Anonymous wrote:


Terrible, obnoxious advice. Imagine if DH had secret accounts somewhere and how you'd react.

It's risky, too. Hidden money disappears easily, or it shows up in a divorce or a bankruptcy and causes trouble.

Anonymous wrote:The above is true if it came to a divorce, yes. But what OP did, by putting that money away in an account only in her name, is protect herself from being destitute and unable to retain a good attorney in a divorce should her husband decide to leave her with nothing. She has an ATM she can hit. Because this was a joint mortgage, and her account was apparently at the same bank as the jointly held mortgage, her husband got away with this. I doubt it would have worked if her stash had been at another bank. And I doubt it would work with respect to anything other than the mortgage or, possibly, a jointly held credit card. It would not be legal for her husband, during the marriage, to just start writing checks from an account only in her name, and no utility company or other business would just access her funds on his say-so.

Personally, I don't have much problem with what OP did, and I am not a SAHM. The work she does at home is work which is worth money. It is not clear that her husband was allowing her access to marital funds, or to what extent. I didn't see any reference to their having a joint account. All of the money her husband brings in is marital. And so, over time, she skimmed bits of it from the budget, and put it away in her name -- just in case. Sure, it would be better if these two were more open and honest about their finances and had a joint account and everything was like a hallmark card. But it obviously isn't, so OP played the cards she had been dealt to the best of her ability. I don't share in everyone's condemnation of OP.

OP, my advice is to take your emergency account TO ANOTHER BANK. Do not tell him or anyone which one you choose. Or give it to a family member, a close friend -- anyone you absolutely trust. Or, buy a small, fire-proof safe deposit box, put the cash there, and hide it somewhere he would never look. No, it won't earn interest. But, using any of the above strategies, you won't be forced to make any more mortgage payments, either.

What is up with people on DCUM. Why isn't anyone asking why this GAINFULLY EMPLOYED MAN couldn't pay the mortgage? Isn't that part of the deal? She works at home, keeps it clean, takes care of the kids, puts dinner on the table. He pays the mortgage.

Stop dumping on OP.

Terrible, obnoxious advice. Imagine if DH had secret accounts somewhere and how you'd react.

17:37 here. And, of course, a wife's name should be on the deed to their house and on the mortgage. Same thing with cars, car loans, and credit cards.

All that protects you much better than a secret stash of cash.

I do worry much more about our savings than does DH, so I went back to work sooner than I really wanted to. Even though I loved being an SAHM, my earnings gave us both more security and freedom.

Anonymous wrote:

OR, again, he MAN's up -- tells his wife that they cannot afford for her to stay at home.

NO. Why does he have to tell her that they can't afford for her to stay at home. Can't she handle elementary arithmetic? Husband and wife are equally responsible for their mortgage, their car repairs, and their dental work.

Anonymous wrote:OP here, it is a true story. I opened my bank account statement and saw $2800 taken out to our mortgage company. He didn't even ask me. He just did it! I am so mad! He asked whether he would pay the mortgage late or pay for my car! It has always been like this, him making me choose between things - once it was a car vs. dental work. Why should I have to choose between things I need.

Time for a reality check for you. When you live on a tight budget, you have to make choices. Should he have missed the mortgage payment, failed to pay for your car repairs, or eliminated some other household expense to avoid dipping into your fund?

You’ve used logic, reason, ultimatums, bargaining and begging to no avail. Your wife still won’t go back to work even though the kids are in school full-time. You may ask yourself why she spent time and money on an education only to disempower herself by becoming financially dependent upon you. It’s a valid question.

Being at home for the kids after school, shuttle services and taking care of you are plausible excuses, but they are excuses and flimsy ones at that. Let’s be honest, has your wife achieved Donna Reed status or does she complain about the menial aspects of housekeeping, cooking, laundry and driving the kids everywhere? Do you eat a lot of takeout food and pre-prepared meals?

So What’s the Deal?

Many women still harbor the childish wish to be taken care of. The wish to be taken care of is natural, we’ve all had it at one time or another. Usually when we’re scared, sick or uncertain of the future. Then reality kicks in and we remind ourselves that we’re adults and take care of business.

By voluntarily giving up her career and making herself dependent, she’s infantilized herself and placed an unfair burden on you. Also, if you have a daughter(s), what kind of role model is she setting? Why should you encourage your daughter to go to college much less save for tuition when mom doesn’t use her degree(s)? Your wife is another dependent, just like your children.

Except that your wife isn’t a child. She’s an adult who refuses to grow up in this respect. Women with a modicum of intelligence aren’t happy in this role. They’re stuck; trapped between an insistent, unrealistic wish to be taken care of, the desire to be recognized as an equal and their fear of being an independent adult.

Your wife’s wish to be taken care of and dependency on you will eventually breed resentment and anger in both of you. She’s angry and resentful about needing you and you’re angry and resentful because you’re shouldering the burden and she’s mad at you because of it. Crazy, isn’t it? This is called hostile dependency. Why does this happen? Because no matter how powerful her childish wish for security is, SHE IS AN ADULT, which creates an unconscious conflict within her.

Shrinkwrapped explains, “These people are unaware of their dependency needs and often will loudly proclaim how independent they are; at the same time, their behavior reveals their need for a parental relationship with others who are emotionally important to them.” Developmentally, they’re adolescents and “resent their dependency on their parents who embarrass them, often disgust them, and constantly fail them by virtue of their shortcomings as human beings. Adolescents have a number of developmental tasks to perform before entering a psychologically healthy young adulthood. They must give up… the feeling that all options are open to them; they can no longer hold the fantasy that they can grow up to be whatever they want.”

“One must give up the passive wishes to be taken care of and nurtured. To be independent is hard work and facing true independence (not the pseudo-independence of the child who screams “I don’t need anything from you” right before they storm out of your house and drive to their friend in the car you pay for) is frightening. The comfort of knowing someone will always be there to take care of you and make everything all right is not easily given up; and once given up, the knowledge that there is no one standing between you and the dangers in the night is potentially terrifying. . . Furthermore, because these people are responding to conflicted, unconscious dependency needs, it is literally impossible to satisfy them.”

Your wife wants to be taken care of, but wants to be recognized as your equal. Here’s the problem: A child cannot be an equal partner to an adult. An equal relationship requires that both partners be whole, with their own fully developed identities. If she wants to be seen as an equal, she needs to be an independent adult in every sense of the word. You can’t be truly independent when you’re taking care of yourself on someone else’s dime. Children get allowances for doing chores, so they can go to the mall; adults earn paychecks to support themselves.

Why It’s Important for Your Wife to Work

She’ll build her self-confidence and feel better about herself, which is sexy.
It will foster independence.
She’ll be more interesting to you and others.
She won’t just be paying lip service when teaching the kids about the importance of an education and hard work.
She’ll ease your financial burden, which will reduce your stress, which will make your time together more enjoyable.
Standing on your own two feet is scary, but it’s a developmental necessity. It’s part of being an adult and an equal partner. I hope for your sake and hers, she can do the psychological work and go to work.

by Dr Tara J. Palmatier, PsyD

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't sound like it. She said she skimmed over several years. He's been paying the mortgage fine. All of a sudden -- now -- he cannot afford the mortgage? Who, exactly, is the loser here?

And I agree with OP and a handful of others. There is no "my car" and "his car". There are two family cars. And, as the GAINFULLY EMPLOYED MAN of the house, he is responsible for repairing BOTH OF THEM. He should not be asking her to choose between a car repair and DENTAL WORK. It is his obligation to pay for BOTH. These are not luxuries -- these are necessities. If OP and her H were arguing as to how much money should be budgeted for clothes, shopping, and personal grooming, there would be some room for debate as to how much he should pay for (though he should also pay for some of that).

Again, I am not a SAHM. But this man agreed to his wife staying home. Until I hear otherwise, I am going to assume that she is doing the job of a SAHM: laundry, cleaning, kid stuff, grocery shopping, meals on the table. Basically, she takes care of the home and manages the household. This is work, for which she is entitled to compensation. Her husband is not giving her access to marital funds. Instead, he's giving her money from which to pay certain household expenses. That his number one "BAD". His second bad, is that, having the benefit of a wife who works in the home, he did not hold up his end of the deal -- which is to pay the household expenses. Most especially the mortgage. This is not a MAN.

A MAN either MANs up, and takes the responsibilities that come with the benefits of working outside the home (getting away from it all, getting to socialize, going out for lunches and happy hours, maintaining and expanding upon skills that continue to make him marketable) -- and this includes paying the mortgage -- OR, again, he MAN's up -- tells his wife that they cannot afford for her to stay at home. Gives her some time to transition to the job market, and then DOES HIS SHARE OF THE HOUSEWORK.

My analysis remains the same irrespective of which member of the family is working outside or within the home.

This man wants to have his cake and eat it. No, he's worse than that. He wants to pay for the cake via his wife's routing number behind her back and eat it.

How about all the stress? And the PP makes some pretty bold assumptions about what kind of job DH holds. Maybe he's a blue collar working stiff who does not do happy hours. And if you see going to work every day as "getting away from it all,
" then please hire me on where you work. Going to work every day is not like spending it at the day spa.

This man faces the stress every day ogbgoingbto work and then figuring out every month where snd how the money he earns is spent to support the family. That is pretty f**king stressful. I would say more so than doing the laundry, etc. the laundry doesn't get done the clothes aren't clean. DH doesn't go to work. Then the family starves. Ummmm, no comparison in my book.

Should these two be on the same page. Obviously, yes! But OP seems to live in some alternate bizarro world where everything is hers, including his. Isn't her name on the mortgage too?

Doesn't sound like it. She said she skimmed over several years. He's been paying the mortgage fine. All of a sudden -- now -- he cannot afford the mortgage? Who, exactly, is the loser here?

And I agree with OP and a handful of others. There is no "my car" and "his car". There are two family cars. And, as the GAINFULLY EMPLOYED MAN of the house, he is responsible for repairing BOTH OF THEM. He should not be asking her to choose between a car repair and DENTAL WORK. It is his obligation to pay for BOTH. These are not luxuries -- these are necessities. If OP and her H were arguing as to how much money should be budgeted for clothes, shopping, and personal grooming, there would be some room for debate as to how much he should pay for (though he should also pay for some of that).

Again, I am not a SAHM. But this man agreed to his wife staying home. Until I hear otherwise, I am going to assume that she is doing the job of a SAHM: laundry, cleaning, kid stuff, grocery shopping, meals on the table. Basically, she takes care of the home and manages the household. This is work, for which she is entitled to compensation. Her husband is not giving her access to marital funds. Instead, he's giving her money from which to pay certain household expenses. That his number one "BAD". His second bad, is that, having the benefit of a wife who works in the home, he did not hold up his end of the deal -- which is to pay the household expenses. Most especially the mortgage. This is not a MAN.

A MAN either MANs up, and takes the responsibilities that come with the benefits of working outside the home (getting away from it all, getting to socialize, going out for lunches and happy hours, maintaining and expanding upon skills that continue to make him marketable) -- and this includes paying the mortgage -- OR, again, he MAN's up -- tells his wife that they cannot afford for her to stay at home. Gives her some time to transition to the job market, and then DOES HIS SHARE OF THE HOUSEWORK.

My analysis remains the same irrespective of which member of the family is working outside or within the home.

This man wants to have his cake and eat it. No, he's worse than that. He wants to pay for the cake via his wife's routing number behind her back and eat it.

Anonymous wrote:The above is true if it came to a divorce, yes. But what OP did, by putting that money away in an account only in her name, is protect herself from being destitute and unable to retain a good attorney in a divorce should her husband decide to leave her with nothing. She has an ATM she can hit. Because this was a joint mortgage, and her account was apparently at the same bank as the jointly held mortgage, her husband got away with this. I doubt it would have worked if her stash had been at another bank. And I doubt it would work with respect to anything other than the mortgage or, possibly, a jointly held credit card. It would not be legal for her husband, during the marriage, to just start writing checks from an account only in her name, and no utility company or other business would just access her funds on his say-so.

Personally, I don't have much problem with what OP did, and I am not a SAHM. The work she does at home is work which is worth money. It is not clear that her husband was allowing her access to marital funds, or to what extent. I didn't see any reference to their having a joint account. All of the money her husband brings in is marital. And so, over time, she skimmed bits of it from the budget, and put it away in her name -- just in case. Sure, it would be better if these two were more open and honest about their finances and had a joint account and everything was like a hallmark card. But it obviously isn't, so OP played the cards she had been dealt to the best of her ability. I don't share in everyone's condemnation of OP.

OP, my advice is to take your emergency account TO ANOTHER BANK. Do not tell him or anyone which one you choose. Or give it to a family member, a close friend -- anyone you absolutely trust. Or, buy a small, fire-proof safe deposit box, put the cash there, and hide it somewhere he would never look. No, it won't earn interest. But, using any of the above strategies, you won't be forced to make any more mortgage payments, either.

What is up with people on DCUM. Why isn't anyone asking why this GAINFULLY EMPLOYED MAN couldn't pay the mortgage? Isn't that part of the deal? She works at home, keeps it clean, takes care of the kids, puts dinner on the table. He pays the mortgage.

Stop dumping on OP.

maybe it's because his wife has been squirreling away money behind his back, thereby depleting the account he planned to use to pay the mortgage?

The above is true if it came to a divorce, yes. But what OP did, by putting that money away in an account only in her name, is protect herself from being destitute and unable to retain a good attorney in a divorce should her husband decide to leave her with nothing. She has an ATM she can hit. Because this was a joint mortgage, and her account was apparently at the same bank as the jointly held mortgage, her husband got away with this. I doubt it would have worked if her stash had been at another bank. And I doubt it would work with respect to anything other than the mortgage or, possibly, a jointly held credit card. It would not be legal for her husband, during the marriage, to just start writing checks from an account only in her name, and no utility company or other business would just access her funds on his say-so.

Personally, I don't have much problem with what OP did, and I am not a SAHM. The work she does at home is work which is worth money. It is not clear that her husband was allowing her access to marital funds, or to what extent. I didn't see any reference to their having a joint account. All of the money her husband brings in is marital. And so, over time, she skimmed bits of it from the budget, and put it away in her name -- just in case. Sure, it would be better if these two were more open and honest about their finances and had a joint account and everything was like a hallmark card. But it obviously isn't, so OP played the cards she had been dealt to the best of her ability. I don't share in everyone's condemnation of OP.

OP, my advice is to take your emergency account TO ANOTHER BANK. Do not tell him or anyone which one you choose. Or give it to a family member, a close friend -- anyone you absolutely trust. Or, buy a small, fire-proof safe deposit box, put the cash there, and hide it somewhere he would never look. No, it won't earn interest. But, using any of the above strategies, you won't be forced to make any more mortgage payments, either.

What is up with people on DCUM. Why isn't anyone asking why this GAINFULLY EMPLOYED MAN couldn't pay the mortgage? Isn't that part of the deal? She works at home, keeps it clean, takes care of the kids, puts dinner on the table. He pays the mortgage.

Stop dumping on OP.

Anonymous wrote:If this is his household money you've been putting in an account, then it's a joint savings account. Sorry, honey.

+1. It is a surplus house money account, and DH just used it to pay for a house-related expense. Nothing inappropriate about it.

I do believe that all SAHMs should have a personal emergency account and an IRA funded from DHs income, but this needs to be discussed by the couple and funded separately from household expenses. If DH doesn't earn enough to fund household expenses, household savings, separate emergency accounts for each spouse, and IRAs for each spouse, then the OP can't afford to be a SAHM.

If he left her, and she ended up with nothing you all would be saying she should have stashed money away for herself.
OP I'd be pissed too!

OP. you need to rethink staying at home. It works only if husband and wife have confidence in each other, and you two obviously don't. Money you earn while you're married is still marital property, but if you are working you'll have a resume and references. Human capital, they call it sometimes.

S'cuse the typos. Feeling a bit heated. Oh that I had someone helping me out financially.

Lady, I have to tell you, as a divorced single mother who doesn't have any kind of a safety net I didn't make or graciously receive from my own side of the family (who are wonderful working class people who could barely spare it and whom I intend to return the favor), that your marriage is in trouble.

It's in trouble because you guys are not on the same page about household finance AT ALL.

You worry about being left without a dime? Welcome to my world. If you don't trust your husband to take care of you as family, get in the workforce. If you do trust him, trust that that funding went to the best interest of your family. Should he have told you? Yeah probably. BUt the fact taht you guys aren't talking abou tit means that I'm going to be giving you newly minted single mom advice on another forum someday.