See what I mean, LOL?

GDS has changed so much in the last 20 years. If you are old enough to have your own kids now, you probably experienced a different place. It is much more of a leader academically now. Along with that comes the heavy workload.

Yes, upper middle class was meant to be specific. Now I'm curious-- was the "it" you loved workload pressure or other aspects of GDS?

FWIW, ITA that GDS is a lovable school that fosters great friendships among interesting people. I just think it could do that without the insane workload!

Which circles back to the upper middle class parents point. I think that's a class background that leads people to normalize or even valorize workaholism. And a specific variety of workaholism that is externally-induced rather than the product of someone's own passion for his or her work.

Anonymous wrote:Re the kids love it.

I think that this is a lie upper middle class parents tell themselves.

15:37 again - my family is upper class, not upper middle class, so maybe that makes a difference. I'm not trying to be obnoxious, but I'm wondering whether your point was that families who have to struggle to pay for school lie to themselves that their kids are happy to make themselves feel better about shelling out the money. Money wasn't an issue for my family so maybe there was less pressure, etc.

Not really - I went to GDS and did love it. Maybe I would have loved any school I went to, but I did love GDS. The teachers were inspiring, I had great friends (who, incidentally, have grown into unbelievably interesting people). I'll add that I started in 1st grade and did not love it until 4th grade - I had a hard transition and it took a few years to make friends.

Re the kids love it.

I think that this is a lie upper middle class parents tell themselves.

Anonymous wrote:I just ran into a friend with a kid in 12th and he said while his kid loves it, between APs and college apps the pressure is unbelievable. His kid rarely gets enough sleep and has no time for anything else. On the bright side they have pegged this kid for early admission to an Ivy .

I really don't think this is a GDS issue. This is a top-tier (private OR public) issue. There is no more work associated with AP physics at GDS vs. Sidwell vs. Whitman. I think the takeaway here is that the kids loves it. That's the best you can hope for. And the kid learning how to manage pressure in the relatively secure environment of high school is very valuable.

I just ran into a friend with a kid in 12th and he said while his kid loves it, between APs and college apps the pressure is unbelievable. His kid rarely gets enough sleep and has no time for anything else. On the bright side they have pegged this kid for early admission to an Ivy .

Yes, 9th grade is an easy year -- noticeably less work than GDS's 8th grade. For some kids (often depending on math and language placement), 10th is much more time-consuming. By 11th, the workload pressure seems universal. Haven't experienced 12th yet.

Parent of a new GDS freshman here. This exchange about too much work for the students doesn't quite match our experience. DC has jumped right in without a whole lot of drama at all. The workload is very managable and DC has plenty of time for extra-curriculars and community service. The day is long but DC generally completes homework at school and seldom has more than a little bit left in the evenings and weekends. We wondered if DC was coasting but DC says it is challenging and the grades have been excellent so far.

Anonymous wrote:I've never heard it put like that, but you put it well, and as another parent of a GDS HS student, I agree. It's a tough place for perfectionists.

Thanks -- I like your more succinct formulation!! What kills me is that I deliberately chose a school that didn't do grades/competition early on in an attempt to ward off perfectionism. Drastic miscalculation, LOL. I think that by the time I was an adolescent, familiarity with tests, scores, grades had already bred (a certain healthy level of) contempt.

I disagree that it's great preparation for college (and I'm a former college prof); I think it's overkill.

Then again, it probably depends on how you think about college. If the goal is to get through college with good grades and on to the professional school of your choice and a good job, then maybe it's good preparation. Certainly a kid who gets good grades at GDS will be able to do well at a academically-competitive college. (Of course that begs the question of whether, with a more sane/humane education in HS, the same kid would do just as well in college).

AFAICT, looking at DC's cohort, comparative stress levels are a function of the interplay of personality and environment -- not about who's most focused on college admissions. I think that the stress comes from workload pressure and seemingly limitless expectations, on top of fairly intense extracurricular commitments. (And I agree that the last of these three is probably not that different from other local HS serving similar demographics.) For lifers, the relatively late introduction of grades may be another factor.

What I see is that, for a certain type of kid who is driven to be really good at everything s/he sets out to do, the stress can be tremendous. And so much of HS life consists of externally-imposed pressures that there's not much opportunity to develop one's own priorities -- unless you're willing to blow things off. So it's not a matter of what you want to devote extra time to -- it's a matter of what you can afford to care less about.

To me, this is a recipe for burn out. I think people (especially kids) need a certain amount of free time to explore and develop interests. For years, two successive headmasters have promised to have each HS teacher shadow a student for a week. Still hasn't happened, but I think it would be eye-opening.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:GDS is best for the kind of student who is a self-starter, who can find his/her own way through the material, and who can really get into a project and go above and beyond what is explicitly required and or do it his/her own way. A student who prefers a more "traditional" model of having the material presented by the teacher, along clear instructions about how to go about the work, isn't likely to be as happy there.

I would have (and, in fact, did) say that before HS. What I've learned is that (from about 8th grade on) GDS can be hellish for the above-and-beyond kid. When sky's the limit for many assignments and you have multiple interests/academic strengths, then it's an endless morass of work. I suppose you could say that it prepares kids for real life (but most real life I've seen doesn't look like that and, when it does, something's usually wrong). There's a soul-crushing element to it all and very little time for intellectual free play and exploration.

Now I'd say that GDS is best for the kind of kid who is willing to blow off things s/he doesn't care about. It's not just self-starting that's called for, but self-stopping. So maybe self-direction is a better characterization. And the fact that GDS is a good fit for your kid in L/MS isn't a sign that it's the right HS. FWIW, I'm not talking "success" here but what it costs in this kind of environment and how it shapes kids and their attitudes toward school.

I've never heard it put like that, but you put it well, and as another parent of a GDS HS student, I agree. It's a tough place for perfectionists.

No, GDS does not reward kids who blow off things. If they do, their grades will suffer as will their college options. But, it does expect high schoolers to learn to prioritize their time and understand the consequences of their choices. The general theory seems to be to give them as much independence and autonomy as they are ready to handle, knowing that their will be some slip ups. As a GDS parent, I see it as great preparation for college.

Yes, some students are really stressed out because they think their lives will be ruined if they don't get into their first choice college. But, most are driven because they want to do well and they want to be really good at their job - being students. I doubt that is terribly different than at any other private or public high school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:GDS is best for the kind of student who is a self-starter, who can find his/her own way through the material, and who can really get into a project and go above and beyond what is explicitly required and or do it his/her own way. A student who prefers a more "traditional" model of having the material presented by the teacher, along clear instructions about how to go about the work, isn't likely to be as happy there.

I would have (and, in fact, did) say that before HS. What I've learned is that (from about 8th grade on) GDS can be hellish for the above-and-beyond kid. When sky's the limit for many assignments and you have multiple interests/academic strengths, then it's an endless morass of work. I suppose you could say that it prepares kids for real life (but most real life I've seen doesn't look like that and, when it does, something's usually wrong). There's a soul-crushing element to it all and very little time for intellectual free play and exploration.

Now I'd say that GDS is best for the kind of kid who is willing to blow off things s/he doesn't care about. It's not just self-starting that's called for, but self-stopping. So maybe self-direction is a better characterization. And the fact that GDS is a good fit for your kid in L/MS isn't a sign that it's the right HS. FWIW, I'm not talking "success" here but what it costs in this kind of environment and how it shapes kids and their attitudes toward school.

This is so interesting. My DC has a number of friends at GDS and the ones who are not concerned about blowing things off really DO seem much happier and less stressed out at the school than the ones who really care about every subject. I am looking at it for my younger DC and I will really take what you say into consideration.

Question: for the ones who blow things off, or are able to pick and choose what they think is the important work to get done...s that reflected in their grades? Or does GDS actually reward the ability to pick and choose the most important work to complete?