Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 11:57     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I have found that with some White people, this idea of integration and inclusion is a sham. The reason being that the “default” standard for integration is based on White norms. In other words, Whites want POC who integrate to meet them on their playing field – meet them in their safe space. The question I have for Whites who somehow think these types of ceremonies are divisive is whether you are willing to “cross the aisle” in the name of inclusion and integration. Would you join a Black church? How about a Black sorority? Would you join an Asian chamber of commerce organization? Or is it that you expect POC to abandon their traditions and norms to integrate with you? Just curious. Instead of condemning these ceremonies, ask if you can attend. My grad school roommate was Asian and I attended the university’s Asian celebration to support her. Her family and others there appreciated that I was willing to embrace what they were doing and support her.


You make a good point and cool that you put yourself out there like that.

You know, when black people have a separate event, many white people get bent out of shape. Those same people couldn't care less if asians or hispanics have a similar type event. Some people just don't like what they see. They see the crime, they see the riots, they see the black people constantly complaining, suck at school, acting like animals at times. Hell, young guys can't even pull their pants up. When you see this crap for decades, you eventually just get sick of it.

These are massive generalizations, but they are true. This has nothing to do with you or anyone on an individual level. There will be tons of people that will be combative and talk sh*t, but we all see this BS more among black people than any other group. If white people, or anyone for that matter, says they have a great, positive opinion of the black community, they are lying to you. I'm sure there are many positive attributes as well, but relative to other groups, not so much. So that is why I think you see the double standard. Peoples perceptions will change when they start liking what they see.

On a positive note, race relations are much improved since I was a kid and there are a LOT more African Americans in the burbs/middle class than ever before. And no, I didn't vote for Trump and I've banged women of every race/demographic, even 1 fat one.


I am not sure why that would apply here. First off, many people on this forum have said that there is no "THE Black community." Blacks are not a monolith. This is a graduation celebration at an elite university. It is utterly ridiculous that someone would lump them in with anyone else just because they are Black. If people cannot draw the distinction between individual Black people, that is their prejudice. These students are not rioting or committing crimes. They are doing what many Whites are urging Blacks to do - be educated, be professional and set high goals. Most of us do not really care if Whites "like what they see" but this is exactly what they SHOULD be liking. According to many Whites, these students are doing what they say "THE" Black community should be doing. Yet, they are being criticized because in celebrating their accomplishments, they are having a ceremony IN ADDITION to the larger one. They are not "segregating" themselves by skipping the larger one - they are attending both. It is absolutely crazy that people are so in a tizzy about this. It is puzzling.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 11:44     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I have found that with some White people, this idea of integration and inclusion is a sham. The reason being that the “default” standard for integration is based on White norms. In other words, Whites want POC who integrate to meet them on their playing field – meet them in their safe space. The question I have for Whites who somehow think these types of ceremonies are divisive is whether you are willing to “cross the aisle” in the name of inclusion and integration. Would you join a Black church? How about a Black sorority? Would you join an Asian chamber of commerce organization? Or is it that you expect POC to abandon their traditions and norms to integrate with you? Just curious. Instead of condemning these ceremonies, ask if you can attend. My grad school roommate was Asian and I attended the university’s Asian celebration to support her. Her family and others there appreciated that I was willing to embrace what they were doing and support her.


There is just the norm, not the black or white or brown norm. And yes, the norm today is predominantly driven by the historic prevalence of white culture, but that is changing fairly quickly (relative to the past). So you can take a seat at the table and put your imprint on how the norm will evolve or you can have your own table in the dining hall, your own fraternities, your own ceremonies, etc. Nobody is saying that every minority group shouldn't be loud and proud about their own culture and celebrate any way they choose, but you seem intent on segregation. And your false equivalencies about the "crossing the aisle" are just infantile. BTw, you might want to study how the LGBTQ community managed to change the norm in a remarkable fashion regarding same-sex marriage. It wasn't too many years ago that Obama, Clinton and the entire democratic establishment were firmly against this issue. But by engaging with the mainstream and educating and socializing, the LGBTQ community has now made same-sex marriage part of the mainstream ideology. That's called progress. What you're advocating is a regressive, dead-end approach. But go ahead and hold steadfast to your belief, witness zero progress towards racial unity and then blame everybody but yourself.


You actually just proved my point. And the "infantile" remarks and the like are totally un-called for. But that is the DCUM way. I disagree with you personally, so let me insult you. Cool. Just realize that is more a reflection on you than it is me.

What is racial unity? Define it. Because based on comments like this - that is "whitewashing" (no pun intended). What I want is the acceptance and embracing of diversity. We are different. There is not a dang thing wrong with that. But our differences do not make us inferior or superior to one another. And we can appreciate the differences that we have and the resulting different experiences and perspectives. Being pro-POC is not being anti-White. It's not that hard.

I am not intent on segregation. What I am intent on is being able to celebrate my tradition without someone accusing me of wanting segregation. Instead of sitting there criticizing me, come sit and MY table and participate. But you would rather me come to your table or you would rather stand there and criticize me for having my own table.

Ironically, my DD's college had a LGBTQ student graduation celebration also. Guess that was wrong too.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 11:09     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:I have found that with some White people, this idea of integration and inclusion is a sham. The reason being that the “default” standard for integration is based on White norms. In other words, Whites want POC who integrate to meet them on their playing field – meet them in their safe space. The question I have for Whites who somehow think these types of ceremonies are divisive is whether you are willing to “cross the aisle” in the name of inclusion and integration. Would you join a Black church? How about a Black sorority? Would you join an Asian chamber of commerce organization? Or is it that you expect POC to abandon their traditions and norms to integrate with you? Just curious. Instead of condemning these ceremonies, ask if you can attend. My grad school roommate was Asian and I attended the university’s Asian celebration to support her. Her family and others there appreciated that I was willing to embrace what they were doing and support her.


There is just the norm, not the black or white or brown norm. And yes, the norm today is predominantly driven by the historic prevalence of white culture, but that is changing fairly quickly (relative to the past). So you can take a seat at the table and put your imprint on how the norm will evolve or you can have your own table in the dining hall, your own fraternities, your own ceremonies, etc. Nobody is saying that every minority group shouldn't be loud and proud about their own culture and celebrate any way they choose, but you seem intent on segregation. And your false equivalencies about the "crossing the aisle" are just infantile. BTw, you might want to study how the LGBTQ community managed to change the norm in a remarkable fashion regarding same-sex marriage. It wasn't too many years ago that Obama, Clinton and the entire democratic establishment were firmly against this issue. But by engaging with the mainstream and educating and socializing, the LGBTQ community has now made same-sex marriage part of the mainstream ideology. That's called progress. What you're advocating is a regressive, dead-end approach. But go ahead and hold steadfast to your belief, witness zero progress towards racial unity and then blame everybody but yourself.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 10:58     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:I have found that with some White people, this idea of integration and inclusion is a sham. The reason being that the “default” standard for integration is based on White norms. In other words, Whites want POC who integrate to meet them on their playing field – meet them in their safe space. The question I have for Whites who somehow think these types of ceremonies are divisive is whether you are willing to “cross the aisle” in the name of inclusion and integration. Would you join a Black church? How about a Black sorority? Would you join an Asian chamber of commerce organization? Or is it that you expect POC to abandon their traditions and norms to integrate with you? Just curious. Instead of condemning these ceremonies, ask if you can attend. My grad school roommate was Asian and I attended the university’s Asian celebration to support her. Her family and others there appreciated that I was willing to embrace what they were doing and support her.


You make a good point and cool that you put yourself out there like that.

You know, when black people have a separate event, many white people get bent out of shape. Those same people couldn't care less if asians or hispanics have a similar type event. Some people just don't like what they see. They see the crime, they see the riots, they see the black people constantly complaining, suck at school, acting like animals at times. Hell, young guys can't even pull their pants up. When you see this crap for decades, you eventually just get sick of it.

These are massive generalizations, but they are true. This has nothing to do with you or anyone on an individual level. There will be tons of people that will be combative and talk sh*t, but we all see this BS more among black people than any other group. If white people, or anyone for that matter, says they have a great, positive opinion of the black community, they are lying to you. I'm sure there are many positive attributes as well, but relative to other groups, not so much. So that is why I think you see the double standard. Peoples perceptions will change when they start liking what they see.

On a positive note, race relations are much improved since I was a kid and there are a LOT more African Americans in the burbs/middle class than ever before. And no, I didn't vote for Trump and I've banged women of every race/demographic, even 1 fat one.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 10:35     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Let's hear from the students, shall we?
Their opinions do matter don't they?
I mean they're the ones attending Harvard...

Michael Huggins, president of the Harvard Black Graduate Student Alliance, began organizing the event after finishing his first year at the Kennedy School, where he noticed an absence of programming to connect black graduates across disciplines. Huggins completed his bachelor’s degree at Stanford from 2010, where he noted a “long tradition” of similar graduation ceremonies for black alumni.
“I think there’s so many good opportunities to build networks, to build fellowship, to build community,” Huggins said. “This is an opportunity to hear stories that are often not told.”

Kristin A. Turner, president of the Harvard Black Law Students Association, said the event looks to help black students “claim our visibility” at the University, an institution that has historically been majority white.
“We chose Black Commencement as not only a commemoration of all the different dynamics that go into being a person of color at Harvard University, but also a celebration of what an accomplishment it is to come out on the other side,” Turner said.

Four students, who will all graduate later this month, were selected to speak at the event and will highlight various parts of the black student experience at Harvard, according to Huggins and Courtney A. Woods, a student at the Graduate School of Education. Woods said her own speech will discuss “what it means to walk across the stage and symbolically bringing my family, my community.”

Organizers of the event said this history often complicated their experiences at Harvard.
“I will be frank and say that of course there have been times where I’ve felt isolated,” Woods said. “But that doesn’t mean that my experience at Harvard is something I don’t want to remember and cherish for the rest of my life.”

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2017/5/10/black-commencement-event/
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 10:29     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Have none of you been on an Ivy graduation recently? Why do multicultural events bother you? Do you mind when the frats (which are often extremely racially and economically segregated) have their own graduation events? Is it racist for your (mono-ethnic) family to have an all-white graduation party?

Graduation is a happy time and everyone celebrates any way they want to. Harvard is not the only Ivy to have multicultural graduation events. The largest ones are Asian. There are Lavender and Native American and First Generation and Black and Latino graduations at many schools. Its just a chance for each community to get together and honor each other.


Thank you for being a voice of reason.


This times a million. I find it interesting, having attended an SEC school whose white greek system was fairly racist and exclusionary, I find it funny to see the uproar.


So, your reasoning here is that because White people have the greek system and are racist and exclusionary, it is reasonable to accept that minorities can behave the same way.


There is a different in a "graduation event," as in a graduation party or celebration, versus a separate and exclusionary graduation ceremony, sponsored officially by the school.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 10:25     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Yet some folks are cheering them saying yes, what a great idea yet Dr. Martin Luther King said

I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.

Yet the black community, the hispanic community continue to push separate things as the first this the first that instead of just talking about the accomplishment.

Well done


The day Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. looked to, when people wouldn't be judged by the color of their skin, has yet to come. Until then, it makes perfect sense to me that racial and ethnic minorities would want to congregate with others in their group.


Right! Because "that day" will only come by magic... we will all just wake up one day and there will be a perfect, colorblind world! Hosting events like this does not impede the "coming of that day" one little bit, not in the least, no sir, it does not.

(Idiot.)
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 10:18     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:I have found that with some White people, this idea of integration and inclusion is a sham. The reason being that the “default” standard for integration is based on White norms. In other words, Whites want POC who integrate to meet them on their playing field – meet them in their safe space. The question I have for Whites who somehow think these types of ceremonies are divisive is whether you are willing to “cross the aisle” in the name of inclusion and integration. Would you join a Black church? How about a Black sorority? Would you join an Asian chamber of commerce organization? Or is it that you expect POC to abandon their traditions and norms to integrate with you? Just curious. Instead of condemning these ceremonies, ask if you can attend. My grad school roommate was Asian and I attended the university’s Asian celebration to support her. Her family and others there appreciated that I was willing to embrace what they were doing and support her.


This!

Go read the AAP thread on TJ admissions or any TJ related discussion. It quickly devolves into whites blaming Asians for overly preparing their kids to take over their seats at TJ. If TJ were 30% Asian instead of 70, they wouldn't mind. Never mind that the majority-white FCPS board and community has done squat to improve participation of Blacks and Hispanics at TJ. They need more groups to change the playing field.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 10:10     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
I have found that with some White people, this idea of integration and inclusion is a sham. The reason being that the “default” standard for integration is based on White norms. In other words, Whites want POC who integrate to meet them on their playing field – meet them in their safe space. The question I have for Whites who somehow think these types of ceremonies are divisive is whether you are willing to “cross the aisle” in the name of inclusion and integration. Would you join a Black church? How about a Black sorority? Would you join an Asian chamber of commerce organization? Or is it that you expect POC to abandon their traditions and norms to integrate with you? Just curious. Instead of condemning these ceremonies, ask if you can attend. My grad school roommate was Asian and I attended the university’s Asian celebration to support her. Her family and others there appreciated that I was willing to embrace what they were doing and support her.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 09:16     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For the past 5 years or so, our country has been going backwards. More division, more separation, and it's generally applauded and welcomed. Whenever somebody creates a new event or program for one race or ethnicity, it is held up in the name of "diversity" when it's actually segregation. I just don't get it.


Backwards since Obama became president.


Yes, Whites somehow think the racial relations have gotten worse. Most POC would say that because the POTUS was a POC, Whites had to deal with race more often and, thus, to them it appears that way. Whites used to have the option of dealing with race when they wanted to instead of having to read and hear about it all the time. POC have always had to deal with it so I cannot say things have gotten worse or better. I did not have the option of being oblivious. As a POC, I will say that I want to be treated fairly and I want my kids to be afforded the same opportunities. Yet, I am a POC, I am proud of it and I do not want to abandon my own traditions in the guise of integration. Whites seem to think that being pro-POC is being anti-White. They also seem to be hurt that POC don't want to be "integrated" in ALL aspects of life - ignoring that EXCLUSION of POC is why these traditions evolved in the first place.

People, these ceremonies are not some statement against White people. It is the celebration of accomplishment and shared experience of being a POC at a PWI. Interestingly enough, my DD attended a HBCU professional school. The 20 or so White students in her class had an end of the year dinner just for them - no one batted an eye.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 07:53     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:...and a Jewish Student Graduation Celebration at U of Wisconsin:

Celebrate your graduation with friends and family at Hillel!

On Friday, May 12, 2017 at 11 AM, graduates and their families will join us for a celebratory brunch. Immediately following the brunch, at 12 PM, we will join together for a short ceremony recognizing graduates. An esteemed member of the University of Wisconsin administration will join us and a specially selected graduating senior will speak. Click here to register for our graduation celebration.

A wine and cheese reception follows the ceremony.

Graduation Shabbat


That's a lot different from what we're discussing here. But I wouldn't expect a University of Wisconsin graduate to be able to see that.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 07:47     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:For the past 5 years or so, our country has been going backwards. More division, more separation, and it's generally applauded and welcomed. Whenever somebody creates a new event or program for one race or ethnicity, it is held up in the name of "diversity" when it's actually segregation. I just don't get it.


Backwards since Obama became president.


Under Obama it was OK to have separate black conferences at the government agencies. Totally inappropriate!!!
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 07:31     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
Anonymous wrote:For the past 5 years or so, our country has been going backwards. More division, more separation, and it's generally applauded and welcomed. Whenever somebody creates a new event or program for one race or ethnicity, it is held up in the name of "diversity" when it's actually segregation. I just don't get it.


Backwards since Obama became president.
Anonymous
Post 05/12/2017 06:31     Subject: Harvard's Black Commencement
For the past 5 years or so, our country has been going backwards. More division, more separation, and it's generally applauded and welcomed. Whenever somebody creates a new event or program for one race or ethnicity, it is held up in the name of "diversity" when it's actually segregation. I just don't get it.
Anonymous
Post 05/11/2017 23:04     Subject: Re:Harvard's Black Commencement
I'm surprised there are so many people opposed to the black graduation on a liberal site like this.
I do think a lot of people don't view black people in general as inviting as other groups like Hispanics.