Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The universe may be giving you a gift of no children right now so that you aren't stuck with him. Get out. Focus on yourself and being a good person. Your life will improve and you can be happy!

I was thinking this too. And as another PP mentioned, seems like the reasons you give for staying with him are fear based- fear of being alone, fear of not having kids, fear of starting over. Try to make decisions based on love, not fear (includes love for yourself and any future children).
I feel for you, OP. I was in a similar situation a little over a decade ago. You have my thoughts and prayers. Best to you.

OP here - how did it work out for you?

Anonymous wrote:The universe may be giving you a gift of no children right now so that you aren't stuck with him. Get out. Focus on yourself and being a good person. Your life will improve and you can be happy!

I was thinking this too. And as another PP mentioned, seems like the reasons you give for staying with him are fear based- fear of being alone, fear of not having kids, fear of starting over. Try to make decisions based on love, not fear (includes love for yourself and any future children).
I feel for you, OP. I was in a similar situation a little over a decade ago. You have my thoughts and prayers. Best to you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP, I didn't go through the entire thread, but I really hope you got some good support and encouragement to pack a bag and get out of your situation. It can be really hard, when we are habitually normalizing other peoples bad behavior, to realize that we are actually in a very *not normal* situation. OP, you are in an abusive situation.

As a psychotherapist who specializes in anger and relationships I can say, unequivocally, this will not get much better. Maybe a little better, and maybe enough to convince you to spend another few years dangling from the thread, but never enough to provide you with the stability and respect an adult relationship should offer.

The most telling part of your post is how much you are both doing to normalize his behavior. Instead of his acknowledging that he has a problem, he is blaming others on their lack of tolerance for his behavior. Nothing else will change until that does. As long as you stay, you remain (from his perspective) a sign that he is right and all is well enough.

For what it is worth, I was in a terrible relationship for all of my 20s. No abuse but tons of other issues. I ended it at 34 and feared I would be alone and miserable for years. I met someone at 35, we have 3 kids and a very solid and supportive relationship.

PP here. Since at least one other PP and I mistook DH for the opposite of their abusive parent, what can you say about looking for a "normal" mate? Abusers are very cunning and sharp in regard to hiding their abusive tendencies, as you know, ands as I have had to learn. Some might call their behavior gas lighting. They are positively charming (in my DH's case, flirty and smart) to the outside world. Hell, my DH even charms his psychologist (which he sees only occasionally, it should be every week!)

This one is so hard, because manipulation and deceit exploits positive qualities in you like generosity and empathy. I completely agree it can be so hard to figure out if a person is manipulative, while at the same time protecting yourself from becoming cynical and suspicious. There are a couple of qualities that can serve as *protective factors* against manipulative/narcissistic/sociopathic partners. First, start listening to your gut. Even if you don't know whether to trust it, it is important to note if there are discrepancies between what your head is telling you (rationalizations often sound like: everything is great, he is really working on himself, i am happy more often than i am not, he is traumatized and I cant expect more from him...etc) and what your stomach is telling you (gut responses like frequent anxiety, walking on eggshells, doubting your own emotional reactions).

When there are discrepancies here (between the heart and the head), it is good to pay attention to it. The term is cognitive dissonance and it applies to any number of crazy-making scenarios like gas lighting and general narcissistic abuse. When you get good at recognizing cognitive dissonance you can start to develop better trust in your instincts. Good therapy is helpful, too, but only if you find a good fit and someone who helps you build a sense of self-efficacy, and not someone who is going to just try to give you a bunch of advice (like I am here )

He is verbally and emotionally asbusive, OP, and it is only a mafter of time before he becomes physically abusive. Already, you exhibit signs of a battered woman. You do not deserve to be treated this way. Please seek professional help and get out of a bad relationship. A bad marriage IS NOT the better than no marriage.

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP, I didn't go through the entire thread, but I really hope you got some good support and encouragement to pack a bag and get out of your situation. It can be really hard, when we are habitually normalizing other peoples bad behavior, to realize that we are actually in a very *not normal* situation. OP, you are in an abusive situation.

As a psychotherapist who specializes in anger and relationships I can say, unequivocally, this will not get much better. Maybe a little better, and maybe enough to convince you to spend another few years dangling from the thread, but never enough to provide you with the stability and respect an adult relationship should offer.

The most telling part of your post is how much you are both doing to normalize his behavior. Instead of his acknowledging that he has a problem, he is blaming others on their lack of tolerance for his behavior. Nothing else will change until that does. As long as you stay, you remain (from his perspective) a sign that he is right and all is well enough.

For what it is worth, I was in a terrible relationship for all of my 20s. No abuse but tons of other issues. I ended it at 34 and feared I would be alone and miserable for years. I met someone at 35, we have 3 kids and a very solid and supportive relationship.

PP here. Since at least one other PP and I mistook DH for the opposite of their abusive parent, what can you say about looking for a "normal" mate? Abusers are very cunning and sharp in regard to hiding their abusive tendencies, as you know, ands as I have had to learn. Some might call their behavior gas lighting. They are positively charming (in my DH's case, flirty and smart) to the outside world. Hell, my DH even charms his psychologist (which he sees only occasionally, it should be every week!)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, ladies, your husbands must all be pretty close to perfect.

No, and in fact, because of growing up with a father much like OP's DH, I ended up marrying a man who is completely conflict avoidant. It's also f*cked up.

Me too. And DH has an explosive temper, as it turns out. It sucks for me and the kids. They pick his side, because they are afraid of him (there are other psychological reasons, too numerous to list here). I stand up to him, and he doesn't like it. DH wants me to be like his cowering mother (who jumps for the sons in law, but disrespects her own sons, and puts her daughters on the highest pedestal possible - now THAT is f*ed up). No way in hell. PP here. It is holy hell living with a DH like this. Sometimes I wish the outside world knew DH's true self; he is an absolute angel who can do no wrong, to the outside world. T They really have no idea, and play into his flirty and smart vibe. If they only knew.

Hi OP, I didn't go through the entire thread, but I really hope you got some good support and encouragement to pack a bag and get out of your situation. It can be really hard, when we are habitually normalizing other peoples bad behavior, to realize that we are actually in a very *not normal* situation. OP, you are in an abusive situation.

As a psychotherapist who specializes in anger and relationships I can say, unequivocally, this will not get much better. Maybe a little better, and maybe enough to convince you to spend another few years dangling from the thread, but never enough to provide you with the stability and respect an adult relationship should offer.

The most telling part of your post is how much you are both doing to normalize his behavior. Instead of his acknowledging that he has a problem, he is blaming others on their lack of tolerance for his behavior. Nothing else will change until that does. As long as you stay, you remain (from his perspective) a sign that he is right and all is well enough.

For what it is worth, I was in a terrible relationship for all of my 20s. No abuse but tons of other issues. I ended it at 34 and feared I would be alone and miserable for years. I met someone at 35, we have 3 kids and a very solid and supportive relationship.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP
I'm a guy that WAS similar to your husband. I have a temper and goes on tantrum every now and then.

The only advice I can give you is to sit down and talk to him how it affects you deep down. If he truly cares he would stop or go to therapy for anger management.

Most of the time we are clueless, take our wife for granted and forget to show appreciation and affection. We do need to be reminded every now and then.

I hope you do sit down with him. According to you he's a decent guy but with a bad temper. Don't be afraid of him, stand your ground and tell him if he don't stop you will leave. That is a wake up call for most men and if they care they WILL stop. I did.

Also the time when he doesn't speak after a tirade this is my take on that.
1. So we don't make the situation worst.
2. The time when we start to feel remorse for what we just did.
3. Finding a way to patch things up.

OP here - thank you for this perspective. We definitely had that talk over the weekend - and have had it before. He feels badly that I become so upset, but he also thinks I should have a thicker skin and that, while it's not necessarily okay, his outbursts are a normal part of life. We disagree on that.

I think part of the problem between us is that this behavior set the tone for our relationship early on, and even though it happens so much less now than it did then, I am still always a little bit on edge, waiting for the next thunderclap. Even if it's been months since the last one.

Put simply this means that you are incompatible. If you don't like this and he thinks you should tolerate this you are not a match.
Stop agonizing over it and move on.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, ladies, your husbands must all be pretty close to perfect.

No, and in fact, because of growing up with a father much like OP's DH, I ended up marrying a man who is completely conflict avoidant. It's also f*cked up.

another example DHs are f-ed up no matter what.

Uh, no. No one is perfect and everyone is human. But there's a difference between "f-ed up" and not perfect.

OP, read this for inspiration:

https://www.facebook.com/GilbertLiz/posts/1002190543196394:0

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, ladies, your husbands must all be pretty close to perfect.

No, and in fact, because of growing up with a father much like OP's DH, I ended up marrying a man who is completely conflict avoidant. It's also f*cked up.

another example DHs are f-ed up no matter what.

Anonymous wrote:

OP - You indicated that you have a therapist. Have you also been screened by a psychiatrist for a clinical diagnosis and received any medication? In your situation as you describe it in dealing with the infertility issues and living with a time bomb, you need more than just a PCP describing Prozac or something. You need some assistance in getting a better perspective on yourself and what you deserve out of life. A child is not necessarily going to be the answer for you married or single.

Does your husband see a therapist? Have you had at least one session with your husband's therapist to share what you see without him being present? And then perhaps a follow-up session together at some point so that perhaps the two of you could decide on a more positive plan of action for both of you if you remain a couple? If he sees no one, then getting a couple's therapist who deals with couples with infertility issues etc. might be helpful if you both are willing to continue to work on the marriage.

My therapist wanted me on meds but (a) I've used them before and I cannot stand the side-effects; I told her I'd try everything else - more exercise, meditation, dietary changes - before I'd go there. My husband does see a therapist but I don't think they're working on the anger enough. I did go with him once and we did discuss it. It's been a while, though. I plan to go back with him next time he has an appointment.

OP, society doesn't look down on single women.

It looks down on weak women though.

OP - You indicated that you have a therapist. Have you also been screened by a psychiatrist for a clinical diagnosis and received any medication? In your situation as you describe it in dealing with the infertility issues and living with a time bomb, you need more than just a PCP describing Prozac or something. You need some assistance in getting a better perspective on yourself and what you deserve out of life. A child is not necessarily going to be the answer for you married or single.

Does your husband see a therapist? Have you had at least one session with your husband's therapist to share what you see without him being present? And then perhaps a follow-up session together at some point so that perhaps the two of you could decide on a more positive plan of action for both of you if you remain a couple? If he sees no one, then getting a couple's therapist who deals with couples with infertility issues etc. might be helpful if you both are willing to continue to work on the marriage.

Anonymous wrote:Wow, ladies, your husbands must all be pretty close to perfect.

No, and in fact, because of growing up with a father much like OP's DH, I ended up marrying a man who is completely conflict avoidant. It's also f*cked up.