Anonymous wrote:I think it’s going great, sorry you can’t comprehend the big picture.

This is the Trump brand. Never admit an error, mistake, misjudgment. His most ardent supporters will continue to claim that they support Trump even as they are evicted and fired and medical billed into bankruptcy. It's because their identity is so emeshed in their support of Trump. To have to admit they were wrong would cause a psychotic break.

Anonymous wrote:When the 2008 recession occurred (after some were hit by their mortgages defaulting) it was
-consumer spending down. Ok, we can all buy less
-businesses struggling because spending was down
-layoffs
-due to the layoffs, it was a downward spiral of less spending-business struggles-layoffs on repeat

When consumer spending does not bounce back, is not able to bounce back, there is an issue.

So far I see people spending less overall, but not that they are unable to spend. They just get less for more.

This is the only bright spot I see. Until business and layoffs happen. I know layoffs are occurring, but not to the 2008 extent.

When the 2008 recession occurred (after some were hit by their mortgages defaulting) it was
-consumer spending down. Ok, we can all buy less
-businesses struggling because spending was down
-layoffs
-due to the layoffs, it was a downward spiral of less spending-business struggles-layoffs on repeat

Anonymous wrote:I never liked Trump, but I also very much dislike the Democrats. It'd be too strong to say I was rooting for Trump or that I thought he'd to a good job, but I thought there was a *chance* he'd do a good job, and, for the sake of the country, I was really hoping he would. I didn't vote for him, but I also never seriously considered voting for Harris or Biden. I thought Trump's first term was at moments scary but overall pretty good.

With the wind-up, let me say: geez Louise this is going shittily.

You’re an idiot. It was obvious this would happen.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
+1 agree. I stated this before: Americans have no idea what it's like to live under a dictatorship. They don't know what that looks like, and so they don't see the insidiousness of this administration. They've also become used to buying cheap stuff, and lots of it . They think they deserve all of that. Most of the world don't live like that.

-Former R

One of the few things that’s going to get me through is knowing there are a lot of MAGA that are about to get an extremely painful education in how bad life is like in an autocratic hellhole. Maybe it will make them appreciate what we had. But more likely, they won’t survive long enough to reflect. Most people don’t have $400 for an emergency- where are they going to get an extra $100 for their monthly shopping once the credit cards are turned off?

America has its problems, but we still live better than the vast majority of the rest of the planet. There is a reason millions of people try to come here, legally and illegally.

I don't think you get it. We *lived* better than most before the trade war because, like I said, we had access to an abundant amount of cheap stuff due to.. that's right.. low tariffs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Americans who voted for Trump have long been coddled and that makes them stupid & gullible.

+1 agree. I stated this before: Americans have no idea what it's like to live under a dictatorship. They don't know what that looks like, and so they don't see the insidiousness of this administration. They've also become used to buying cheap stuff, and lots of it . They think they deserve all of that. Most of the world don't live like that.

-Former R


One of the few things that’s going to get me through is knowing there are a lot of MAGA that are about to get an extremely painful education in how bad life is like in an autocratic hellhole. Maybe it will make them appreciate what we had. But more likely, they won’t survive long enough to reflect. Most people don’t have $400 for an emergency- where are they going to get an extra $100 for their monthly shopping once the credit cards are turned off?


America has its problems, but we still live better than the vast majority of the rest of the planet. There is a reason millions of people try to come here, legally and illegally.

That's been changing and now is about to change dramatically. Losing the rule of law is the nail in the coffin. This is not a good place to come once Trump has all the judiciary in his pocket. It's happening. Corruption will rule.

+1 are you kidding, ^PP? People on visas are being deported; people coming to visit are being denied; countries have put up travel warnings to the US; scientists want to leave the US. It's becoming a terrible place to come to.

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Americans who voted for Trump have long been coddled and that makes them stupid & gullible.

+1 agree. I stated this before: Americans have no idea what it's like to live under a dictatorship. They don't know what that looks like, and so they don't see the insidiousness of this administration. They've also become used to buying cheap stuff, and lots of it . They think they deserve all of that. Most of the world don't live like that.

-Former R


One of the few things that’s going to get me through is knowing there are a lot of MAGA that are about to get an extremely painful education in how bad life is like in an autocratic hellhole. Maybe it will make them appreciate what we had. But more likely, they won’t survive long enough to reflect. Most people don’t have $400 for an emergency- where are they going to get an extra $100 for their monthly shopping once the credit cards are turned off?


America has its problems, but we still live better than the vast majority of the rest of the planet. There is a reason millions of people try to come here, legally and illegally.

That's been changing and now is about to change dramatically. Losing the rule of law is the nail in the coffin. This is not a good place to come once Trump has all the judiciary in his pocket. It's happening. Corruption will rule.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Americans who voted for Trump have long been coddled and that makes them stupid & gullible.

+1 agree. I stated this before: Americans have no idea what it's like to live under a dictatorship. They don't know what that looks like, and so they don't see the insidiousness of this administration. They've also become used to buying cheap stuff, and lots of it . They think they deserve all of that. Most of the world don't live like that.

-Former R

One of the few things that’s going to get me through is knowing there are a lot of MAGA that are about to get an extremely painful education in how bad life is like in an autocratic hellhole. Maybe it will make them appreciate what we had. But more likely, they won’t survive long enough to reflect. Most people don’t have $400 for an emergency- where are they going to get an extra $100 for their monthly shopping once the credit cards are turned off?

America has its problems, but we still live better than the vast majority of the rest of the planet. There is a reason millions of people try to come here, legally and illegally.

Well border crossings are significantly down. We are so hellbent on making America a fascist and inhospitable place to live that we’re willing to spiral into a technocracy just to keep the “poor brown people” away.

We are not going to be living better than many other first world countries. We’ll lose our cutting edge with scientific research all for the “dream” of manufacturing crap in the US that no one can afford anyway. While our billionaire overlords cut Medicaid, SS, and other social safety supports.

Yay, so much winning!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never liked Trump, but I also very much dislike the Democrats. It'd be too strong to say I was rooting for Trump or that I thought he'd to a good job, but I thought there was a *chance* he'd do a good job, and, for the sake of the country, I was really hoping he would. I didn't vote for him, but I also never seriously considered voting for Harris or Biden. I thought Trump's first term was at moments scary but overall pretty good.

With the wind-up, let me say: geez Louise this is going shittily.

Overall pretty good?
I don’t see how anyone could arrive at that conclusion. His first term was an embarrassment. He was impeached. He incited a riot on the Capital to prevent transition to new government.

History books will NOT speak positively about his first term.

OP, I’m curious what it was that finally led you to think this term is not going well.

OP here. I agree with you about Jan. 6; I considered that alone totally disqualifying. I was excluding that when I said his first term was pretty good. I get that that's sort of a huge thing to exclude, but I'm just doing it for sake of talking about the other stuff.

As for the rest, I thought the economy was a lot better than anyone would have assumed. (In fairness, some of that is attributable to the low expectations people had for him, not unreasonably.) I also gave him some credit for keeping us out of wars and foreign policy adventurism more generally. I thought his judicial picks were mainstream, serious people who seem respected. I also thought, in his own way, he was effective at revealing areas where our system was insufficiently democratically accountable, and I think it's a net benefit that people are now a little more clear-eyed about the role that consensus and orthodoxy in elite circles affects our national policy in ways that the average voter might feel uncomfortable with.

To be clear, I never liked the guy, and there are a million reasons I never would have voted for him-- his philandering, racism, and meanspiritedness among them.

But why exclude that? It bewilders me the number of people who were willing to look the other way.

It’s like people have lost their sense of basic principles.

You are only kinda right. America is good for your type A start up guy who loves $. Truly perfect country of opportunity and innovation.

For anyone who just wants to live their life in a balanced way it's hard. There's nothing to help a family, healthcare sucks and is only good with $, it's all about competition. If you've ever been to another country you'll find much more of a holistic living experience.

America is def great if you live in a poor, violent undeveloped country of course! But that's like comparing a C student to one that's always failing and in trouble. If you compare A to C student which would you really want? America is that C student when you consider all the intangibles that go to living. We have a lot of options but it's about money.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Americans who voted for Trump have long been coddled and that makes them stupid & gullible.

+1 agree. I stated this before: Americans have no idea what it's like to live under a dictatorship. They don't know what that looks like, and so they don't see the insidiousness of this administration. They've also become used to buying cheap stuff, and lots of it . They think they deserve all of that. Most of the world don't live like that.

-Former R

One of the few things that’s going to get me through is knowing there are a lot of MAGA that are about to get an extremely painful education in how bad life is like in an autocratic hellhole. Maybe it will make them appreciate what we had. But more likely, they won’t survive long enough to reflect. Most people don’t have $400 for an emergency- where are they going to get an extra $100 for their monthly shopping once the credit cards are turned off?

America has its problems, but we still live better than the vast majority of the rest of the planet. There is a reason millions of people try to come here, legally and illegally.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I’m genuinely curious. When he said this was what he would do, did you not believe him?

OP here. Sort of. A lot of this is stuff that I knew he'd find appealing, but the guy says a lot of stuff that isn't true-- mexico paying for it and all that. Plus, for all his faults, I did think that he was sort of correct in his complaint that he was constantly stymied in his first term by entrenched power structures that hated him and thought he was a joke. Tbh, I still think that. The fact that a huge share of the country called themselves the Resistance-- as though they were standing up to tanks in the streets of 1968 Prague-- was sort of absurd, and I thought it was revealing that so many members of our social elite were like "yeah, that's a reasonable thing to do."

This time though it seems different. It seems like he's able to do a lot more of the stuff he said he'd do. But he's also not doing some of the better stuff he said he would. So from my vantage point, a big vibe I got from his campaign was that he would be pragmatic and approach even some Dems to high-level positions (which he did, I guess) and avoid weapon using the justice system. The hardcore small-government shtick and the EOs though all seem like he's just out for blood.

What are the better stuff he said he would do and is not doing?
Which Dems has he appointed to high level positions?
You are really bad a reading people. Trump said clearly that he was coming for his 2nd term with vengeance. Now you are surprised he is just out for blood?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never liked Trump, but I also very much dislike the Democrats. It'd be too strong to say I was rooting for Trump or that I thought he'd to a good job, but I thought there was a *chance* he'd do a good job, and, for the sake of the country, I was really hoping he would. I didn't vote for him, but I also never seriously considered voting for Harris or Biden. I thought Trump's first term was at moments scary but overall pretty good.

With the wind-up, let me say: geez Louise this is going shittily.

You are missing the big picture. It’s bad for Wall Street. But this is going great if you are from Main Street.
No pain, no gain. Finally a president who is fighting for main street.
Manufacturing jobs will have to come back to the US. If these corporations don’t do it, they will keep watching their stock prices sinking.

and you believe this domestic manufacturing boom will manifest itself within what time frame?

It could take years. It’ll be painful but it will make us stronger. Our kids will thank us.
We have been through recessions before and came out stronger. Why are people so scared?

So there is truth that tariffs could bring more production back to the US. But is the pain with Trump's approach needed?

Imagine a world where instead of slapping on tariffs all at once (calculated by arbitrarily picking two numbers and dividing by 2), the President was thoughtful and decided what type of production would be best suited for our country (he could have used the investments under the last administration as a starting point, perhaps taking out the electric vehicles stuff if he doesn't like that sector fine, but domestic production of semiconductors certainly makes sense in our digital age). Then, once he made that decision, he could have opened imposed targeted tariffs on the countries we important those goods/components while simultaneously supporting the private sector through investments and/or lower regulatory burdens.

A more thoughtful approach would be more effective in bringing production back to the US without the market pain he is now imposing (remember, 60% of Americans have retirement savings invested in the stock market).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never liked Trump, but I also very much dislike the Democrats. It'd be too strong to say I was rooting for Trump or that I thought he'd to a good job, but I thought there was a *chance* he'd do a good job, and, for the sake of the country, I was really hoping he would. I didn't vote for him, but I also never seriously considered voting for Harris or Biden. I thought Trump's first term was at moments scary but overall pretty good.

With the wind-up, let me say: geez Louise this is going shittily.

Overall pretty good?
I don’t see how anyone could arrive at that conclusion. His first term was an embarrassment. He was impeached. He incited a riot on the Capital to prevent transition to new government.

History books will NOT speak positively about his first term.

OP, I’m curious what it was that finally led you to think this term is not going well.

OP here. I agree with you about Jan. 6; I considered that alone totally disqualifying. I was excluding that when I said his first term was pretty good. I get that that's sort of a huge thing to exclude, but I'm just doing it for sake of talking about the other stuff.

As for the rest, I thought the economy was a lot better than anyone would have assumed. (In fairness, some of that is attributable to the low expectations people had for him, not unreasonably.) I also gave him some credit for keeping us out of wars and foreign policy adventurism more generally. I thought his judicial picks were mainstream, serious people who seem respected. I also thought, in his own way, he was effective at revealing areas where our system was insufficiently democratically accountable, and I think it's a net benefit that people are now a little more clear-eyed about the role that consensus and orthodoxy in elite circles affects our national policy in ways that the average voter might feel uncomfortable with.

To be clear, I never liked the guy, and there are a million reasons I never would have voted for him-- his philandering, racism, and meanspiritedness among them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Americans who voted for Trump have long been coddled and that makes them stupid & gullible.

+1 agree. I stated this before: Americans have no idea what it's like to live under a dictatorship. They don't know what that looks like, and so they don't see the insidiousness of this administration. They've also become used to buying cheap stuff, and lots of it . They think they deserve all of that. Most of the world don't live like that.

-Former R

One of the few things that’s going to get me through is knowing there are a lot of MAGA that are about to get an extremely painful education in how bad life is like in an autocratic hellhole. Maybe it will make them appreciate what we had. But more likely, they won’t survive long enough to reflect. Most people don’t have $400 for an emergency- where are they going to get an extra $100 for their monthly shopping once the credit cards are turned off?