^ Honors *precalc this year, not honors preface.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

This is just ridiculous. We know kids that got 1500+ PSAT in 10th grade with no prep except a practice test or two, and SAT 1600 or very close to it soon after. This is not a difficult test for public school kids with a functioning brain that have read classic literature and have mastered algebra, geometry, and trig by actually reading the textbooks. The verbal is basically a harder TOEFL test and math before calculus should be intuitive. So many kids 30 years ago would have crushed the current version of the test.

Go take the SAT. I’m serious. The questions and phrasing is bizarre. It’s nothing like when we took it. Reading classic literature does not correlate.

I’d also wager that almost all the kids getting over 750 on the math score have taken Calculus or prepped. My kid as I said never got the chance to take the PSAT so no idea whether there were Calculus questions.

My junior took the August SAT with very little prep (we considered cancelling because the summer went to sh!t and planned prep time got lost, but DC wanted to go ahead anyway). DC had Algebra II/Trig last year. Honors preface this year, but hadn’t started that at the time of the test. Prep consisted of doing the math review packet assigned as summer homework a few days before taking the SAT — so helped to brush up on last year’s concepts and wake up the brain after the summer, but that’s about it. Got a 780.

Admittedly, DC is a “math kid” but is not accelerated. On track for Calc BC as a senior. Hadn’t started precalc. Nearly aced the math section.

Complainers gonna complain, and of course some test dates have harder tests than others, but still.

From the college board …

The Math section focuses on the areas of math that play the biggest role in college and career success:
Algebra
Advanced Math
Problem-Solving and Data Analysis
Geometry and Trigonometry

No calculus. An average kid who is able to graduate high school, should be ready

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

This is just ridiculous. We know kids that got 1500+ PSAT in 10th grade with no prep except a practice test or two, and SAT 1600 or very close to it soon after. This is not a difficult test for public school kids with a functioning brain that have read classic literature and have mastered algebra, geometry, and trig by actually reading the textbooks. The verbal is basically a harder TOEFL test and math before calculus should be intuitive. So many kids 30 years ago would have crushed the current version of the test.

Go take the SAT. I’m serious. The questions and phrasing is bizarre. It’s nothing like when we took it. Reading classic literature does not correlate.

I’d also wager that almost all the kids getting over 750 on the math score have taken Calculus or prepped. My kid as I said never got the chance to take the PSAT so no idea whether there were Calculus questions.

Can you give an example of “bizarre phrasing”? I didn’t notice any when I was helping my kid prep.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

This is just ridiculous. We know kids that got 1500+ PSAT in 10th grade with no prep except a practice test or two, and SAT 1600 or very close to it soon after. This is not a difficult test for public school kids with a functioning brain that have read classic literature and have mastered algebra, geometry, and trig by actually reading the textbooks. The verbal is basically a harder TOEFL test and math before calculus should be intuitive. So many kids 30 years ago would have crushed the current version of the test.

Go take the SAT. I’m serious. The questions and phrasing is bizarre. It’s nothing like when we took it. Reading classic literature does not correlate.

I’d also wager that almost all the kids getting over 750 on the math score have taken Calculus or prepped. My kid as I said never got the chance to take the PSAT so no idea whether there were Calculus questions.

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

This is just ridiculous. We know kids that got 1500+ PSAT in 10th grade with no prep except a practice test or two, and SAT 1600 or very close to it soon after. This is not a difficult test for public school kids with a functioning brain that have read classic literature and have mastered algebra, geometry, and trig by actually reading the textbooks. The verbal is basically a harder TOEFL test and math before calculus should be intuitive. So many kids 30 years ago would have crushed the current version of the test.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

The SAT does not include calculus.

Yeah, my kid took it right after the AP Precalc exam and scored 800 math. You don’t need any calculus.

That said a lot of times when kids are accelerated they don’t learn foundational algebra skills until they need them in calculus. That’s probably what happened to the PP’s kid.

Anonymous wrote:The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

The SAT does not include calculus.

The SAT is a really bad test. It’s almost designed to support the SAT prep industry. My kid was sick when his school gave the PSAT junior year. There were no options to take it sophomore year or earlier in our area. He took the SAT instead later that year. Did OK at 1400 but scored very low in the verbal section. He did an online prep course and scored 1570 the next time. No super-score etc.

He mentioned that you have to learn the pattern of poorly constructed and poorly worded questions. He also mentioned that he was sure several math problems were Calculus based and wouldn’t have found them easy if he hadn’t just studied for the AP Calc BC exam.

We need a better test.

Anonymous wrote:I dont mind extra time, but they're supposed to be "exceptional needs" and when over 50% of the students are Harvard Westlake and Choate have exceptional needs and 4% of Brooklyn Tech kids have exceptional needs, we have a system wide issue.

Make the needs truly exceptional. Or, easier, make it untimed for all.

What is the source of this data?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wholeheartedly agree that kids should be able to get accommodations that they need. But it should be noted on the test that the student had an accommodation. There is a lot of data out there about how many wealthy families have gamed the system to get accommodations for their kids to get them extra time on standardized tests (and wealthy families are also much more likely to afford the evaluations that are required). If it was noted on the test that the student had an accommodation, this problem would pretty much disappear.

So punish the smart, hard-working kids because a few rich kids lie? Only the smart, ADHD kids benefit from the extra time anyway. A dumb rich kid isn't going to do any better with extra time than without. I'm sorry that your one-dimensional striving kid is jealous that a smart kid with ADHD got into a better school, but you sound like an idiot.

Woah, way to take it down and make this personal. Now I understand why people say this site is toxic. My kid is at an Ivy, but thank you for your kind thoughts. And no - it's not just the 'smart' kids who "benefit from extra time anyway". Time is a huge factor in these tests, particularly the ACT. If time wasn't a key element, then nobody would have a time restriction. So - given the designed constraint, the school should absolutely be made aware when the constraint is lifted. (I DO NOT agree with another poster who said there should be a medical explanation and link to the doctor). A simple denotation would work fine.

This discloses that the student has a disability. This is illegal and will never happen no matter how much you wish it so.

That is factually and legally incorrect. https://www.educationnext.org/disablingthesat/

"Historically, to comply with this requirement, the College Board and other testing companies have flagged results that were obtained under modified conditions such as extended time. This practice has long been considered legal under both case law and more than 25 years of guidance and rulings from the federal Office for Civil Rights. While the laws require reasonable accommodations for disabled individuals, they do not require fundamental alterations or the lowering of standards."

NP. College Board and ACT no longer flag results with accommodations. My understanding is that they stopped flagging around 2002 in response to a lawsuit.

"As of October 1, 2003, the Board will no longer note “Nonstandard Administration” on the scores of any students who take the SAT with extended time." https://www.educationnext.org/disablingthesat/