OP I find it very endearing that you don’t really know what majors your kid applied to. Not being sarcastic at all. Good job parenting a very reasonable and smart seeming kid who has (at least) three excellent college choices, without micromanaging their college process and decision.

Plenty of full pay kids in Georgia choose UGA for quality of life reasons- even those who have the stats/profile for ivies and SLAC.

Anonymous wrote:Life is too short to value prestige over happiness. No one on their deathbed laments, "wish I had picked a higher ranked college with the lower acceptance rate." Way more people regret not having been true to themselves vs. other people's expectations.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3377309/

You do realize attending elite/ivies IS being true to oneself for many students, right?
Mine both picked different ivies and are very glad they did. They picked for FIT. They finally feel as though they can be themselves, and new friends have stated similar sentiments. The high expectations of the peers drives them forward in their endeavors. They find it invigorating and freeing, as do the majority of their peers. They are continually astounded by the opportunities at every turn. No school is perfect but they have several friends (from HS) unhappy at UVA and W&L who did not get into top schools and feel as though they are not in the right-fit place. Most tried transferring to ivies or WAS and still did not make it in.

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Anonymous wrote:These three schools don’t have that much of a difference in prestige.

If your DC are going for engineering, the differences are more significant. Cornell probably has the best engineering program among the three, and a strong network in the industry.

Thank you but DC did not get into Cornell. It's Penn vs Columbia vs UVA. Penn and Columbia are (i think) data science programs within their SEAS and she would probably go into consulting/finance/business/tech/etc. She is not planning on majoring in straight engineering. I need to clarify this as I'm not sure exactly which majors go with which of her applications.

I am at a big econ/business consulting firm. Penn is at a completely different level for target schools for junior recruitment. UVA is a level down, but still a target school.

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Anonymous wrote:Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

Parent of two daughters who graduated from NOVA public high schools who attended UVA and who both rushed. Neither had any problem getting the bids that they wanted.

Assuming that OP’s daughter has half the personality and likeability that OP says she has, she will have no trouble rushing at UVA.

Your dds are probably at sororities with lots of other girls from their high schools. It’s a lot harder for oos girls.

Wrong. Both of my daughters’ sororities were full of OOS “girls” and not a single one of them were from their same high school. You really don’t know what you’re talking about.

I know oos girls who were very social who were shut out of the top tier sororities at UVA. Perhaps we just are coming at it from different perspectives, or your dd’s were willing to go beyond the “top” sororities (which I think is great, but many girls aren’t).

It would be a shame to chose UVA predominantly for its Greek life and not have it work out. I’ve seen this happen to girls at many southern schools.

Ha ha ha, now I get it. You are suggesting that it only it’s worth rushing if you can get into one of the so-called “top“ sororities, and you’re suggesting that OP‘s daughter can’t do that.

Do you really think that there aren’t social tiers at the Ivies? Are you really saying that OP’s daughter can’t make it socially at UVA being from out of state, but can just swoop into the top of the social scene/tier at Penn and Columbia? What a joke.

Ivies do not have the same "tiers" and social structure as UVA and other southern publics. Theyre completely different with more room for more variety of women socially, yet the ivies do carry an expectation that everyone go above and beyond: classes, clubs, research, outreach.... it is constant focus on the next step, though tbf that is no different than hopkins and stanford. That culture leads to the high success rate of graduates. Almost everyone is super-bright, quirky/nerdy kids are more accepted, academics are especially lauded, yet coasting is frowned upon. UVA is less intense academically, yet more intense socially (albeit not as tiered socially as SMU, Tulane, Auburn...)

Fit over prestige without a doubt. My kid chose Chapman over higher ranked schools.

I still think UVA is the right decision, but it sure as hell isn't because of what a worthless website like Niche is saying.

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Anonymous wrote:OP, what do you mean by social/quality of life? My penn seas DD picked it because of social fit and ability to continue music and be an engineer. She just finished freshman year with a 3.91. The two other top-12 she got accepted to had a similar feel but Penn edged them out with arts and collaboration among engineering evident at admitted days. UVA is very Greek-forward, fewer club spots for freshmen than penn, arts are not easy to do as an engineeri and not at all the quality of life she wanted.

I think by social I mean friendly, laid back kids, lots of parties, lots of hanging out on the lawn. And there is probably some element of wanting preppy and mainstream.
Greek forward is viewed as a positive to her. She is very smart but isn't a striver (if striver means pushing the envelope beyond what is asked) or an academic and she isn't quirky at all. No obscure interests or passions. Little career direction. She is very well-liked, very hard working, and a perfectionist. She has done very well at a challenging magnet school in highest rigor courses. But she is not entering college with passions about economics or philosophy or robotics or anything really.

Penn is known as the “social ivy”

Penn and Cornell are well known for student suicides. The head of mental health counseling switched jobs from Cornell to U Penn and committed suicide at U Penn while head of mental health counseling.

Princeton has far more suicides the last 5 years than either of those schools. Vanderbilt and Duke have had them in the past year. Heck NC State has had a lot too. Mental health is a problem everywheree.

Niche ratings:

UVA Academics A+, Professors A+, Athletics A+, Party Scene A+

Penn Academics A+, Professors A+, Athletics B+, Party Scene A+

Columbia Academics A+, Professors A+, Athletics B+, Party Scene A

We have a winner

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Anonymous wrote:Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

Parent of two daughters who graduated from NOVA public high schools who attended UVA and who both rushed. Neither had any problem getting the bids that they wanted.

Assuming that OP’s daughter has half the personality and likeability that OP says she has, she will have no trouble rushing at UVA.

Your dds are probably at sororities with lots of other girls from their high schools. It’s a lot harder for oos girls.

Wrong. Both of my daughters’ sororities were full of OOS “girls” and not a single one of them were from their same high school. You really don’t know what you’re talking about.

I know oos girls who were very social who were shut out of the top tier sororities at UVA. Perhaps we just are coming at it from different perspectives, or your dd’s were willing to go beyond the “top” sororities (which I think is great, but many girls aren’t).

It would be a shame to chose UVA predominantly for its Greek life and not have it work out. I’ve seen this happen to girls at many southern schools.

Ha ha ha, now I get it. You are suggesting that it only it’s worth rushing if you can get into one of the so-called “top“ sororities, and you’re suggesting that OP‘s daughter can’t do that.

Do you really think that there aren’t social tiers at the Ivies? Are you really saying that OP’s daughter can’t make it socially at UVA being from out of state, but can just swoop into the top of the social scene/tier at Penn and Columbia? What a joke.

Anonymous wrote:It would be a shame to chose UVA predominantly for its Greek life and not have it work out. I’ve seen this happen to girls at many southern schools.

OP said Greek forward is a plus, but my impression was that "fun mixed with strong academics" seemed to be the main factor.

Yes, my DC chose UMD over Michigan and Georgia Tech. No regrets.

Life is too short to value prestige over happiness. No one on their deathbed laments, "wish I had picked a higher ranked college with the lower acceptance rate." Way more people regret not having been true to themselves vs. other people's expectations.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3377309/

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just want to reiterate that UVA rush is going to be very competitive for an oos girl, and rush at Penn less so. I was rush director at my sorority decades ago and am shocked at how much rush is different than I experienced. At UVA, very superficial things that she has little control over, like the high school she attended, will matter (strong preference for private schools and feeder affluent public schools) as well as how much she fits a sorority’s type in terms the way she dresses and looks.

Parent of two daughters who graduated from NOVA public high schools who attended UVA and who both rushed. Neither had any problem getting the bids that they wanted.

Assuming that OP’s daughter has half the personality and likeability that OP says she has, she will have no trouble rushing at UVA.

Your dds are probably at sororities with lots of other girls from their high schools. It’s a lot harder for oos girls.

Wrong. Both of my daughters’ sororities were full of OOS “girls” and not a single one of them were from their same high school. You really don’t know what you’re talking about.

I know oos girls who were very social who were shut out of the top tier sororities at UVA. Perhaps we just are coming at it from different perspectives, or your dd’s were willing to go beyond the “top” sororities (which I think is great, but many girls aren’t).

It would be a shame to chose UVA predominantly for its Greek life and not have it work out. I’ve seen this happen to girls at many southern schools.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I actually really like UVA but it’s overvalued on this board. Penn and Columbia are going to offer significantly better resources and are more prestigious.

More? Maybe

Significantly more? Probably not.

I’d say significantly more.