Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there a point to training them earlier than they want? Does potty training at 4 have any negative effect on a child?

Yes, four year olds notice that all the other children can use the bathroom and aren't wearing diapers under their clothes, hanging out of their bathing suits at the pool, etc. Do you think they are like infants and have no social awareness at 4?? Also, they will remember it because also unlike infants, 4 year olds are forming long term memories. Have you ever interacted with a child older than about 12 months?

+1

Preschool age children are far more observant than any adult. If they see a 4yo in diapers, they most definitely will take notice, and their comments (intentionally or unintentionally) can be quite hurtful.

Actually, if you have a 4yo in diapers, he or she can't be in preschool unless the child has SN.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A mix of reasons. My friend tried introducing the toilet to her son since he was two but it wasn't working. Daycare staff tried without much luck for an entire year before seeing any progress. Later, the boy was diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum but it wasn't immediately obvious that was the issue when it all started out.

Another friend just wasn't up for the task and said as much - said she didn't feel like dealing with the hassle of potty training and that kid was four, still in pull ups. The kid is a bit eccentric but no special needs that the mother has disclosed. She feels that modern parenting steals the joy of childhood from kids, or something like, so anything that would ask the kid to sit and do an assigned task - whether it's peeing or practicing writing with a pencil - is oppressive and bad. So she doesn't and she's arranged her whole personal life to accommodate this approach.

Hence, the (unintended?) creation of a special needs child, perhaps. You have to wonder what kind of childhood the mother had.

I'm sure this is a totally accurate description and not at all colored by your judgmental interpretation of her different parenting philosophy.

I most certainly do have harsh opinions of parents who avoid PT because it's a hassle.

Anonymous wrote:DD2 was one of those kids that potty trained at 3.5 years. She was just incredibly stubborn. After the first week of preschool, we got a letter from the school reminding us of their "no pull-ups" policy. So on Friday evening, we told her that she cannot go back to school until she starts using the potty. On Saturday, we overheard her talking to her panties, "No more pee pee in the panties, ok?" On Monday, she went to school in panties and was completely potty trained. The amazing part was that she stayed dry overnight as well. Not a single accident since then. (She is 4.5yo now)

Incredible what can happen when children get clarity.

DD2 was one of those kids that potty trained at 3.5 years. She was just incredibly stubborn. After the first week of preschool, we got a letter from the school reminding us of their "no pull-ups" policy. So on Friday evening, we told her that she cannot go back to school until she starts using the potty. On Saturday, we overheard her talking to her panties, "No more pee pee in the panties, ok?" On Monday, she went to school in panties and was completely potty trained. The amazing part was that she stayed dry overnight as well. Not a single accident since then. (She is 4.5yo now)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A mix of reasons. My friend tried introducing the toilet to her son since he was two but it wasn't working. Daycare staff tried without much luck for an entire year before seeing any progress. Later, the boy was diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum but it wasn't immediately obvious that was the issue when it all started out.

Another friend just wasn't up for the task and said as much - said she didn't feel like dealing with the hassle of potty training and that kid was four, still in pull ups. The kid is a bit eccentric but no special needs that the mother has disclosed. She feels that modern parenting steals the joy of childhood from kids, or something like, so anything that would ask the kid to sit and do an assigned task - whether it's peeing or practicing writing with a pencil - is oppressive and bad. So she doesn't and she's arranged her whole personal life to accommodate this approach.

Hence, the (unintended?) creation of a special needs child, perhaps. You have to wonder what kind of childhood the mother had.

I'm sure this is a totally accurate description and not at all colored by your judgmental interpretation of her different parenting philosophy.

I can see myself having waited until 3.5 just out of sheer laziness. Potty training takes concerted effort (we did the boot camp) and I probably would not have bothered at 3 other than having to enroll DS in a no diaper preschool right after his 3rd birthday. I can imagine that parents that have a lot going on (new baby, family issues, etc) might also put it off past 3. I know one family that still let their 5 year old use a diaper to poop because the family had gone through a lot of upheavals from years 3-5.

I do think that poor parenting can be a factor. The one kid I know who did "refuse" to potty train had very permissive/structureless parents. Great family, just not at all into doing anything by the book. It just never occurred to them to take away the diapers and make the kid learn on the parents' schedule. At some point between 3.5 and 4 the kid started noticing peer pressure and announced he would use the potty.

Finally I think that for pooping some kids legitimately develop a habit of needing a pull-up because of experiences with painful poops on the potty. A lot of adults have poop habits (places, times of day, reading materials) so this isn't really that weird when you stop to think about it.

Anonymous wrote:My question is where are all these preschools who are ALSO willing to change diapers until kids are 4? Every school I ever looked at for my kids wanted them potty trained before they started. It that meant getting my 2.5 year old ready because the school prioritized kids who could start before their 3rd birthday, then that's what we did.

You're amazing. Job well done. Every school I've ever looked at works with the child at their own pace.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know I'm going to start a debate here, but I really want to know how it comes to be that an able body/mind 4 year old is still not fully potty trained. I am a mother to an infant and am genuinely curious how that happens.

I'm a long time nanny and have potty trained two children, for what it's worth. I know how hard it is. But, I wasn't about to let a 3 year old go on not being potty trained. It seems to me that if the child can ask to be changed ("I need my diaper changed") then they're probably too old for a diaper. Is that not true?

Is it laziness? On the part of the parent and child to not start earlier?
Did you start and then stop?
Is 2 years old too young?
Is it just too darn hard so everyone waits until the child can basically do it all themselves, even if that takes until they're 4?

Sorry if this is all too harsh. I really want to know why your 3/4 year old isn't potty trained.

I'm sure you aren't referring to SN kids who have disabilities of some sort.

It is in the very first paragraph that she is not.

Anonymous wrote:I know I'm going to start a debate here, but I really want to know how it comes to be that an able body/mind 4 year old is still not fully potty trained. I am a mother to an infant and am genuinely curious how that happens.

I'm a long time nanny and have potty trained two children, for what it's worth. I know how hard it is. But, I wasn't about to let a 3 year old go on not being potty trained. It seems to me that if the child can ask to be changed ("I need my diaper changed") then they're probably too old for a diaper. Is that not true?

Is it laziness? On the part of the parent and child to not start earlier?
Did you start and then stop?
Is 2 years old too young?
Is it just too darn hard so everyone waits until the child can basically do it all themselves, even if that takes until they're 4?

Sorry if this is all too harsh. I really want to know why your 3/4 year old isn't potty trained.

I'm sure you aren't referring to SN kids who have disabilities of some sort.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FYI, this thread isn't about SN kids.

Yes it is, because the people who are going around judging others because their kids are not potty trained at what they deem to be the correct age are going to sweep a lot of kids with not super obvious special needs into their bitchy judgmental net.

Same is true for most judging of other people. Why is that idiot taking so long at that ATM? Maybe she can't see well. Why is that lazy asshole taking the elevator 1 floor instead of the stairs? Maybe he has bad knees due to his service in Iraq. The best way to avoid wrongly judging people for things beyond their control is to STOP JUDGING other people.

Exactly. My kid is developmentally delayed and likely adhd and you would never ever know that. You would just assume I'm being oh so lazy.

Anonymous wrote:FYI, this thread isn't about SN kids.

Yes it is, because the people who are going around judging others because their kids are not potty trained at what they deem to be the correct age are going to sweep a lot of kids with not super obvious special needs into their bitchy judgmental net.

Same is true for most judging of other people. Why is that idiot taking so long at that ATM? Maybe she can't see well. Why is that lazy asshole taking the elevator 1 floor instead of the stairs? Maybe he has bad knees due to his service in Iraq. The best way to avoid wrongly judging people for things beyond their control is to STOP JUDGING other people.

Anonymous wrote:A mix of reasons. My friend tried introducing the toilet to her son since he was two but it wasn't working. Daycare staff tried without much luck for an entire year before seeing any progress. Later, the boy was diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum but it wasn't immediately obvious that was the issue when it all started out.

Another friend just wasn't up for the task and said as much - said she didn't feel like dealing with the hassle of potty training and that kid was four, still in pull ups. The kid is a bit eccentric but no special needs that the mother has disclosed. She feels that modern parenting steals the joy of childhood from kids, or something like, so anything that would ask the kid to sit and do an assigned task - whether it's peeing or practicing writing with a pencil - is oppressive and bad. So she doesn't and she's arranged her whole personal life to accommodate this approach.

Hence, the (unintended?) creation of a special needs child, perhaps. You have to wonder what kind of childhood the mother had.

Anonymous wrote:My question is where are all these preschools who are ALSO willing to change diapers until kids are 4? Every school I ever looked at for my kids wanted them potty trained before they started. It that meant getting my 2.5 year old ready because the school prioritized kids who could start before their 3rd birthday, then that's what we did.

Good question.

A mix of reasons. My friend tried introducing the toilet to her son since he was two but it wasn't working. Daycare staff tried without much luck for an entire year before seeing any progress. Later, the boy was diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum but it wasn't immediately obvious that was the issue when it all started out.

Another friend just wasn't up for the task and said as much - said she didn't feel like dealing with the hassle of potty training and that kid was four, still in pull ups. The kid is a bit eccentric but no special needs that the mother has disclosed. She feels that modern parenting steals the joy of childhood from kids, or something like, so anything that would ask the kid to sit and do an assigned task - whether it's peeing or practicing writing with a pencil - is oppressive and bad. So she doesn't and she's arranged her whole personal life to accommodate this approach.

FYI, this thread isn't about SN kids.