Anonymous wrote:Questions for you from another mom who is the primary breadwinner. Why can't you call a plumber? Why can't you schedule a realtor to come put your condo on the market? Why can't you schedule a vacation? Is it just your frustrated vision of how things are supposed to be, and his vision of mom's real estate killing? Because I just don't understand why you wouldn't make an appointment with a realtor. Today. 3 kids in one room?

who wants a deadweight?

who wants one step forward, two steps back? All. The. Time.

who wants to do everything for a grown @$$ man who doesn't even pitch in let alone say Thank You?

who wants this kid of role model in the house for 3 children?


Either have a BIG conversation about both hitting the Reset Button, or get a divorce and start getting happy again.

I have already chimed it, and will again. My spouse is very very similar. His procrastination has put a lot of strain on our relationship, as I have less and less respect at times. It turns out procrastination is deeply attached to anxiety. Unfortunately the procrastination and avoidance increase the anxiety, as the issues just keep being put off and not resolved. Look out for addiction too, as people with anxiety are susceptible to addiction.

Over the years, I have stopped trying to get his opinion on planning. I am currently planning a major family event with almost no input from him. This way things get planned faster.

Have you ever just owned making a unilateral decision.

Him: "Whhyyyyyy did you pick that one? It's the worst one! You made this decision unilaterally!"

You: "Yep".

Him: "But why would you pick this? It's terrible/costs too much."

You: "Yep. I decided unilaterally that unilateral decisions work best for now. It's no good to keep fighting about this. You don't want to change and I don't want to fight you about it. I need to get things done and so I am making the decisionsfrom now on because I have weighed the options, done the research and can make the decisions by the deadlines needed. Since you are not interested in offering your opinion when I have asked in the past, I can only assume that you have no opinion. I am not going to chase you for it anymore. You are more than welcome to take your own iniative to participate in decisions, but I am not accepting no response anymore. I am accepting actions and not empty words.

No responseand no action means you agree with me and the way I have handled it and I do not want to hear anymore about it. Now please pass the chicken."

Him: "(If he's really stupid) But this is wrong, blah blah"

You: "I'm done discussing this."

If he still continues, leave the room.

Don't justify after laying it out the one time. He knows what he is doing, the passive aggressive twit. He likes this game. He wants you to chase him and justify why you have the right to make the decision. Stop engaging at all. Put it on him. If he wants to be involved he has to make the effort to even find out what the decisions are that need to be made. Don't even offer those. See what he does. Either way, you will have a lot less resentment on your end.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So you chose to have three kids with a man you don't respect?

Like I have said multiple times. He put on a good show until recently. Made a lot of false promises and statements to me. I feel duped in a lot of ways. Promises to move for 3-4 years (our youngest is now 3 and sharing a bedroom with two older siblings). Yes this area is expensive. But the current arrangement (family of 5 in a two bedroom condo) is laughable.

Really?

Nothing about this post seems real.

We're starting to get to the bottom of this. As she hinted to in previous posts, this guy checked all the superficial boxes prior to marriage (private school education), but once the rubber hit the road, i.e. having a family, the light shined upon her. Let this be a lesson to all the little ladies out there that the keys to a successful marriage and family runs beyond checking boxes like private school education and social standing.

So why'd she keep having children with him? I'm sorry, but I find some of the details hard to believe (e.g., I'm a total MILF! We have three children in a two-bedroom condo!) Maybe I'm wrong, but it feels off.

OP Again, nothing is off. We have a nice condo in a nice part of DC, but it is too small. Great neighborhood. But too small. I am not Halle Berry, but am attractive and take care of myself - not overweight, fit build, professional style. I didn't "settle" for DH because I am unattractive, as some PPs imply. I had plenty of options when DH and I met and started dating. Again, as I said before, I think it was a situation of meeting each other at the right time, as opposed to necessarily meeting the right person. I had had relationships with guys who wouldn't commit or who cheated on me. DH isn't that way. As I have stated before, DH is a good guy, and there are a lot of things I do love about him, but it's the lack of motivation and ability to do anything without procrastinating for months/years that is wearing thin. The empty promises of finding a new place (for three years now...we started the conversation when I got pregnant with #3, who is now 3), have been to countless open houses, but can never get DH motivated enough to pull the trigger. The failure to finish things he starts. Lack of motivation to find a new job. Lack of decision making. Constant procrastination. No desire to move up in the world, if not for us...at least for the sake of our children! Dropping the ball constantly on things related to the kids. And then complaining and whining at me when I finally make decisions. As others have said, a man-child. When it was the four of us in the condo, we knew things got tight and when I was pregnant, we agreed to move....but then it just never happens. No matter how many places we look at. No many how many great condos or townhouses we see. In this market, when something good comes up, you have to move fast. And, as discussed, DH cannot move fast....if he moves at all.

Dear OP:

Huge red flag with your statement in bold. Your marriage will forever be pitiful if your underlying beliefs are that: 1) hes not the right person for you and 2) he got lucky due to timing. These statements are "stories" and are not rooted in reality. Reality is: you met and married this man and your immediate feelings about him have changed based on his actions, or lack thereof. You feel resentment and bitterness and are allowing these feelings to dictate your treatment of him and shape your entire view of your marriage.

This is not to say your feelings are not valid. On the contrary, they are, but just realize them for what they are: feelings. They come and go. Some stay around longer than others.

Now that thats out of the way, the best way to sort through emotional issues is to deal with the facts. The facts from what your have stated in prior posts as I understand them are:
1) Your husband's ambition or confidence levels have dropped from prior years
2) you handle most of the decision making/responsibilities for the household
3) your career and earnings > husbands
4) your husband struggles with a disability

These facts make you feel: lonely, bitter, disappointed, unappreciated, fearful for the future. Ok.

Truth of the matter is, you may need to carry the family for a few years. I do not know your husband so I cannot speculate what his issues are, but as his wife, there are some things exclusive of marriage counseling you can do if you want save the quality of your marriage:

1) Remember that you made a promise to love this man, through the good and bad times. Right now, for him, he may be going through somethings internally that he cannot (or does not) articulate well. As a middle aged man myself, I can attest to that. He may need encouragement and space to figure it out. Or he may need counseling on his own. Whatever the case, coming at him with love would get you a lot farther with him then by treating him like your 4th child. Even if he is acting like one. It will, at the very least, remove one barrier of communication which could help you guys sort through your issues. At the most, he may respond positively.

2) Put chores and responsibilities on paper. Sit down and write out all of your family chores and responsibilities. Then discuss who primarily does what and see where changes can be made to help ease the burden. This will need to be done without judgment (meaning: no complaining). Visually seeing the delineation of responsibilities will be very eye opening for both of you. Building better structure generally helps improve the performance of procrastinators. This will help build structure to the way your household is run and it will help both of you understand your expectations.

3) If your husband is struggling with pursing his goals or with his career, ask how you could be helpful to your husband. For a lot of men, disappointment in career/future goals results in lower self value and worth. You may be able to help arrange a life coach or some other form of paid assistance. Or you could simply be a thought partner in helping him work through challenges. Yes, I understand you have three kids. Sometimes we have to do these things for the better of the marriage. Two high functioning parents are better than one. If one has to carry the other for a time to help them get on their feet, it would be good for all in the long run.

4) If not doing so already, actively work to date your husband. Sometimes life becomes a constant running machine with kids. You may need more time alone to rediscover why you love each other. Or at the very least, to find opportunities to increase the frequency of when you enjoy each others company.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So you chose to have three kids with a man you don't respect?

Like I have said multiple times. He put on a good show until recently. Made a lot of false promises and statements to me. I feel duped in a lot of ways. Promises to move for 3-4 years (our youngest is now 3 and sharing a bedroom with two older siblings). Yes this area is expensive. But the current arrangement (family of 5 in a two bedroom condo) is laughable.

Really?

Nothing about this post seems real.

We're starting to get to the bottom of this. As she hinted to in previous posts, this guy checked all the superficial boxes prior to marriage (private school education), but once the rubber hit the road, i.e. having a family, the light shined upon her. Let this be a lesson to all the little ladies out there that the keys to a successful marriage and family runs beyond checking boxes like private school education and social standing.

So why'd she keep having children with him? I'm sorry, but I find some of the details hard to believe (e.g., I'm a total MILF! We have three children in a two-bedroom condo!) Maybe I'm wrong, but it feels off.

OP Again, nothing is off. We have a nice condo in a nice part of DC, but it is too small. Great neighborhood. But too small. I am not Halle Berry, but am attractive and take care of myself - not overweight, fit build, professional style. I didn't "settle" for DH because I am unattractive, as some PPs imply. I had plenty of options when DH and I met and started dating. Again, as I said before, I think it was a situation of meeting each other at the right time, as opposed to necessarily meeting the right person. I had had relationships with guys who wouldn't commit or who cheated on me. DH isn't that way. As I have stated before, DH is a good guy, and there are a lot of things I do love about him, but it's the lack of motivation and ability to do anything without procrastinating for months/years that is wearing thin. The empty promises of finding a new place (for three years now...we started the conversation when I got pregnant with #3, who is now 3), have been to countless open houses, but can never get DH motivated enough to pull the trigger. The failure to finish things he starts. Lack of motivation to find a new job. Lack of decision making. Constant procrastination. No desire to move up in the world, if not for us...at least for the sake of our children! Dropping the ball constantly on things related to the kids. And then complaining and whining at me when I finally make decisions. As others have said, a man-child. When it was the four of us in the condo, we knew things got tight and when I was pregnant, we agreed to move....but then it just never happens. No matter how many places we look at. No many how many great condos or townhouses we see. In this market, when something good comes up, you have to move fast. And, as discussed, DH cannot move fast....if he moves at all.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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You couldn't be more wrong, BTW. I still got it. Total MILF here., even after the three kids. Lol. Still work out and take care of myself.

Oh yeah? Let us decide, why should we believe you?

+1 because a mom in her late thirties with three kids in tow is totally going to be able to attract the tall attractive hot shot ambitious high earner of everyone's dreams. Keep dreaming.

OP sound very eligible to me. I am a may-be-divorced high earning alpha male and would be thrilled to date an achieving with-it attractive woman. She is probably in the same boat as I am, not looking for re-marriage but certainly looking for companionship.


I don't understand the vitriol at OP from men on here. Ambition, power, confidence are male traits that are aphrodisiacs for most women. Being overly critical is a major turn-off for both sexes. Her husband can act like an over-critical man-child but it is going to turn off most women and crush the marriage. No different than if a woman stops having regular sex with her husband - it will destroy most marriages, fair or not. Just how most people are wired.

Her husband sounds miserable to be married to. I have no great advice other than to give him specific directions for what she needs from him (although it sounds like she does this) and otherwise learn to accept that being married to him might be less hassle than being divorced and supporting him financially anyway. Many men make the same unfortunate calculation.

thanks for proving pp's point. Everyone has said she will get some, but will not marry.

OP here. I don't want to remarry. Never said I did. After having to parent one husband, why would I want to go through that again? I do not wish to get divorced, and am doing my best to salvage the situation, for the sake of keeping my family together.

What bothers me is not just the presumption that a 30-something mom of three is a dog, but that a 30-something mom of three can never have a fulfilling relationship again, should she separate/divorce. And also the presumption that a successful and independent 30-something mom of three would want to get married again! I would hate to say it, but after being in this type of marriage, I think I would be one and done!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So you chose to have three kids with a man you don't respect?

Like I have said multiple times. He put on a good show until recently. Made a lot of false promises and statements to me. I feel duped in a lot of ways. Promises to move for 3-4 years (our youngest is now 3 and sharing a bedroom with two older siblings). Yes this area is expensive. But the current arrangement (family of 5 in a two bedroom condo) is laughable.

Really?

Nothing about this post seems real.

We're starting to get to the bottom of this. As she hinted to in previous posts, this guy checked all the superficial boxes prior to marriage (private school education), but once the rubber hit the road, i.e. having a family, the light shined upon her. Let this be a lesson to all the little ladies out there that the keys to a successful marriage and family runs beyond checking boxes like private school education and social standing.

So why'd she keep having children with him? I'm sorry, but I find some of the details hard to believe (e.g., I'm a total MILF! We have three children in a two-bedroom condo!) Maybe I'm wrong, but it feels off.

OP. One more question.

Would you say you'r patient? You said that you are a doer/achiever when something is put in front of you. Do you see an issue or problem and dive right in? I'm guessing DH, even if he were inclined to DO, may take longer to get going. But if you're swooping in to figure out the camps 2 days after enrollments start (when it's not critical, just yet) then he's not getting the opportunity. You assume he'll never do it, but other than the sink. Has he failed on something critical? I know this will sound bad or lame, but you may have to manage him more. Let him do the tasks and you manage the process. Get him the info on the camps, set up a check in on progress and set up a deadline for sign ups - complete with calendar invites and reminders. May make you feel like an @sshole, but it's part of your nature to take charge, so not a reach. Just a suggestion.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My college boyfriend was like this,which is why I dumped him.

I instead married an ambitious, hardworking man who can be a bit of an ass. He also cheated on me. However, he is confident and driven.

No relationship is perfect. No man is perfect. I think you need to accept and love your husband for who he is. There have to be great things about your relationship.

Good point. Most high earning alpha males who are attractive cheat n their wives and there are no shortage of women available for it. Price of admission I suppose

+1000. That Alpha gets you a different set of problems.

Its interesting how OP keeps psychoanalyzing her own husband without trying to figure out how she could have contributing to her flailing relationship. She's quite the saint here.

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the thoughtful responses. You've given me a lot to think about and consider. Therapy just wasn't helpful because DH didn't take the tools we learned and apply them.

For example, his big gripe was finances. We agreed with counselor that he would find a financial planner and we would both go.... That was last March. The deadline we set was July 1 for DH to find the accountant and make the appointment because it was important to him. I agreed to go. July 1 came and went. It's now November 1 and he still hadn't found a financial person or made the appointment. This is why counseling didn't work. Even with the therapist he couldn't make good on a simple commitment. He just doesn't do anything!

Yes I have considered divorce, but he is a good father with the kids for the most part. And co-parenting with him through a divorce would be hell. I could never get him to agree to anything. And I wouldn't be in the position where I could easily just make the call because I would have court orders to include him in major decisions. And he doesn't make them.

I don't know why he is so afraid to make decisions even for himself and his own career. It's almost a paralysis. Or perhaps he doesn't want the responsibility because it's easier to blame Somekne else

No I am not a gold digger. I have a successful career and can easily support myself. I wanted more of a partner. Not a 40-something child who can't make a single decision.

his fear and anxiety is more important/familiar to him than changing things. doesn't make him a bad person. but he's flawed. also, what i've used with my spouse (whose eerily similar) is that when he 'opts' not to do something, he's telling me to do it as the only other adult in the house.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What good is an intact dysfunctional family where the parents hate each other, show no affection or love for each other? What does that teach the children? I genuinely want someone to answer this question for me because people here are always insistent that people stay together no matter what and, in some cases outside of abuse, adultery, addiction, I think the best thing for everyone involved would be to part ways and move on.

Amen!

Staying together for some social, religious, or moral ideal causing the parents misery with their lives and messing up the kids is ridiculous. So many people do not know how damaging to the children seeing the example of mom and dad toxic/dead relationship is. What they see is absorbed and can damage and sabotage the children's relationships later in their lives.

The catch is, if mom and dad are damaged inside already, without therapy or help, they may not make any better examples in post divorce relationships.

The literature is fairly consistent - low-conflict marriages that end in divorce is harder on kids than remaining intact. From what OP describes, she is in a low-conflict marriage, i.e. her and her spouse aren't yelling at each other, violence, etc. in front of the kids. http://articles.latimes.com/2001/jul/09/news/cl-20178

Majority of divorces are low conflict - people fall out of love, or mismatched libidos lead to affairs, or in OP's case, she married a critical man-child. I have had my share of "dreaming of divorce" thoughts, mostly over a massive disparity in sex drive with my DW. And so I don't fault people in low conflict marriages who eventually throw in the towel. But you must at least realize what you are doing - children, especially young children, don't give a rats ass about their parent's personal fulfillment. Certainly, if there is hostility and violence, then yes, divorce is better, or more accurately, the lesser of two evils.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP again. PP I appreciate your insight as BTDT. I don't want to divorce in large part because of breaking up our family not to mention the difficulty that would be involve with co-parenting with someone who can't or won't make decisions. I am tired of always having to be the fall guy. I make the call and get crap for it. He won't make the call. Despite my trying to engage him. But then criticized the calls I make. It's exhausting. Right now the big debate is Xmas break and childcare. I am putting before him a list of aftercare options since we both work. Begging for input since they fill up quickly through the county. No response. Emailed. No response. Texted. No response. Have asked in person a handful of times and No commitment or no response, eyes glaze over. So it will be the same old. I make the call and register the kids and then get hell for it for picking the wrong choice. Same thing happened for summer camps. Same thing happens for every vacation we have taken since our honeymoon (the last thing he planned, BTW).

If I leave these things to him, there would be no camps, no aftercare, no vacations.

How could I share custody with someone like this? Not to mention, he isn't a bad guy. He's actually a good guy most of the time. Like I said, he's a pretty good dad. Just very helpless and then critical. I am working ass off and he has no motivation at all anymore. It's like he's given up any professional or financial success in his mid-40s. Where is the drive and winning go-get em attitude he used to have when we were dating and first married?

Like I said, I don't need Daddy Warbucks. But if you can't pickup the financial and career slack, at least help more at home instead of playing videogames until 2am, complaining you're tired the next morning, and forgetting to pay a bill again.

I'm the PP whose similar DH got therapy and meds. One small piece of advice for your sanity is that I wouldn't discuss all of these things with him. I wouldn't mention The Xmas break aftercare at all, but just sign them up at a place that is convenient for you. If he finds something different or better then great. Who cares if you lose money. Most likely he won't do anything. When the day comes just take them to the aftercare place and let him know where they are. Don't discuss anything. Same things with camps. You have to learn to do what needs to be done and ignore the complaints, criticisms.

If you are looking for validation for your DH on all that you do for him and the kids, you will never get it.

I agree with this PP. If he won't make a decision - just start making all of them and informing him. When he inevitably complains, look him square in the face and say, "Stop. I will not listen to you complain until you start to contribute like another functioning adult." Then walk out of the room. You don't have to listen to his complaints.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So you chose to have three kids with a man you don't respect?

Like I have said multiple times. He put on a good show until recently. Made a lot of false promises and statements to me. I feel duped in a lot of ways. Promises to move for 3-4 years (our youngest is now 3 and sharing a bedroom with two older siblings). Yes this area is expensive. But the current arrangement (family of 5 in a two bedroom condo) is laughable.

Really?

Nothing about this post seems real.

We're starting to get to the bottom of this. As she hinted to in previous posts, this guy checked all the superficial boxes prior to marriage (private school education), but once the rubber hit the road, i.e. having a family, the light shined upon her. Let this be a lesson to all the little ladies out there that the keys to a successful marriage and family runs beyond checking boxes like private school education and social standing.

Anonymous wrote:

What good is an intact dysfunctional family where the parents hate each other, show no affection or love for each other? What does that teach the children? I genuinely want someone to answer this question for me because people here are always insistent that people stay together no matter what and, in some cases outside of abuse, adultery, addiction, I think the best thing for everyone involved would be to part ways and move on.

Amen!

Staying together for some social, religious, or moral ideal causing the parents misery with their lives and messing up the kids is ridiculous. So many people do not know how damaging to the children seeing the example of mom and dad toxic/dead relationship is. What they see is absorbed and can damage and sabotage the children's relationships later in their lives.

The catch is, if mom and dad are damaged inside already, without therapy or help, they may not make any better examples in post divorce relationships.