a nice preschool program. There are likely other similar charters, but they may not be convenient to you.) Once you are offered a spot at such a charter, contact the Special Ed Coordinator to discuss your child, the IEP, and how they will meet his needs. At that meeting, express your preference for the general education classroom with whatever supports you think are necessary.

Note that Bridges is likely not going to be a good school for you for two reasons:
1) you have to get a seat in the general ed classroom through the lottery, and they already have a long waitlist for preschool gen ed seats, and
2) Bridges has self-contained preschool classrooms and will likely try to push your child into one of those.

Also note that most private preschools will not offer your child any supports, and by law, they don't have to. There are some private "general ed" preschools offer some supports for kids with certain levels of special needs. St. Columba's and NCRC come to mind. But they cost quite a bit more than $10/year, and NCRC isn't even full day. (And they don't offer speech therapy, so you'll have to pay for that out of pocket. And they are already full for next year anyway.) Various Community Based Organizations ("CBOs") in DC also have inclusion preschool programs, but it's hard to go that route without an extended IFSP through Strong Start. (I'm assuming that because Early Stages was evaluating your child for an IEP that you have already signed away your rights to an extended IFSP. You can call your Strong Start case manager to find out if you're not sure.) I can share info I have on various CBOs if you want, let me know if so.

Again, I'd love to hear about options other than LEAP for under $10K a year, because I haven't found them. The closest I found were part time coop preschools, mostly affiliated with synagogues, which offer no support and fill up quickly. (The ones we applied to are all full now, but it doesn't hurt to call coops convenient to you if you're OK with the part time/coop model, can do all your therapies privately, and your child will be OK without any support in the classroom.)

Also OP: please get your child evaluated by a developmental pediatrician, so you have a second professional opinion about their needs/strengths. Right now all you have is your own (unprofessional and likely biased) opinion, and Early Stages' opinion (which could arguably fall short of being "professional", but still . . . ) You need some guidance about your son's needs from a professional you can trust. If you can afford it, I'd recommend starting private speech therapy with someone the developmental pediatrician recommends asap. (Ask the Dev. Ped. for multiple recommendations.) Occupational therapy too, if your child has handwriting issues (I can't recall if it was the OP who said that, or another poster).

Good luck!





Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 13:12     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.



Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.



WHAT?!?! cost???? 10k a year and you are now arguing cost of evaluation is prohibitive? Please make your argument more cohesive.


I am arguing if you know your child's needs and they have been assessed, you can spend that money to actually get their needs met - private school, therapies, tutors or spend it on another evaluation, fighting the system with advocates and consultants that will take at least 6-9 months in which kids lose a lot of time and supports and that assumes that you will get the IEP your child needs but more importantly the school will follow it. Our IEP is a joke, our services are a joke, the supports at school in public are a joke.


Get your arguments straight. You argued in another post that the school does good assessments and then you have your own assessment, then you argue with the school and get another assessment?


I have never argued that the school gives good assessments nor are we pleased with any public services. They've all been a waste of time.

You said the school gave assessments, which was a reason to spend money on private school and therapies rather than do your own assessments. But if the school didn't do a good assessment, why is that a reason not to do your own?
Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 13:10     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.


Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.

Because without an evaluation, there is a very good chance that you and the teacher are missing something important.


No, we aren't missing anything. Publics do lots of testing, you see your child's grades and if you supplement at home, you know where your child is and what they need. Kids need good evaluations but not every 6-12 months. They need a few good ones early on and then as needed. Not all kids with language or other issues have academic issues but need supports due to their disability.


Public school testing is often inadequate unless your child's needs are very simple or you have no disagreement with the school. Nobody gets a neuropsych every 6 to 12 months, that's insane. Every three years is recommended but not everybody needs even that. If your kid has a language disorder but you haven't gotten a neuropsych, then there is a very good chance you missed something.

Also many of us have issues at home as well as school, and that adds an extra wrinkle to everything.


You are protecting your advice onto others assuming the situations are similar. Yes, if kids are struggling at home and school, its good to get an evaluation. Some of us do know what is going on and what is needed so a new evaluation offers nothing at the present time. Some of us don't have struggles at home. OP should get a private evaluation if there has not been one but OP never said. OP should also get private services as well as the school is not going to provide enough for a child with language needs.


I am not projecting anything. OP made clear she has not any private evaluations and autism is suspected. In such cases, an assessment for autism is a good idea. If your kid has a language disorder it's a good idea to get a neuropsych to look for needs, because so many kids have more than one SN. "Knowing what is going on" is not a substitute for thorough testing. It just isn't. Maybe it worked out for you, but it's bad advice in general.


Not all kids with language disorders have academic or other issues. I'm not understanding why you don't understand it.

I never said all kids with language issues have academic or other issues. I am not sure why you don't understand that.


If a child is at or above grade level on every subject, then what exactly is one looking for. How would that be a good use of money.
[/quotes]
Lot's of kids with learning disabilities perform at or above grade level. They learn to compensate for their disability, which works for a time, but it often catches up to them eventually, and creates more problems than would have otherwise occurred with earlier intervention.

If there are no behavioral issues at home or school, how would that be a good use of money.

Obviously, if there are no behavioral issues, then don't worry about it.


OP child is young. You don't do a neuropsych on a child that age. Its not developmentally appropriate.

I didn't say do a neuropsych on a child that age. That comment was for older kids, where something might have been missed by earlier, less comprehensive assessments. In OP's case, an assessment for autism is a good idea now. Future testing depends on how he develops.


Nor is it appropriate to assume a 3 year old will have learning differences.

Not appropriate to assume they won't. It's something that should be tested for later. Even if the child is at or above grade level, he could still have one. Many kids with one SN have another. I don't know the percentage, but it is very high, perhaps over 50%.
Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 12:36     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.


Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.

Because without an evaluation, there is a very good chance that you and the teacher are missing something important.


No, we aren't missing anything. Publics do lots of testing, you see your child's grades and if you supplement at home, you know where your child is and what they need. Kids need good evaluations but not every 6-12 months. They need a few good ones early on and then as needed. Not all kids with language or other issues have academic issues but need supports due to their disability.


Public school testing is often inadequate unless your child's needs are very simple or you have no disagreement with the school. Nobody gets a neuropsych every 6 to 12 months, that's insane. Every three years is recommended but not everybody needs even that. If your kid has a language disorder but you haven't gotten a neuropsych, then there is a very good chance you missed something.

Also many of us have issues at home as well as school, and that adds an extra wrinkle to everything.


You are protecting your advice onto others assuming the situations are similar. Yes, if kids are struggling at home and school, its good to get an evaluation. Some of us do know what is going on and what is needed so a new evaluation offers nothing at the present time. Some of us don't have struggles at home. OP should get a private evaluation if there has not been one but OP never said. OP should also get private services as well as the school is not going to provide enough for a child with language needs.


I am not projecting anything. OP made clear she has not any private evaluations and autism is suspected. In such cases, an assessment for autism is a good idea. If your kid has a language disorder it's a good idea to get a neuropsych to look for needs, because so many kids have more than one SN. "Knowing what is going on" is not a substitute for thorough testing. It just isn't. Maybe it worked out for you, but it's bad advice in general.


Not all kids with language disorders have academic or other issues. I'm not understanding why you don't understand it. If a child is at or above grade level on every subject, then what exactly is one looking for. How would that be a good use of money. If there are no behavioral issues at home or school, how would that be a good use of money.

OP child is young. You don't do a neuropsych on a child that age. Its not developmentally appropriate. Nor is it appropriate to assume a 3 year old will have learning differences.
Anonymous
Post 05/29/2018 12:35     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.



Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.



WHAT?!?! cost???? 10k a year and you are now arguing cost of evaluation is prohibitive? Please make your argument more cohesive.


I am arguing if you know your child's needs and they have been assessed, you can spend that money to actually get their needs met - private school, therapies, tutors or spend it on another evaluation, fighting the system with advocates and consultants that will take at least 6-9 months in which kids lose a lot of time and supports and that assumes that you will get the IEP your child needs but more importantly the school will follow it. Our IEP is a joke, our services are a joke, the supports at school in public are a joke.


Get your arguments straight. You argued in another post that the school does good assessments and then you have your own assessment, then you argue with the school and get another assessment?


I have never argued that the school gives good assessments nor are we pleased with any public services. They've all been a waste of time.
Anonymous
Post 05/28/2018 21:30     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.


Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.

Because without an evaluation, there is a very good chance that you and the teacher are missing something important.


No, we aren't missing anything. Publics do lots of testing, you see your child's grades and if you supplement at home, you know where your child is and what they need. Kids need good evaluations but not every 6-12 months. They need a few good ones early on and then as needed. Not all kids with language or other issues have academic issues but need supports due to their disability.


Public school testing is often inadequate unless your child's needs are very simple or you have no disagreement with the school. Nobody gets a neuropsych every 6 to 12 months, that's insane. Every three years is recommended but not everybody needs even that. If your kid has a language disorder but you haven't gotten a neuropsych, then there is a very good chance you missed something.

Also many of us have issues at home as well as school, and that adds an extra wrinkle to everything.


You are protecting your advice onto others assuming the situations are similar. Yes, if kids are struggling at home and school, its good to get an evaluation. Some of us do know what is going on and what is needed so a new evaluation offers nothing at the present time. Some of us don't have struggles at home. OP should get a private evaluation if there has not been one but OP never said. OP should also get private services as well as the school is not going to provide enough for a child with language needs.


I am not projecting anything. OP made clear she has not any private evaluations and autism is suspected. In such cases, an assessment for autism is a good idea. If your kid has a language disorder it's a good idea to get a neuropsych to look for needs, because so many kids have more than one SN. "Knowing what is going on" is not a substitute for thorough testing. It just isn't. Maybe it worked out for you, but it's bad advice in general.
Anonymous
Post 05/28/2018 21:21     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.



Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.



WHAT?!?! cost???? 10k a year and you are now arguing cost of evaluation is prohibitive? Please make your argument more cohesive.


I am arguing if you know your child's needs and they have been assessed, you can spend that money to actually get their needs met - private school, therapies, tutors or spend it on another evaluation, fighting the system with advocates and consultants that will take at least 6-9 months in which kids lose a lot of time and supports and that assumes that you will get the IEP your child needs but more importantly the school will follow it. Our IEP is a joke, our services are a joke, the supports at school in public are a joke.


Get your arguments straight. You argued in another post that the school does good assessments and then you have your own assessment, then you argue with the school and get another assessment?
Anonymous
Post 05/28/2018 21:21     Subject: Re:Early Stages Autism Classification
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP you will find the preschool programs vary widely. You definitely want to check them out.

When I was in Florida, my son was in a preschool for kids with language delays. It was brilliant and he started putting together phrases immediately.

Then we moved, and he was in a special ed preschool in the morning, and a regular preschool in the afternoon. At conference time, the special ed teacher told me he was severely delayed, likely autistic, didn't know any of his colors or letters and didn't play with anyone.

The next day, I had a conference at the typical preschool. The teacher told me he was doing wonderfully knew all his letters and colors, played with everyone, and was the smartest kid in the room!


Same kid. Different teachers. Different programs. Different preconceived notions.


It's also true that many regular ed teachers aren't as aware of subtle ASD characteristics if the child is bright and high functioning.


The point is that feedback from non-experts doesn't always give you the best information. I found this to be true in preschool -- the teachers were either bizarrely off the mark; or just wanted to keep parents happy and would give positive feedback only. The best preschool teacher we had for feedback had preciously been a DCPS sped teacher, who both understood what disabilities "look like" and also what the K classroom demands.

WTF does this have to do with this post?

When you get widely varying reports from different teachers, it's helpful to have an educational consultant observe both classes.


Some publics, like ours would never let an educational consultant in and the best response would be for child to stay at the private where they are thriving as clearly the public set up is not meeting the child's needs. We did't go to a SN school with SN teachers and it was far better. They were patient, kind and took the time to actually teach, which publics no longer do. Structured/repetitive learning is often best for language kids, which is why Montessori's and other less structured programs are not recommended, and things like centers are not best either.

Not everyone can afford private. I've never had a problem getting a consultant to observe in public school, and if a school ever refused the request, I would push back really hard.


The privates we have been at are $10K and often they have financial aide if you need. it. Cheaper than an evaluation and consultant/advocate. And, better.


Why would you avoid an evaluation? That makes no sense. And there are no 10k privates in the DC area.


No need to avoid one but cost and need. We know our child’s strengths and needs. Teacher agrees. So, why do more when we have done plenty. Plus if child is in regular services the needs should present there.

Because without an evaluation, there is a very good chance that you and the teacher are missing something important.


No, we aren't missing anything. Publics do lots of testing, you see your child's grades and if you supplement at home, you know where your child is and what they need. Kids need good evaluations but not every 6-12 months. They need a few good ones early on and then as needed. Not all kids with language or other issues have academic issues but need supports due to their disability.


Public school testing is often inadequate unless your child's needs are very simple or you have no disagreement with the school. Nobody gets a neuropsych every 6 to 12 months, that's insane. Every three years is recommended but not everybody needs even that. If your kid has a language disorder but you haven't gotten a neuropsych, then there is a very good chance you missed something.

Also many of us have issues at home as well as school, and that adds an extra wrinkle to everything.


You are protecting your advice onto others assuming the situations are similar. Yes, if kids are struggling at home and school, its good to get an evaluation. Some of us do know what is going on and what is needed so a new evaluation offers nothing at the present time. Some of us don't have struggles at home. OP should get a private evaluation if there has not been one but OP never said. OP should also get private services as well as the school is not going to provide enough for a child with language needs.